Give Joey Gallo a Chance

You're right.  I think most Twins fans will be pulling for him.  

I wonder if the main reason they signed him is as a backup in case AK can't go. A little worried after reports that he is still having pain, and will have to live with it and try to work through it.

Well said. Let's accept Gallo for what he is when he's on - a high strikeout power hitter who will have a good to great OPS because he walks a lot, good fielding OF, runs well. There's room for a guy like that on this team. Not hitting in the 2-5 holes, but 6 or 7. If the last year is what he is, then we cut bait. 

As a consistent Gallo detractor I will say he has to earn my trust.  Just putting on a uniform does not endure me to him.  Pagan still wears our uniform and I want to get rid of him.  Sorry but Gallo has an 8 year lifetime batting average of 199.  I cannot root for that. 

13 minutes ago, Karbo said:

I wonder if the main reason they signed him is as a backup in case AK can't go. A little worried after reports that he is still having pain, and will have to live with it and try to work through it.

I think it was possible that they considered him as an option to fill in at 1B to give AK a rest, but I have no doubt that the plan all along has been to play Gallo nearly every day and play him in the outfield often. I think that remains the plan, and even if AK goes down, I think they find a way to keep him out there as much as possible. His defense is just too valuable to not play him out there often. I definitely think Gallo plays games at 1B this season. We'll probably also see Miranda and possibly Kepler over there as well at times. There's enough defensive flexibility on this team for them to adjust to an injury should one arise. You are right though. Every time I hear about Kirilloff's wrist I cringe. I sure hope they can get it figured out sooner rather than later because when he's healthy, he is a phenomenal talent!

6 minutes ago, mikelink45 said:

As a consistent Gallo detractor I will say he has to earn my trust.  Just putting on a uniform does not endure me to him.  Pagan still wears our uniform and I want to get rid of him.  Sorry but Gallo has an 8 year lifetime batting average of 199.  I cannot root for that. 

Why is batting average the only stat that matters? As highlighted above, Joey Gallo will do a lot of good things for this baseball team. In 2021, Gallo contributed 4.2 WAR, which is just 0.2 WAR less than AL batting champion Luis Arraez had in 2022, all while hitting .199. His excellent plate approach, power, and defense will all help the Twins win in 2023. All I ask is that you give him a chance to at least play baseball before you decide you hate him.

My issue is that even if Gallo has success in his traditional ways, I don't believe that is an overall productive baseball player. Too many strikeouts and sub .200 BA does not play in my book. Maybe seeing Gallo consistently and successful will change my mind, though I doubt it.

Just now, theBOMisthebomb said:

My issue is that even if Gallo has success in his traditional ways, I don't believe that is an overall productive baseball player. Too many strikeouts and sub .200 BA does not play in my book. Maybe seeing Gallo consistently and successful will change my mind, though I doubt it.

Maybe you need to consider changing your book. Look at OPS and WAR instead of BA. Batting average just doesn't tell enough of the story. Joey Gallo is a good player capable of producing for the Twins, but you have to give the guy a chance and understand what he does well.

1 minute ago, Hunter McCall said:

Maybe you need to consider changing your book. Look at OPS and WAR instead of BA. Batting average just doesn't tell enough of the story. Joey Gallo is a good player capable of producing for the Twins, but you have to give the guy a chance and understand what he does well.

Save the lecture, I do consider those factors. Actually, I use wOBA and wRC+...

What counts the most are timely hits, not making outs, making contact to either score or advance runners without hitting into double plays, sac. flies, and of course there's going to be some HR's.

Think about it. A .200 BA means 20 hits per 100 AB's. A .250 BA means 25 hits per 100 AB;s. Will 5 hits make that much of a difference in 20 - 25 games played? Not if he can get timely hits, becomes a base runner by BB's & not make outs, & hits sac flies like mentioned above. He even knows how to bunt. He can hit the ball hard enough to reach base through errors. When a veteran is being paid that much money good things are bound to happen. Baseball is a team sport and I welcome Gallo smashing some timely homers and making some put outs.

Complain about 4 - 5 hits or less, give me a break! The guy is going to save some runs playing defense. And K's are better than hitting into double plays.  He probably knows how to run the bases like a pro should too.

Oops.

2 minutes ago, theBOMisthebomb said:

Save the lecture, I do consider those factors. Actually, I use wOBA and wRC+...

That's great then! In 2021, Joey Gallo had a wOBA of .354, and a wRC+ of 122. We can again compare these numbers to Luis Arraez's 2022 numbers since he was the batting average king. In 2022, Arraez had a wOBA of .350 and a wRC+ of 131. My point remains, consider changing the way you view players just because you don't like the way they provide production. All stats confirm that Gallo is capable of providing a large impact for a modest price. Not a lot to gripe about.

As fans, we really have no choice but to give the guy a chance. I have zero expectations for him and will be pleasantly surprised if he can hit above the Sano line.

My biggest complaint is just the absolute misery of watching a guy totally incapable of making contact for weeks at a time. I don't think anyone would say he has no value or even if he has a low average he can't provide at least starter level value over a season but like Sano man is it the worst feeling ever as a fan to have a runner on second or third with one out and see him come up and flail away.

5 minutes ago, dberthia said:

As fans, we really have no choice but to give the guy a chance. I have zero expectations for him and will be pleasantly surprised if he can hit above the Sano line.

As mentioned, Gallo's batting average will be very low. I could see it going up a bit with the banning of the shift, but try not to focus on the batting average. Try to focus on the power, productive at bats, and defense. Joey Gallo does a lot of stuff really well, one thing he has never done is hit for average. Don't expect that to change.

It the disappointing reports on AK are accurate, THEN later this year, I’d rather see Miranda at 1B once Lewis or Lee can take over 3B (or Correa moves to 3B while one of those players takes over SS).    Gallo looks like a place holder (at 1B or LF) unless he lights up Target Field.  I have somewhat low expectations for that but I’m willing to see 

2 minutes ago, danielp19653 said:

My biggest complaint is just the absolute misery of watching a guy totally incapable of making contact for weeks at a time. I don't think anyone would say he has no value or even if he has a low average he can't provide at least starter level value over a season but like Sano man is it the worst feeling ever as a fan to have a runner on second or third with one out and see him come up and flail away.

I hear you. As I mentioned, there will be an appalling number of strikeouts. It might be frustrating at times, but when the guy is good, he's among the best in the league. The amazing thing is, he contributes great numbers over the course of a full season all while batting .200. I will beg the question, was a Sano strikeout more or less infuriating than a Gio Urshela ground ball double play? Neither are ideal, but I grew to love Gio despite consistently ending rallies with his inning ending double plays. Just like with any player, you take the good with the bad, but the Twins got Gallo for a marginal price, so the low-risk, high-reward aspect makes it worth while imo.

11 minutes ago, Hunter McCall said:

That's great then! In 2021, Joey Gallo had a wOBA of .354, and a wRC+ of 122. We can again compare these numbers to Luis Arraez's 2022 numbers since he was the batting average king. In 2022, Arraez had a wOBA of .350 and a wRC+ of 131. My point remains, consider changing the way you view players just because you don't like the way they provide production. All stats confirm that Gallo is capable of providing a large impact for a modest price. Not a lot to gripe about.

I don't enjoy that many strikeouts and that low of a BA. Gallo is an extreme case that I don't support, which is my right. I don't need to change the way I view players, thanks for the condescending advice though. Geez, I said in my original post that maybe I'll change my mind on Gallo after seeing him consistently. I understand the theory that Gallo is a productive player. I don't entirely agree with that logic and would have preferred the Twins not have him on the roster. I realize that Gallo could find his swing and destroy that right field wall in Target Field and crush 40 HRs. I hope it happens and I misjudged Gallo. I'd still pass on that many strikeouts and low BA long term and on multiple players. I don't believe a lineup full of Joey Gallo at the plate is a winning team while 9 Luis Arrarez clones at the plate is a winning team.   

53 minutes ago, mikelink45 said:

Sorry but Gallo has an 8 year lifetime batting average of 199.  I cannot root for that. 

Well I think I can. I rooted for Tim Laudner, and I don't remember him hitting above .190. Lots of ways to contribute, and these Twins could use some power.

3 minutes ago, Hunter McCall said:

 I will beg the question, was a Sano strikeout more or less infuriating than a Gio Urshela ground ball double play? 

I agree at the end of the day it plays out the same or worse most times the ball is in play, not like anyone has an .800 average on balls in play, but I think the biggest part is that subconscious hope as someone just watching the game. When Arraez came up with someone out on second you have the part of you that can't imagine anything other than a poke into the grass for a run, and alternatively when Sano or Gallo comes up that it'll be another strike out or lazy fly ball 250' from home. Like I said overall I think he probably ends the season as a worthwhile pick up for the price. Just makes watching games less entertaining, something I think baseball as a whole is struggling with as pitchers improve and the guys who play to the three true outcome side become more common. You expect less and less to happen each at bat when guys like him come up. You expect the strike out instead of a ball in play that could be an error or find space.

Never particularly liked the guy as a player, and I don't think signing him was necessarily a smart move, but if he can put 40 balls over the RF overhang and drive in 90+...well, I guess I can live with that and the low .200's avg. 

4 minutes ago, theBOMisthebomb said:

I don't enjoy that many strikeouts and that low of a BA. Gallo is an extreme case that I don't support, which is my right. I don't need to change the way I view players, thanks for the condescending advice though. Geez, I said in my original post that maybe I'll change my mind on Gallo after seeing him consistently. I understand the theory that Gallo is a productive player. I don't entirely agree with that logic and would have preferred the Twins not have him on the roster. I realize that Gallo could find his swing and destroy that right field wall in Target Field and crush 40 HRs. I hope it happens and I misjudged Gallo. I'd still pass on that many strikeouts and low BA long term and on multiple players. I don't believe a lineup full of Joey Gallo at the plate is a winning team while 9 Luis Arrarez clones at the plate is a winning team.   

Not trying to be condescending, for that I apologize. I just don't agree with criticizing him before he even plays a game for the team. My point throughout the article remains, there are many ways to contribute to success besides batting average and a low strikeout rate.

2 minutes ago, danielp19653 said:

I agree at the end of the day it plays out the same or worse most times the ball is in play, not like anyone has an .800 average on balls in play, but I think the biggest part is that subconscious hope as someone just watching the game. When Arraez came up with someone out on second you have the part of you that can't imagine anything other than a poke into the grass for a run, and alternatively when Sano or Gallo comes up that it'll be another strike out or lazy fly ball 250' from home. Like I said overall I think he probably ends the season as a worthwhile pick up for the price. Just makes watching games less entertaining, something I think baseball as a whole is struggling with as pitchers improve and the guys who play to the three true outcome side become more common. You expect less and less to happen each at bat when guys like him come up. You expect the strike out instead of a ball in play that could be an error or find space.

I hear you. I'm just hoping we also get to witness 40 home runs, and plenty of game saving plays by him to make up for his flaws! Like I said, if he's terrible, the Twins have the depth to replace him.

Correa is the only guy on the team who we can reasonably assume will  hit .250 or more. This team will struggle to score 3 or more runs per game on a consistent basis. The 15-20 hrs Gallo hits will not win many games if they are part of those 1-3 runs/game. 

The skills he brings are completely redundant with an OF that already has 3 gold glove caliber players and Larnach who looks as though he might potentially be GG quality. If the team is lucky, they can expect any number of the players to hit 15-20 hrs... Buxton, Kirillof, Miranda, C4, etc.. I think the team needs more players that can be on base when the HRs are hit, and more players that can move the line forward and allow HR hitters more opportunities to hit. 

Nothing against Gallo. He'd be a useful cog on a team that needed a good defending outfielder and someone who could hit a HR once in awhile. Twins don't need one of those. Pardon the dead horse, but they need a couple of people who are a bit more like Arraez to round out the team. 

Thanks for the article Hunter.  I am an older fan who has a hard time overlooking batting average and RBI's to measure player performance.  I am trying though to learn some of these metrics and how they are a better measurement of a ball player's value.

I absolutely hated the trade when it occurred because I watched him some during the season and the playoffs and he seemed to strike out a lot, many times in critical situations during the game.  That is what I hated about Sano.  It sucks the life out of us fans and I suspect some teammates also.

That said, and after reading several TD articles/posts on him, I will definitely give him the benefit of the doubt this season in the hope that he does in fact bring value to the club.  We'll see.

1 minute ago, Bigfork Twins Guy said:

Thanks for the article Hunter.  I am an older fan who has a hard time overlooking batting average and RBI's to measure player performance.  I am trying though to learn some of these metrics and how they are a better measurement of a ball player's value.

I absolutely hated the trade when it occurred because I watched him some during the season and the playoffs and he seemed to strike out a lot, many times in critical situations during the game.  That is what I hated about Sano.  It sucks the life out of us fans and I suspect some teammates also.

That said, and after reading several TD articles/posts on him, I will definitely give him the benefit of the doubt this season in the hope that he does in fact bring value to the club.  We'll see.

I really appreciate it! I'm glad I could have a positive impact on the way you perceive the game! There are many ways a player can bring value to a team. If you are trying to learn more about the advanced stats, Fangraphs offers a ton of different analytical stats and a quick description to what all of them mean. My favorite page to view is BaseballSavant. It's very easy to view and understand. This is the page that Carlos Correa eluded to a few times in interviews throughout the season. I encourage you to check them out if you're interested!

Thanks again for the comment!

1 hour ago, Hunter McCall said:

Why is batting average the only stat that matters? As highlighted above, Joey Gallo will do a lot of good things for this baseball team. In 2021, Gallo contributed 4.2 WAR, which is just 0.2 WAR less than AL batting champion Luis Arraez had in 2022, all while hitting .199. His excellent plate approach, power, and defense will all help the Twins win in 2023. All I ask is that you give him a chance to at least play baseball before you decide you hate him.

I do not think I will be able to explain this so that you will accept my feelings.  I do think BA means something, hits do more than walks.  They lead to movement on the basepaths, advancing the runners, sometimes errors, sometimes bad judgment.  A walk like a strike out is a static event.  Boring.  If you do not accept this perspective I understand - new age analytics has its own perspective and it is not mine. 

50 minutes ago, LastOnePicked said:

Well I think I can. I rooted for Tim Laudner, and I don't remember him hitting above .190. Lots of ways to contribute, and these Twins could use some power.

Okay - we will differ.  I just addressed another person who disagrees with me.  That is fine, but home run derby, and the boring K and BB events do not make Baseball for me.  Move the runner, advance runners, challenge the defense.  And I am sure Joey will have a lot of fans - just listen for the soft booing you might hear in the distance. 

We don't have to worry about giving Joey Gallo a chance. The Twins are paying him $11 million to play and he will be in the lineup most of the time (if healthy) for at least 2 to 3 months. If he cannot hit with anyone on base and is carrying a .160 batting average after 200 at bats, let's hope he is released. I too am hoping for Gallo to have a career year but his bat is often empty when there are runners on base and a weak fly ball or ground ball to advance a runner is often what is needed with less than two outs. Gallo has been at his best with the bases empty (1374 AB) or nobody on base (602 AB). He has done well man on 3rd and less than two outs (112 AB), but has cratered withe bases loaded (only 54 AB) and with RISP and two outs (251 AB). Joey Gallo is a similar gamble on production in some ways (hoping for the best) to pitchers like Bundy and Archer. We should wish Gallo the best, while also hoping that the Twins have an eye on the production.