Should the Twins Deal from Their Rotation Depth?

[DocBauer]

I'm going to clearly admit that I'm completely TORN about trading ANY pitching for 2026 based on THREE very simple reasons:

1] Finding top of the rotation SP is about the hardest thing to do. Pre 2025 hip injury to Ober, he has been in that category. He's 30yo? PLEASE! SO many SP are just at their peak around 30yo when stuff and experience take hold. You just can't discount his hip being a factor in 2025. Regarding an injury "history"? That was when he was a MILB prospect who's mechanics were weird. That was fixed. That's why he became a viable playoff caliber SP before his recent hip injury.

2] I still have doubts about SWR's ceiling. This kid has endured more trama than most prospects usually go through from early promotion, to losing at LEAST another half of development from making an Olympic team and NOT throwing, to a rework of his motion, to battling an intestinal issue in 2025 that seemed to rob him of the development he made in 2024. Despite it all, and no pun intended, I saw the "guts" this kid showed late in '24 before tiring. And I saw an even better pitcher late in '25 when he seemed to come to grips with his splitter. I'm not sure about his ceiling yet, but he's shown glimpses of being better than a #4 potentially. 

3] While a healthy Festa has really flashed, he's destined as a top RP option. I think most of us can agree with that. And that's not a bad thing, even if it's a bit disappointing. Matthews has the build, the stuff, and the high K rate to indicate a little more polish, he might be pretty damn good. Abel has as good or better stuff and also needs a little more harnessing of his talent. Bradley is even younger, despite is ML experience, with as good of stuff. But he's also digressed somewhat. Can the Twins staff turn him around? Morris is being dismissed by too many based on accidentally tipping his pitches early in 2025, and ending the season on a great note following a brief IL stint. And the Twins believe LH Rojas...pushed through the system the way SWR was...has top 100 prospect potential at the end of 2026.

BUT, do the Twins believe SWR, Matthews, Abel, and Morris are about ready to take that next step?

So THAT is my concern. Any maybe I'm being too reserved in my opinion of the SP options on hand. Which isn't really like me, LOL. I'm always the optimist. But I'm also a realist.

I'm a believer in Ober being his normal, quality, #3 SP who throws like a #2 some days. I love Ryan, but I also understand he doesn't always finish the season as strong as you'd like.

So my ANSWER to the OP is, somewhat regrettable, trade ONE of Ryan, Ober, or SWR if you have enough faith in those talented arms on hand to replace what you lost. 

Honestly, the potential is there to make a trade. That's true. It's not what I WANT currently, because I REALLY want the TOP prospects to force their hand in the OF, the INF, the PEN and even the SP staff, and make mid season trades all the more viable. 

And it causes me some pain to say this, but considering talent on hand, and the prospects about to debut, IF a trade of a SP would be made, I wouldn't object to the next Mourneau. I don't know who that might be. And it's a high ceiling to cover.  And said prospect/player might not be as good. But if he's even close, that would be a solid trade. 

Otherwise, I'd run with all the talent on board, promote within, work on the talent on board, and consider trades mid season.

TOP talent SP options are valuable. I get it. But the return should also be very valuable. 

 

[old nurse]

1 hour ago, mikelink45 said:

Did I saw exciting or are you projecting.  I just said we have not had any action and many of the others have.

I am sorry., Bo you did not say exciting. I y was the only word that I could think of when somebody wishes their team was drafting more minor league rule 5 players that would clog the upper minors leagues, sign many, minor league players with an invite that was not a negative word. 

[old nurse]

3 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

Exactly!

Bored & looking at other Team’s Minor League transactions is no way to gauge any sort of future success. It’s just a way to twist other Team’s busy work into a rationalized way to bitch about the FO in Mpls. Senseless, IMO.

The Twin’s Minor League system is ranked in Top 5, I believe? Last deadline the Team made moves that got them the highest rated Catcher in MiLB - Abel - Bradley - Rojas & 3-4 outfielders that may or may not turn out to be anything, etc. Plenty of activity with players that are much closer to benefitting the Club. These moves seem much more worth our time, IMO.

Watching other Divisional rivals MiLB moves is like listening to the police scanner.

165 players total players on the domestic reserve list, you can’t hoard them. The rule v minor league pickups have to be in the high minors due to playing time restrictions in the low minors. You can’t stash them. There are like 13-14 pitchers that they have to determine if they are big league pitchers. There really isn’t much more they can do in the minors.  Adding more on clogs the flow.  The type of pitcher being signed now to the invite list know they aren’t getting a major league contract.  They are a lottery ticket. Unfortunately they are pick 3 prize, 

[jorgenswest]

6 hours ago, JADBP said:

Y ah but Ryan is unhappy.  I don’t see him signing an extension with the Twins.  Even at $120 mill

For a few years I kept hearing on this site that Buxton was unhappy though I don’t think there was ever a direct quote from him that he wanted out. I don’t think we have that from Ryan either. I saw quotes related to Gray and the decision to right size payroll. I don’t see unhappiness in those comments. He simply spoke the truth.

[Doc Lenz]

Few thought Tigers/Cleveland would be at the top of the division last year. Same with Royals two years ago. You never know and with a new field general and fresh outlook it could be us.

[Riverbrian]

10 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

I too have noticed the moves the Cardinals have been making and have to agree their direction is much clearer than the Twins.  They have failed to make an aggressive move when they have a real shot and now they are failing to be aggressive when they have almost no shot.  I say almost because there is always the very slight chance that everything goes right.  

What I would like to know is if this is Falvey or is this ownership including the new partners placating fans by putting a 500 team on the field.  Is Falvey just trying to save his job because I can't believe he thinks adding some mediocre talent to a less than mediocre team is going to end in a playoff run.  

There is another conversation I'm in that produced the same assumptions as your 2nd paragraph. 

Logical assumptions to reason. Perhaps the only logical assumptions. 

Your first paragraph describes it perfectly. The front office has lost aggressiveness in any direction. 

I know that I tend to sit around the house more when money gets tight. 

[Doctor Wu]

20 hours ago, miller761 said:

What would SWR and Larnach get us back? Or Ober and Larnach?

Not much. Which is why I think trading Ryan is the only idea that makes any sense. He's the one pitcher that will bring back the most value. I'd rather keep Ober, SWR, Bradley, and company and see how they perform this coming season. But I don't think any of those other guys, other than Lopez of course, will bring us back anything of value in a trade. 

[NYCTK]

16 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

Joe Ryan would be crazy to turn down that extension. 

If your employer exhibited pure incompetence and then tried to get you to commit to staying longer, it's not at all crazy to wait until your contract expired and risked it, especially with the additional earning potential at the end of the deal. 

[NYCTK]

15 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

Whether they are big names or not, it is hard to sit back and watch other teams make signings.

We have signed the following since the season - correct me if there are more:

1. Josh Bell - Free Agent
2. Miquel Caraballo - a very young minor league catcher in a trade
3. Sam Ryan - Rule V
4. Garret Spain - Rule V
5. Grant Hartwig to minor league contract
6. Yehizon Sanchez to minor league contract
7. Alan Jackson on a trade
8. Eric Orze on a trade

Not a lot of recognizable names

Meanwhile the Tigers have signed the following:

1. Kyle Finnegan FA
2. Kenley Jansen FA
3.  Sean Guenther to a minor league contract.
4. Jack Little to a minor league contract.
5. Cole Waites to a minor league contract.
6. Drew Anderson. - FA
7. Enmanuel De Jesus to a minor league contract.
8. Inohan Paniagua to a minor league contract.
9.  Carlos Peña to a minor league contract.
10. Johan Simon. in a trade
11. Luke Taggart in the Rule 5 Draft
12. RJ Petit in the Rule 5 Draft. This through 18 are AAA rule V
13. Jan Caraballo in the Rule 5 Draft
14. John Stankiewicz in the Rule 5 Draft
15. Yendy Gomez in the Rule 5 Draft,
16.  Travis Kuhn in the Rule 5 Draft
17. Austin Murr in the Rule 5 Draft
18. Archer Brookman in the Rule 5 Draft
19. Tanner Rainey to a minor league contract
20. Gleyber Torres. FA
21. Dugan Darnell off waivers

A few recognizable names and lots of action hoping to hit it lucky

Kansas City

1. Matt Strahm in trade
2. Lane Thomas. FA
3.  Kevin Newman to a minor league contract.
4. LF Isaac Collins and RHP Nick Mears  in a trade
5. Andy Sanchez to a minor league contract.
6. Adrian Rumardo to a minor league contract.
7. Jose Cuas to a minor league contract.
8. Alex Lange. FA
9. Alberto Rodriguez to a minor league contract.
10. Chase Jessee to a minor league contract
11. Mason Black in a trade
12. Connor Kaiser to a minor league contract.
13. Kameron Misner trade

A few trades and signings.  No big news on this list, but they are trying various options

Cleveland Guardians

1. Codi Heuer to a minor league contract
2.  Shawn Armstrong. FA
3. Stuart Fairchild to a minor league contract
4. Justin Bruihl  in a trade
5. Colin Holderman. FA
6. Jack Carey in the Rule 5 Draft, AAA Phase.
7. Peyton Pallette in the Rule 5
8. Deiker Rojas to a minor league contract.
9. Connor Brogdon. FA

The Guardians join the Twins in the not very exciting category

I am always interested in the other division clubs and wish we did more to follow our competitors.

Twins front office strategy is 100% just hoping their division sucks bad enough for them to win about half their games. And they're going to fail miserably. 

[Riverbrian]

55 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

If your employer exhibited pure incompetence and then tried to get you to commit to staying longer, it's not at all crazy to wait until your contract expired and risked it, especially with the additional earning potential at the end of the deal. 

Crazy is a little strong so I'll pull that back. I also admit to having no idea if the contract length and AAV suggested in this thread is in the ball park or not. 

However... the theory still remains. Joe Ryan would most likely be paid more if he could sign a long term contract right now when compared to what he will be offered in two years when he reaches free agency and barring trade the Twins are the only team that can offer it.  

The Twins front office incompetence. That comes down to what matters more to Joe Ryan. The Money or the opportunity to win baseball games and that I don't know. It's probably a combination of everything a person has to consider in these types of things. 

I'm sure Joe and his agent understand the risk of declining an extension and the Twins understand the risk of offering one. 

[tony&rodney]

18 hours ago, KirbyDome89 said:

If the Twins had somebody of Soderstrom's quality, and swapped him along with Jenkins for the above quartet fans would (rightfully so) revolt. That just seems like such a lopsided swap as far as talent goes, not to mention the financial burden Sacramento/Vegas would have to take on. 

You could be right. Maybe Ryan doesn't have any value.

[Major League Ready]

2 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

There is another conversation I'm in that produced the same assumptions as your 2nd paragraph. 

Logical assumptions to reason. Perhaps the only logical assumptions. 

Your first paragraph describes it perfectly. The front office has lost aggressiveness in any direction. 

I know that I tend to sit around the house more when money gets tight. 

The lackluster approach can be explained by the budget but aggressive when you are bad is to reload/rebuild like the Cardinals are doing.  Is Falvey telling them the best way to build a contender is what the Cardinals are doing now or like Cleveland and Tampa have been doing for a decade or two?  If it were about money, that’s an easy sell because a rebuild would gut payroll and make the team quite profitable for not just this year but the next couple of years at least.  So, is Falvey picking a direction that he thinks will save his job or is it ownership, especially the new partners trying to placate fans with a strategy that is likely to fail?

[Riverbrian]

41 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

The lackluster approach can be explained by the budget but aggressive when you are bad is to reload/rebuild like the Cardinals are doing.  Is Falvey telling them the best way to build a contender is what the Cardinals are doing now or like Cleveland and Tampa have been doing for a decade or two?  If it were about money, that’s an easy sell because a rebuild would gut payroll and make the team quite profitable for not just this year but the next couple of years at least.  So, is Falvey picking a direction that he thinks will save his job or is it ownership, especially the new partners trying to placate fans with a strategy that is likely to fail?

Exactly! 

In another thread... there is someone challenging my shocking opinion that the Twins have been acting more like the Phillies then the Brewers. 

Not like the Phillies in terms of aggressiveness because the Phillies can be aggressive financially while the Twins can't be aggressive without the money to be aggressive. Signing Ty France is not aggressive. Still, the Front office took payroll to levels previously unseen for this franchise and it wasn't just Carlos Correa that brought them there. It was also the lack of Pre-arb players. Low Pre-arb player numbers is something that you see with the big boys. Players that are not pre-arb cost additional money that eats into the available budget.   

The necessary budget sense of what the Twins are should have been obvious to anyone taking a job with the Twins. Development was always going to be the key to survival and we put development aside for temporary patch jobs year after year after year. 

This off-season approach as laid out by public statements by those in charge is really a head scratcher. If the Twins go for it this season and fail. The waste will be measurable. The delay will be extended. 

If ownership is pushing this direction... they need to understand that they are driving payroll up because development is the only way to keep the payroll down with a succussful franchise and they need to understand that Josh Bell isn't going to fill the stands.

If Falvey is selling this direction to ownership. I'd think it makes his job more at risk if it fails. I'd think the safer thing for his future employment with the club is to sell ownership on the need to switch directions and point out that there might be a year or two of below average win results. 

[Riverbrian]

14 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

I too have noticed the moves the Cardinals have been making and have to agree their direction is much clearer than the Twins.

Another point on Chaim Bloom. 

Red Sox fans hate him in Boston but Breslow is now enjoying the fruits of his labor. Bloom was hired to do what needed to be done in Boston at the time and the fans didn't have the patience for it.  

Even the Red Sox can run out of money. If money isn't an object for the Red Sox. Mookie Betts would still be banging balls over the green monster. Dombroski was let go because they ran out of money and they had a bad year at high payroll and the only way to fix it was spending even more money.

So Bloom is brought in to fix it and he did. I'll bet on him with the Cardinals as well.  

[NYCTK]

1 hour ago, Riverbrian said:

However... the theory still remains. Joe Ryan would most likely be paid more if he could sign a long term contract right now when compared to what he will be offered in two years when he reaches free agency and barring trade the Twins are the only team that can offer it.  

That's an interesting theory, but I have to strongly disagree with you. 

You could possibly win me over by saying the expected average contract is lower than what he could receive right now, taking into consideration all the risks of injuries, underperformance, and new market conditions post 2027 CBA. 

But if you're signing an extension in the middle of a contract you're almost always giving a discount to the signing team. It's the complete opposite of betting on yourself, opting for security. Which is a perfectly reasonable decision...if you're happy in that situation. 

You have to believe the new CBA is going to drastically reduce player salaries to believe an extension now is potentially more lucrative. I don't believe that at all. There will not be a significant work stoppage and there will be no salary cap. 

[Riverbrian]

1 minute ago, NYCTK said:

That's an interesting theory, but I have to strongly disagree with you. 

You could possibly win me over by saying the expected average contract is lower than what he could receive right now, taking into consideration all the risks of injuries, underperformance, and new market conditions post 2027 CBA. 

But if you're signing an extension in the middle of a contract you're almost always giving a discount to the signing team. It's the complete opposite of betting on yourself, opting for security. Which is a perfectly reasonable decision...if you're happy in that situation. 

You have to believe the new CBA is going to drastically reduce player salaries to believe an extension now is potentially more lucrative. I don't believe that at all. There will not be a significant work stoppage and there will be no salary cap. 

Who knows... It's a theory. I won't argue heavy. 

I have no idea what will happen with the CBA. It's typical posturing right now. The players union and the owners clearly are pulling in different directions. We will see what they settle on so I'm not factoring any of that in.

That aside... The Twins would have to buy out two years right now. Projections are for 6 million... I think that's low in consideration of the season he just had. However... if you go with 6 for Arb 2 and double his final year of arbitration. That's 18 million that Ryan will earn with health.

If he stays healthy for the next two years and just maintains his current performance level. At age 31.6 he could get a Framber Valdez type deal. 4 or 5 years at 30 million per. Let's say 5 years. 150 million plus the 18 million for 168 total taking him up to age 36.6. That's when the one year deals come in based on his performance over the this contract. 

If the Twins extend him. Rosterman who is an extremely sharp poster suggests 4-5 years between 120 to 140 million. Joe would probably want the shorter extension so let's say 4 years at 120 for 30 AAV. 

He makes 120 million and a free agent again at age 33. Where if he maintains his pitching performance... He could certainly sign another multi year deal. 

Joe makes more money signing that extension. If he wants to beat a path out of town as quickly as he can. He probably understands the risk. 

I think the bigger question is... Would the Twins take the risk and offer the extension? If they are keeping him this year. They probably should because they are just eating his trade value as his years of control shrink.       

[NYCTK]

6 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

Who knows... It's a theory. I won't argue heavy. 

I have no idea what will happen with the CBA. It's typical posturing right now. The players union and the owners clearly are pulling in different directions. We will see what they settle on so I'm not factoring any of that in.

That aside... The Twins would have to buy out two years right now. Projections are for 6 million... I think that's low in consideration of the season he just had. However... if you go with 6 for Arb 2 and double his final year of arbitration. That's 18 million that Ryan will earn with health.

If he stays healthy for the next two years and just maintains his current performance level. At age 31.6 he could get a Framber Valdez type deal. 4 or 5 years at 30 million per. Let's say 5 years. 150 million plus the 18 million for 168 total taking him up to age 36.6. That's when the one year deals come in based on his performance over the this contract. 

If the Twins extend him. Rosterman who is an extremely sharp poster suggests 4-5 years between 120 to 140 million. Joe would probably want the shorter extension so let's say 4 years at 120 for 30 AAV. 

He makes 120 million and a free agent again at age 33. Where if he maintains his pitching performance... He could certainly sign another multi year deal. 

Joe makes more money signing that extension. If he wants to beat a path out of town as quickly as he can. He probably understands the risk. 

I think the bigger question is... Would the Twins take the risk and offer the extension? If they are keeping him this year. They probably should because they are just eating his trade value as his years of control shrink.       

We're in agreement on that. They should either extend him or trade him. Failure to do either is the mark of a terrible front office, but that's just one of many for this regime. 

[Riverbrian]

6 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

We're in agreement on that. They should either extend him or trade him. Failure to do either is the mark of a terrible front office, but that's just one of many for this regime. 

The scary part for me right now is this: 

I don't believe the Twins will do either of these things. 

[NYCTK]

1 hour ago, tony&rodney said:

You could be right. Maybe Ryan doesn't have any value.

It's not that. Your full proposal isn't too ridiculous. But like he said, imagine the Twins were coming out of a rebuild but still weak in pitching. It'd be infuriating to see the Twins trade away a key offensive cog AND their #1 prospect. Contrary to what someone else said, Soderstrom is not blocked with the Athletics, and he is one of 3 key pieces, and if De Vries comes up next year and adds to it, that is a championship level core. 

Now, it's the Athletics so they're going to screw it up regardless, but nevertheless Soderstrom and De Vries for Ryan and Bradley is a bad baseball trade. 

[tony&rodney]

2 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

It's not that. Your full proposal isn't too ridiculous. But like he said, imagine the Twins were coming out of a rebuild but still weak in pitching. It'd be infuriating to see the Twins trade away a key offensive cog AND their #1 prospect. Contrary to what someone else said, Soderstrom is not blocked with the Athletics, and he is one of 3 key pieces, and if De Vries comes up next year and adds to it, that is a championship level core. 

Now, it's the Athletics so they're going to screw it up regardless, but nevertheless Soderstrom and De Vries for Ryan and Bradley is a bad baseball trade. 

My original point was that the Twins need some changes. That idea for a trade and all ideas that I have put out have specifically been identified as examples of potential starting points in conversations. Rolling back the roster for a Threepeat of Incompetence is not something I favor. I do understand that, according to a Twins survey, roughly 53% of Twins Daily fans prefer the current status quo. So I'm in the minority.

The specific idea I typed was using the numbers others have used from BBTV, which I don't really support. Ryan, Bradley, Roden, and Rojas are about 110 versus 90 for Soderstrom and De Vries. I then asked if adding Lewis was better? In  any event it was just the thought of doing something, anything. Adding Bell is worse than nothing. Others disagree. We are just fans.

Finally, we really have zero idea how teams value players and what works or doesn't works unless one has specific access to a front office personal. I may know several MLB coaches and other employees that work in baseball but that gives me zero input from the thoughts of the front offices who make the decisions.

[Hubie29]

They have depth for sure, mediocre to less depth. I agree with earlier poster, we have Ryan and Lopez and then a bunch of mediocrity. Some have potential, others are just inning eaters or rotation fillers, especially during periods when 2 or more are injured. I would trade anyone but Ryan or Lopez, preferably for immediate help as a position player. 

[NYCTK]

21 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

My original point was that the Twins need some changes. That idea for a trade and all ideas that I have put out have specifically been identified as examples of potential starting points in conversations. Rolling back the roster for a Threepeat of Incompetence is not something I favor. I do understand that, according to a Twins survey, roughly 53% of Twins Daily fans prefer the current status quo. So I'm in the minority.

The specific idea I typed was using the numbers others have used from BBTV, which I don't really support. Ryan, Bradley, Roden, and Rojas are about 110 versus 90 for Soderstrom and De Vries. I then asked if adding Lewis was better? In  any event it was just the thought of doing something, anything. Adding Bell is worse than nothing. Others disagree. We are just fans.

Finally, we really have zero idea how teams value players and what works or doesn't works unless one has specific access to a front office personal. I may know several MLB coaches and other employees that work in baseball but that gives me zero input from the thoughts of the front offices who make the decisions.

I love baseball. Love, love, love it. That's why I adopted a second team. 

Too many fans view the sport only through their favorite team's perspective. This is such a narrow view and really prevents many fans from truly appreciating this wonderful sport. I remember at one point someone here said Elly De La Cruz was a bad player, and I was flabbergasted. You can say he's overrated or that you're not a fan of that archetype of player, but to say he's not that good just tells me you don't actually like the sport. You only like the Twins. 

I think you're generally a well educated fan, way less guilty of this irrational homerism. But this consistent trade rumor talk, of which most fans are guilty of, often devolves into this sort of thinking though.

Which isn't to say we should stop these trade ideas. It's fun! And there's little else to do in the offseason. But it often becomes a lack of appreciation of the players and the teams being proposed. 

The Ober for Vientos trade Blog a few days ago was a good example and was especially funny because it made no sense for either the Mets or the Twins. Soderstrom and De Vries is a fun proposal. But it's also pretty ridiculous to propose the Athletics would trade them, and it's not out of line to point this out. 

Twins fans will make fun of other team's fans for ridiculous proposals on Twitter. It's equally valid to point out ridiculous proposals from Twins fans. 

This is all just for fun. 

[KirbyDome89]

2 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

You could be right. Maybe Ryan doesn't have any value.

Concur that BBTV needs to be taken with a massive grain of salt. The swap(s) felt like quality for quantity and the As need quality, YMMV.

I too dislike the Bell signing, and I feel that a third attempt at competing with this "core," is poor decision. Falvey couldn't sustain/supplement and open contention window that he was essentially handed. I have zero faith in his ability to oversee a rebuild. Idk if there was a third option in that poll but I fully understand why some would choose the status quo over a rebuild with the current FO calling the shots. 

[JD-TWINS]

4 hours ago, NYCTK said:

Twins front office strategy is 100% just hoping their division sucks bad enough for them to win about half their games. And they're going to fail miserably. 

OK Nostradamus.

[Major League Ready]

3 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

Exactly! 

In another thread... there is someone challenging my shocking opinion that the Twins have been acting more like the Phillies then the Brewers. 

Not like the Phillies in terms of aggressiveness because the Phillies can be aggressive financially while the Twins can't be aggressive without the money to be aggressive. Signing Ty France is not aggressive. Still, the Front office took payroll to levels previously unseen for this franchise and it wasn't just Carlos Correa that brought them there. It was also the lack of Pre-arb players. Low Pre-arb player numbers is something that you see with the big boys. Players that are not pre-arb cost additional money that eats into the available budget.   

The necessary budget sense of what the Twins are should have been obvious to anyone taking a job with the Twins. Development was always going to be the key to survival and we put development aside for temporary patch jobs year after year after year. 

This off-season approach as laid out by public statements by those in charge is really a head scratcher. If the Twins go for it this season and fail. The waste will be measurable. The delay will be extended. 

If ownership is pushing this direction... they need to understand that they are driving payroll up because development is the only way to keep the payroll down with a succussful franchise and they need to understand that Josh Bell isn't going to fill the stands.

If Falvey is selling this direction to ownership. I'd think it makes his job more at risk if it fails. I'd think the safer thing for his future employment with the club is to sell ownership on the need to switch directions and point out that there might be a year or two of below average win results. 

Great example in Boston.  I am sure Bloom's approach was not popular in Boston but he has set them up for success.

I also agree with Falvey putting himself at risk which is why I think this is coming from ownership.  Falvey had an easy sell.  Picture this.  Falvey goes to ownership and tells them they are perfectly positioned to rebuild in an unusually short period of time.  They already have a lot of major league talent with 4-6 years of control.  Jenkins / Culpepper / Rodriguez can be transitioned this year.  There are a few other guys like GG and Tait that have a good chance to impact the ML club.   They have several SP prospects and they need innings at the ML level and those who don't make it can be tested in the BP.  Here is the key, they have great trade assets that should add impact players.  Many bad teams don't have this trade capital.  On top of that the 3rd pick next year.    

BTW ownership

• The additional assets acquired in trade will give us the best shot at sustained success.
• This approach will improve our chances of building of a true contender. 
• It also accelerates the process of building a real contender. 

Double BTW ownership, this approach is guaranteed to be profitable.  The bonus for Falvey is that he buys a couple more years for himself.  If Falvey is pushing this approach, he either thinks he is bullet proof or he is not thinking about job security.  He also is not thinking about building a real contender.

[NJM]

I think trading Ober would be a stupid decision, it would be a sell low deal on a guy who we know can be a solid 3. If I was to trade anyone in this rotation it would be Ryan because he had a great year and we could sell high and get some incredible prospects for him and free up a spot in the rotation for Abel, Prielipp or someone else. 

[LeatherAntenna]

On 12/23/2025 at 6:45 AM, bunsen82 said:

I still stand by I would be ok with a Joe Ryan trade.  I think at this point Buxton is not willing to be the only elite player on the team.  This team is being built for 2028 and moving forward. 

Team is moving forward?  To where? Complancy?

[bunsen82]

3 hours ago, LeatherAntenna said:

Team is moving forward?  To where? Complancy?

Jokes aside, they have some really good young players for a foundation to build upon. 

[KBJ1]

Are they actually going to get a good outfield or 1B prospect for Larnach/Wallner and a minor league arm? Possibly. Matthews & SWR show promise, best to keep for now and the rest of the "close to ready" monor league arms are.gping to have to make up the bulk of the bullpen. Who is going to be setup and closer is anyones guess. But the Pen went from a solid strength to complete vaccumn. Seeing as top.closwrs ate now signing for 13-20M, we are pretty screwed. We had 3 solid guys for about $5M total last year. Never.going to see that again!

[laloesch]

On 12/23/2025 at 8:15 AM, Whitey333 said:

As usual the teams philosophy this year is to build on hype and hope . These time is right to trade both Ryan and Lopez while they can still get something decent in return.  

Yep.  Considering they are not likely to extend either one of them you would THINK they would be exploring trade options to get good returns.