Can the Twins Afford to Release Mauer?

[mudcat14]

Obviously they need to pay him $46mil through 2018, no matter what.  Whether it is due to concussion related issues or other physical maladies, there is no arguing his production and skills have seriously diminished.  I can't help but think that his AB's could easily be replaced by Vargas, Sano, Park, Kepler, Grossman or even Palka & Walker.  Each offer at least similar run production, plus have the potential to be much better than we've seen from Joe over the last three seasons.  My concern is that as long as he is in uniform, management will feel obligated to play him in order to justify his expense.  I truly can't see the team progressing with him on the roster.   

[DuluthFan]

While Mauer's skills may have diminished, he still leads the team in OBP, OBP w/ runners in scoring position, tied for 2nd BA w/ runners in scoring position, 3rd OPS w/ runners in scoring position,most walks on team,  highest BA, triples and stolen bases among 1st base candidates (Sano, Plouffe, Vargas, Park) on team, and plays defense well.

 

You're premise that Mauer is hurting the team is false. He performs better than the alternatives. Your only argument is with the amount he is being paid in comparison to others. Yes, he is getting paid a lot. He has earned it with his past performances. He is still earning it by outperforming the alternative options on the roster. Cutting him will not relieve the team of the salary, and it will surely not make the team better as seen by the stats. Mauer may not be leading the team in power numbers, but he is still among the best performing players on the team. He has two seasons left on his contract. He has earned his spot on this team.

[diehardtwinsfan]

yes and know on Joe...  He's not out performing Vargas right now, and there's a decent chance that Park figures things out at some point as well.  I don't see the Twins doing anything about Joe come 2017, but I've got to think that with guys like Park, Palka, and Walker angling for PT that at some point Mauer will be the odd man out in terms of his production.

[USAFChief]

You're premise that Mauer is hurting the team is false. He performs better than the alternatives. Your only argument is with the amount he is being paid in comparison to others.

I don't think any of those three statements are true.

[Comrade Bork]

My friend said his friend that lives next to Joe's brother, told him that Joe is thinking about quitting after the season. I naturally laughed and said BS, but it did get me thinking about what the makeup of this team would be like. The main thing I thought was, well now we can afford to keep Dozier and alleviate the logjam of first basemen.

 

Here's to dreamin.

[mudcat14]

 

You're premise that Mauer is hurting the team is false. He performs better than the alternatives. Your only argument is with the amount he is being paid in comparison to others. Yes, he is getting paid a lot. He has earned it with his past performances. He is still earning it by outperforming the alternative options on the roster. Cutting him will not relieve the team of the salary, and it will surely not make the team better as seen by the stats. Mauer may not be leading the team in power numbers, but he is still among the best performing players on the team. He has two seasons left on his contract. He has earned his spot on this team.

 

I respectfully disagree.  As I said most of the players that I listed offer at least similar production to what Joe has provided, with the potential for much more.  I'm not suggesting all or even any of the younger guys will pan out.  But a line-up featuring Mauer, will prevent us from giving one or two of them the chance to prove their worth.  Once again, his salary is sunk cost.  We pay him whether he plays or not.  Salary shouldn't trump performance in playing time, but in many cases (especially this one) it does.   

[Craig Arko]

 

My friend said his friend that lives next to Joe's brother, told him that Joe is thinking about quitting after the season. I naturally laughed and said BS, but it did get me thinking about what the makeup of this team would be like. The main thing I thought was, well now we can afford to keep Dozier and alleviate the logjam of first basemen.

Here's to dreamin.

Well, maybe so.

 

http://www.startribune.com/how-s-joe-mauer-s-health-as-twins-season-winds-down-i-feel-terrible/394704281/

[Vanimal46]

I'd hang on to Mauer for 1 more season. He should not be a lock for a starting role anymore. There's still value in 250-300 Mauer at bats in a season. He could be useful in a platoon/bench role.

[Vanimal46]

My friend said his friend that lives next to Joe's brother, told him that Joe is thinking about quitting after the season. I naturally laughed and said BS, but it did get me thinking about what the makeup of this team would be like. The main thing I thought was, well now we can afford to keep Dozier and alleviate the logjam of first basemen.

 

Here's to dreamin.

This would solve some roster construction problems, and make the PBO opportunity more intriguing. Freeing up $24 million a year immediately is a big deal.

[Platoon]

There are two things that should never be used to determine whether to release Mauer, the amount of money he is paid, or in an effort to keep Robbie Grossman. Money? The Pohlads have problems, money isn't one of them. Release Joe, he gets the money anyway. Dozier? I though he was locked in for a few more years? Maybe I am wrong? But if he is, why would we extend a MI into his like 35 yr? As for an effort to keep another player, I could live with Vargas' potential as an argument. But Robbie G. That caused me to skip breakfast. Mauer catches foul pop ups behind screens, Grossman can't catch one 6" not the seats! UGH! If a new GM keeps Robbie around next year, that pretty well explains his emphasis on defense!

[laloesch]

Sounds like he's finally getting frustrated with all this losing.  Sure took long enough.  Now let's see some fire from you or quit.  I want to see a Justin Morneau offseason training regiment and a leader in the clubhouse.  

 

Wishful thinking.

[Thrylos]

I'd keep Mauer around, but he would have to earn a starting job next Spring.  I like his bat more than that of Danny Santana, Grossman, etc as a bench bat. Can definitely see a Vargas/Park/Mauer rotation at 1B/DH next season (with Plouffe non-tendered, of course.)  

 

re: Walker:  Seriously?  The guy swats at minor league breaking stuff like they are flies.  Why would anyone think that he can hit anything but mistakes in the majors at this point?  If he gets promoted, he would be more embarrassing than Buxton was last season and the beginning of this one...

[Blake]

I think Mauer needs to retire. Every time he dives for a baseball, I cringe. Joe's brain injury problems are well documented. No matter what, Joe's career is over in a couple of years and I prefer to think that he's able to spend the decades after his career enjoying himself rather than suffering ongoing symptoms from concussions.

[Doomtints]

Mauer had a great August.  Right now, the leg injury that has been bothering most of the year has the upper hand.

 

The Twins won't cut him.  If he retires early, I would be surprised if it's this offseason.  

[USAFChief]

 

Mauer had a great August.  Right now, the leg injury that has been bothering most of the year has the upper hand.

 

The Twins won't cut him.  If he retires early, I would be surprised if it's this offseason.  

The leg injury that has been bothering "most of the year?"

 

Huh?

[Joe A. Preusser]

Extend him.

[TheLeviathan]

Guess we are starting early on our annual spring training tradition of "Now that Mauer feels 100% again, he's ready to go back to his old self!"

 

Only to give him a litany of injury excuses by fall when it didn't happen again.

[nicksaviking]

 

You're premise that Mauer is hurting the team is false. He performs better than the alternatives. Your only argument is with the amount he is being paid in comparison to others.

 

No, it's that he can only play 1B or DH and is going to be starting as long as Molitor is managing. The Twins have numerous other young guys that could use that spot for development and evaluation.

[howieramone2]

 

I don't think any of those three statements are true.

I think all three statements are true.

[howieramone2]

 

There are two things that should never be used to determine whether to release Mauer, the amount of money he is paid, or in an effort to keep Robbie Grossman. Money? The Pohlads have problems, money isn't one of them. Release Joe, he gets the money anyway. Dozier? I though he was locked in for a few more years? Maybe I am wrong? But if he is, why would we extend a MI into his like 35 yr? As for an effort to keep another player, I could live with Vargas' potential as an argument. But Robbie G. That caused me to skip breakfast. Mauer catches foul pop ups behind screens, Grossman can't catch one 6" not the seats! UGH! If a new GM keeps Robbie around next year, that pretty well explains his emphasis on defense!

Sano at 3rd, makes Grossman look like a gold glover.

[HitInAPinch]

having a little fun on a Monday morning   

 

In my mystical, magical world, I'm the owner of a professional baseball team.  And I'm a successful banking executive.  Wait, scratch that last one.  I am a son of a successful banking executive AND I'm a successful banking executive.

 

A young man has just wandered into my office and says  " Hey chief, I got a great idea for you.  We have an under performing asset.  We can save money by just getting rid of it."

 

Me:  "Sounds good.  How much will it cost to make this happen?"

 

Eager Beaver:  "Only 48M over 2 years.  It's a bargain.  And we can bring in more assets!"

 

Me:  "By 48M, you mean........"

 

Eager Beaver:  "48 million dollars a year for 2 years."

 

Me:  "Son, you do understand that I'm a banker, right?"

[USAFChief]

 

I think all three statements are true.

Well, in the case of 2016, for example, it's demonstrably false that Mauer performed better than Kennys Vargas.  Vargas has 100 pts of OPS over Mauer, and has been healthier.

 

And since the OP states "The Twins can afford to release Mauer," the last statement about money is demonstrably false as well.

 

 

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

While Mauer's skills may have diminished, he still leads the team in OBP, OBP w/ runners in scoring position, tied for 2nd BA w/ runners in scoring position, 3rd OPS w/ runners in scoring position,most walks on team,  highest BA, triples and stolen bases among 1st base candidates (Sano, Plouffe, Vargas, Park) on team, and plays defense well.

Mauer doesn't lead the team in OBP, unless you insist on a strict 502 PA threshold for consideration, in which case your sample is pretty meaningless as it is limited to Mauer and Dozier.  (By the same threshold, Mauer is last on the team in a lot of categories too. )

 

 

I'm not sure what qualifier threshold B-Ref uses when you sort stats on a team page (340 PA?), but out of 10 guys, Mauer is 2nd to Grossman in OBP, 5th in AVG, 9th in SLG and ISO, 5th in OPS+/wRC+, 8th in base running runs, etc.  All for an offense that is 9th, just a tick below average, in run scoring.  (He does grade out well in fielding runs, although on a per-game basis he's behind the admittedly small sample of Park, and by virtue of his positional adjustment, he's still negative dWAR.)

 

It would be stupid to cut him right now, but a role reduction might be wise.  At least while you are "rebuilding" and trying to evaluate other assets.  If nothing else materializes, you can always plug him back in as a decent OBP-only 1B/DH option whenever you need to.

 

[howieramone2]

 

Well, in the case of 2016, for example, it's demonstrably false that Mauer performed better than Kennys Vargas.  Vargas has 100 pts of OPS over Mauer, and has been healthier.

 

And since the OP states "The Twins can afford to release Mauer," the last statement about money is demonstrably false as well.

Vargas is the flavor of the month for heaven's sake. I'm sure we can get a coupon for a Happy Meal and fry if we trade him after ST just like we did with Arcia.

[USAFChief]

 

Vargas is the flavor of the month for heaven's sake.  

Possibly true.

 

Still, he outperformed Mauer in 2016.  Which is what you claimed to be untrue.

[laloesch]

 

The leg injury that has been bothering "most of the year?"

 

Huh?

 

I understand that people love joe because he's a hometown guy and all that and for a short time he was an outstanding catcher and hitter, but the endless line of excuses since he started declining is beyond ridiculous and makes a lot of us cringe.

 

If it's that bad Joe RETIRE ALREADY! Simple as that.  Unless you completely wasted your fortune of 170 million, + endorsements and final two years of your deal, hang it up then. Otherwise stop complaining and get back to work already!  Sheesh. 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Mauer and Vargas are both plus fielders at first base, so there's that.

 

For as big and heavy as Vargas is, he doesn't seem to get hurt in the act of making a routine baseball play, like 90% of the other guys on this team do.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I think all three statements are true.

 

so, he is going to outhit Sano next year? That was one of the options, right? 

 

You are also certain he'll outhit Park or Vargas? I'm not. 

 

As for the original question, I don't know what I'd do. He won't be here when they are good, but he's still goodish, and they can't trade him. The only reason to release him, imo, is if you really want Sano at 1B starting now. Otherwise, I probably keep him around.

[roger]

I would think that Mauer will give it a month or two until say mid-December. At that point he will see how his body is recovering and what training he has been able to do. Should both or either of those be not so good, I see him giving consideration to retirement. Expect he, his agent, the new POBO and GM, and Pohlad would sit down and discuss the terms. Likely would include his $46,000,000 being spread over a number of years, perhaps 10-20, with his providing some services to the Twins in off field services.

[Loosey]

 

I understand that people love joe because he's a hometown guy and all that and for a short time he was an outstanding catcher and hitter, but the endless line of excuses since he started declining is beyond ridiculous and makes a lot of us cringe.

 

If it's that bad Joe RETIRE ALREADY! Simple as that.  Unless you completely wasted your fortune of 170 million, + endorsements and final two years of your deal, hang it up then. Otherwise stop complaining and get back to work already!  Sheesh!

How is he complaining?  He was asked how he feels and he was honest.  He said, he feels awful and is ready for this season to end so he can get some rest and recover.