Sign Yasmani Grandal, be open to trading Nelson Cruz if Mitch Garver is for real

[Wax Kepler]

Mitch Garver had a tremendous home run rate in 2019. If he is anything close in 2020 to the hitter he was in 2019, the Twins' have a special power hitter with years of team control. His production last season would look great even if you had him as your DH instead of catcher.

 

The talent at catcher coming up in the farm system looks promising but is probably a year or two from knocking at the door to the majors. If Garver were to be unavailable, a replacement would be needed. They could resign Castro, but they could upgrade with Grandal.

 

In this scenario, I would split time evenly between Garver and Grandal over the first half of the season. That would help preserve the two catchers over the course of 162 games and hopefully more. If Garver slugs close to what he did this last season, I'm open to trading Nelson Cruz, give the starting spot at catcher to Grandal with Garver picking up spot starts and taking over as the main DH.

 

I like Nelson Cruz but the Twins have got to one of the top teams in number of guys who could justify a start at DH. Sano, Kepler, Polanco, and even Buxton could benefit from a night off in the field and still keep the bat in the lineup. Nothing against Cruz, but he adds no positional value while the guys I just mentioned could pick up those DH at bats and have a good possibility having close to or the same production Cruz did.

 

So, if the lineup proves last year was not a fluke and we're loaded with so many potent bats again in 2020 that they're sitting on the bench every time they get a night off because Cruz is hogging the DH spot, would you look to trade him and open up the DH spot to our stable of sluggers, possibly including names like Alex Kiriloff or Brent Rooker (both of whom have experience at 1B)?

 

What do you think of this proposal? Sound off in the comment section.

[tony&rodney]

I believe free agents and their agents prioritize salary and length of contract above most other factors such as city, team, and so forth. However, there might be eyebrows lifted in the industry if Cruz were to be traded and I'm not sure that there is any way to gain any value in a trade of Mr. Cruz. Additionally, I wonder about the unknown factors surrounding the influence that Nelson Cruz seemed to have last season with a number of the players. Yasmani Grandal could be a prime signing though and there is room between C, 1B, DH, and days off for both Garver and Grandal. Sure would be interesting to hear what the management thinks about all of the options available to the Twins.

[darin617]

Not  sure why teams would want to trade for Cruz when they can just sign Edwin Encarnacion as a free agent for probably half the cost. Also, not sure what a full DH would have in trade value anyways.

 

I would also add I think Nelson Cruz was a very valuable veteran presence that the team really needed. I also feel he may have been a great help for Miguel Sano to finally figure things out.

[ashbury]

For me, the easiest and most cost-effective start to a good offense is to have a great DH. You want a floor of .900 OPS there for your planning. DH-by-committee is only if "plan A" for a season hasn't worked out, and you almost certainly won't get .900 for the season that way. And I'm not sold on Garver's bat to be quite that good, either because 2019 will turn out to be a career year or else his numbers were aided by light duty. So, unless my analytics is telling me that grandpa Cruz is about to fall off a cliff (very possible), I leave him there and increase Garver's workload at catcher to fulltime status, where his bat remains a plus even if he regresses. The marginal benefit of having Grandal doesn't offset the additional cost over having Cruz.

 

Lots of guys can be said to "hit like a DH", but implicit to that is being around average for a DH. To be an actual asset toward a championship team, the bar at DH is set pretty high.

 

If Garver's OPS is north of .900 for 2020, then indeed the possibilities for him having a long career by switching to DH at some point have increased.

[Wax Kepler]

I believe free agents and their agents prioritize salary and length of contract above most other factors such as city, team, and so forth. However, there might be eyebrows lifted in the industry if Cruz were to be traded and I'm not sure that there is any way to gain any value in a trade of Mr. Cruz. Additionally, I wonder about the unknown factors surrounding the influence that Nelson Cruz seemed to have last season with a number of the players. Yasmani Grandal could be a prime signing though and there is room between C, 1B, DH, and days off for both Garver and Grandal. Sure would be interesting to hear what the management thinks about all of the options available to the Twins.

I agree he might not bring much back in value, it might only be minor league arm.

 

My point is we're paying him $12 million and his spot could easily be filled, and with the guys we have on the team and coming up in the system, there might not be much dropoff in production if at all out of the DH.

 

I also agree that he had a positive veteran presence, but this team is more experienced now and how long do we need Cruz holding Sano's hand?

 

I would love it if Baldelli would give 1B reps to Garver, but I haven't seen anything from management that gives me hope that will happen.

[Shaitan]

Signing a free agent and then flipping them is a good way to make other free agents not want to sign with your team.

[Wax Kepler]

Not  sure why teams would want to trade for Cruz when they can just sign Edwin Encarnacion as a free agent for probably half the cost. Also, not sure what a full DH would have in trade value anyways.

 

I would also add I think Nelson Cruz was a very valuable veteran presence that the team really needed. I also feel he may have been a great help for Miguel Sano to finally figure things out.

When someone signs Encarnacion he won't be available. Not sure if you're suggesting Encarnacion will be a free agent all the way to next year's deadline, but another team might be looking for a power bat at some point during the season.

 

I agree with your assessment about his presence but how much longer does Sano need mentoring? We could into spring training and the season with Cruz and still trade him before the deadline. Then you still have him around the clubhouse much of the year.

[Wax Kepler]

The marginal benefit of having Grandal doesn't offset the additional cost over having Cruz.

I disagree with that. Grandal is a better backstop than Garver. Cruz's skill set might be redundant if Garver/Sano slug like they did last year. If we're paying $12 million for redundancy it wouldn't take much in return for me to want to trade him, I'd take a potential bullpen arm even if wasn't major league ready yet.

[Wax Kepler]

Signing a free agent and then flipping them is a good way to make other free agents not want to sign with your team.

Wha? Who am I suggesting we sign then trade? You know we already have Cruz. We don't need to sign him.

[akmanak]

Getting rid of Cruz would be a huge mistake. I think the reason we did so well had the majority to do with his veteran presence. You do not want to mess with the chemistry of this team if you can help it.

 

Dump off Buxton and pick up a starter.

[Tomj14]

 

I disagree with that. Grandal is a better backstop than Garver. Cruz's skill set might be redundant if Garver/Sano slug like they did last year. If we're paying $12 million for redundancy it wouldn't take much in return for me to want to trade him, I'd take a potential bullpen arm even if wasn't major league ready yet.

12 million for one year, shouldn't hinder a team's payroll one bit. You are suggesting trading a guy that hit 41 homers had a WAR of 4.3 in 120 games for a potential bullpen prospect arm?

Not sure you are going to get to many people to agree that is a good idea.

 

"Wha? Who am I suggesting we sign then trade? You know we already have Cruz."

I would assume that person meant Cruz, they signed him just last year and to trade him one year after doing what he did, doesn't look good.

[ewen21]

Getting rid of Cruz would be a huge mistake. I think the reason we did so well had the majority to do with his veteran presence. You do not want to mess with the chemistry of this team if you can help it.

 

Dump off Buxton and pick up a starter.

Apparently he was too much to give up for Noah Syndergaard and there’s your problem with Buxton and this organization. He’s grossly overrated. He has played more than 100 games only once in the four seasons he had the starting CF job. Aside from a couple of hot months at the end of 2017 he has been BAD offensively. At some point we are going to need to give up the ghost with this guy. I would have last season when he was healthy. After missing almost the entire second half to injury he’s not going to fetch a guy like Syndergaard. Not with his injury history and lack of offense

 

I don’t think many Twins fans are willing to accept this reality. Even worse, some still feel he’s “untouchable” which really boggles my mind

[jkcarew]

 

I agree he might not bring much back in value, it might only be minor league arm.

My point is we're paying him $12 million and his spot could easily be filled, and with the guys we have on the team and coming up in the system, there might not be much dropoff in production if at all out of the DH.

Don't think I agree with this. Cruz was 4th in all of baseball last year in wRC+. Better than Cody Bellinger, better than Anthony Rondon. If you were to expand Garver's at-bats, you will increase his percentage of at-bats vs right-handed pitching. He was good against right-handed pitching in 2019, but not nearly as good as Cruz was.

 

Meanwhile, Cruz has a minuscule trade market given his salary and years (one) remaining. It's basically limited to very serious contenders that don't have a legitimate DH. In other words, you're not going to get reciprocating value in return.

 

 

[diehardtwinsfan]

no way I trade Cruz... salary or not, he brought a lot to the clubhouse that I don't think you let go... and a 900+ OPS to go with it... he stays...

[MMMordabito]

Even at Cruz' advanced age and as excited as I am about the future of Mitch Garver,  it's not even a close call for me to pick whose production I'd feel more comfortable penciling in pre-season.  Garver took a huge step last season, but I'd like to see him at least make a run at repeating that OPS. Cruz on the other hand does it year after year after year.  I'm open to a plan that nets Grandal, but it probably isn't one that the Pohlad's will likely be comfortable writing checks to support.  I definitely don't think any plan that comes at the expense of Nelson Cruz is a good idea.

 

He was 9th in MVP voting after playing 75% of the games and 0% of defensive innings.  That is how valuable his bat is to the lineup.

 

Sorry, no, just no.

[Tomj14]

 

Apparently he was too much to give up for Noah Syndergaard and there’s your problem with Buxton and this organization. He’s grossly overrated. He has played more than 100 games only once in the four seasons he had the starting CF job. Aside from a couple of hot months at the end of 2017 he has been BAD offensively. At some point we are going to need to give up the ghost with this guy. I would have last season when he was healthy. After missing almost the entire second half to injury he’s not going to fetch a guy like Syndergaard. Not with his injury history and lack of offense

I don’t think many Twins fans are willing to accept this reality. Even worse, some still feel he’s “untouchable” which really boggles my mind

and yet he (Buxton 5 seasons) is only 2 career WAR behind Aaron Hicks(7 sevens) and is 5 years younger, and us readers are having a hard time getting over that trade.

[Wax Kepler]

I see this is not popular, but keep in mind that the premise is that Garver proves himself by crushing again in 2020, we've added Grandal and love him behind the plate, we still have Cruz but have NOT passed the deadline.

 

If another team is looking add some power to their lineup, I do not consider Cruz untouchable. Especially when I start thinking of all the potential names that could get at bats in the DH spot, starting with Garver. I don't think Sano is a good 1B, maybe his future is at DH with some ability to back up 3B. Our position players need a break every once in a while, so Kepler, Polanco and Buxton come to mind (Buxton was good offensively last season, we had a lopsided win percentage in games Buxton played in. Before Sano hit his grand slam, Buxton was the only one who had one for much of the season.) There are guys coming up in the system I think could be exciting at the plate, like Kiriloff, Rooker, Larnach and would be way cheaper and just need spot to open up in the lineup.

 

DH is the easiest position to find good players for. So flipping easy, IMO.

 

It may be that trading Cruz adds value to the team simply by get out of the way of all the other talented bats in the organization. Plus maybe you could get a promising bullpen prospect.

[Rosterman]

I would work Garver into being a first baseman of the future, depending on the worth you put on Rooker of Wiel. Also, the palce where Sano might end up. You could forego Cron in 2020 and have Garver, Gonzalez and Sano at first, and Sano/Gonzalez at third.

 

Which means you put a bigger emphasis on getting a secondary catcher...one for multi-seasons, unless you see Jeffers and Rortvedt coming on board sooner rather than later. You also have to ask if you want Garver to share positions or become exclusively a first baseman. I think we msot all can agree that the chances of Garver catching 120 games a season are moot.

 

You don't flip Cruz. You can still rest him and put others in that role. But you got him for a season. The message you would send would be horrid. Of course, if the team tanks, you can trade him. But with the option of siging him or not keeping him for DH, you don't sign him jsut to flip him. Plus, he is almost another coach. I'm hoping there is an extended realtionship between him and the Twins in the future.

 

But Garver at first might just solve some issues. No need for Cron. You have three guys to split two positions. Garver could catch. You are looking to add a viable catcher. Willians could be the 26th player. Bingo.

[Battle ur tail off]

No. Garver is probably the #1 regression candidate in MLB next year for starters. 

 

#2, Cruz was a large reason this team hammered the way they did last year. He has been doing this forever. Let him continue it. 

 

3. Twins will never sign Grandall. 

 

 

 

[USAFChief]

 

I see this is not popular, but keep in mind that the premise is that Garver proves himself by crushing again in 2020, we've added Grandal and love him behind the plate, we still have Cruz but have NOT passed the deadline.

If another team is looking add some power to their lineup, I do not consider Cruz untouchable. Especially when I start thinking of all the potential names that could get at bats in the DH spot, starting with Garver. I don't think Sano is a good 1B, maybe his future is at DH with some ability to back up 3B. Our position players need a break every once in a while, so Kepler, Polanco and Buxton come to mind (Buxton was good offensively last season, we had a lopsided win percentage in games Buxton played in. Before Sano hit his grand slam, Buxton was the only one who had one for much of the season.) There are guys coming up in the system I think could be exciting at the plate, like Kiriloff, Rooker, Larnach and would be way cheaper and just need spot to open up in the lineup.

DH is the easiest position to find good players for. So flipping easy, IMO.

It may be that trading Cruz adds value to the team simply by get out of the way of all the other talented bats in the organization. Plus maybe you could get a promising bullpen prospect.

It's flipping easy to find a 1.000 OPS DH??

 

I'm pretty confident nobody in the Twins organization is contemplating trading Cruz. 

 

I'm also pretty confident Garver's not putting up another .900 OPS season. 

[Wax Kepler]

The message you would send would be horrid. Of course, if the team tanks, you can trade him. But with the option of siging him or not keeping him for DH, you don't sign him jsut to flip him.

I don't get it, we signed him last year. If anything it would show the organization believes in their young bats.

[MMMordabito]

I'm starting to think the OP had his Eggos stolen by Nelson Cruz.  Wax off, are you Logan Morrison?

[howeda7]

If a Garver/Grandall pairing makes sense long-term, fine. But trading Cruz is a non-starter. You'd p1ss off almost everyone in the clubhouse and for what?

[Wax Kepler]

It's flipping easy to find a 1.000 OPS DH??

 

I'm pretty confident nobody in the Twins organization is contemplating trading Cruz. 

 

I'm also pretty confident Garver's not putting up another .900 OPS season.

 

If I can replace a 1.000 OPS with a .900 OPS for less than a tenth of the cost, I don't know why it's so outlandish to trade Cruz mid season, if other guys are crushing and there aren't enough at bats to go around and they're sitting on the bench or waiting in the minors.

 

I'm not a big fan of spending a lot on a DH only 40 year old if you have a bunch of twenty something sluggers itching for at bats.

[Wax Kepler]

If a Garver/Grandall pairing makes sense long-term, fine. But trading Cruz is a non-starter. You'd p1ss off almost everyone in the clubhouse and for what?

Garver wouldn't be pissed. Nor would anyone else who stands to get more playing time.

[howeda7]

 

Garver wouldn't be pissed. Nor would anyone else who stands to get more playing time.

Maybe Garver wouldn't be. The other 24 would. I normally agree that "clubhouse presence" is over-rated but Cruz was pretty clearly the leader of the team last year and trading for no good reason other than to free up some AB's would not go over well IMO. Nor with the fan base. Zero chance of it happening.

[Battle ur tail off]

 

If I can replace a 1.000 OPS with a .900 OPS for less than a tenth of the cost, I don't know why it's so outlandish to trade Cruz mid season, if other guys are crushing and there aren't enough at bats to go around and they're sitting on the bench or waiting in the minors.

I'm not a big fan of spending a lot on a DH only 40 year old if you have a bunch of twenty something sluggers itching for at bats.

 

Why take that kind of bat out of your lineup? For what? Cruz in a midseason trade is worth a flyer type prospect. You don't dump someone like that for a lottery ticket. Cruz is the best hitter in this lineup and he's on a one year deal. Taking him away from a team primed to win like this one would be terrible misguided. Don't overthink it...

[Tomj14]

 

I'm not a big fan of spending a lot on a DH only 40 year old if you have a bunch of twenty something sluggers itching for at bats.

The money for Cruz is basically zero in this day an age. 1 year, 12 million. and trading him for another minor league players that may take up a 40 man spot is straight up crazy talk, there almost too many of those guys in the next few years as it is. Why would you trade him and give that spot to unproven player(s)? That is a huge recipe for disaster, if those young guys are amazing in the minors there will be a spot for them in the lineup regardless of Cruz being on the roster or any money on the major league roster.

The back up plan for Garver or Cruz not doing what they did in 2018 is the young guys, the back up for your plan is, hopefully no names and never will bes' stepping up.

 

If the Twins front office wants Grandal (Which I could along with it as long if they also sign at least one of the FA pitchers) they can afford to pay for him, without giving Cruz away.

[USAFChief]

 

If I can replace a 1.000 OPS with a .900 OPS for less than a tenth of the cost, I don't know why it's so outlandish to trade Cruz mid season, if other guys are crushing and there aren't enough at bats to go around and they're sitting on the bench or waiting in the minors.

I'm not a big fan of spending a lot on a DH only 40 year old if you have a bunch of twenty something sluggers itching for at bats.

But that's not what you're proposing. You're proposing signing Grandal, who will cost more than Cruz, and for more years.

 

You likely end up with a worse batting order, for more money, not less. 

[Wax Kepler]

For what?

Well, hopefully for a promising young arm. And to extend Garver's career, and to save millions (that could go toward pitching), and to find room for a young bat that is raking in the minors, Rooker, Kiriloff, Larnach or someone like that, or someone looking for a night off in the field (Sano, Kepler, Polanco).

 

Everyone here thinks Cruz is going to be so valuable in 2020, if that's so, we should be able to get something for him. And hopefully he is much more valuable to another AL team hoping to get in the playoffs and doesn't have the wealth of power hitters we do.

 

Keep in mind, the goal is to get to the World Series, where Nelson Cruz will only be available in a pinch for 3 or 4 away games. Same for all the intraleague games.