Find a new home for Manuel Margot

[DJL44]

Manuel Margot seems to have the least value to the organization of any player on the roster. Willi Castro is a much better option as a RH bat in the outfield and a better fielder as well. Austin Martin and DaShawn Keirsey look like adequate depth in AAA. As bad as he's been so far there is at least one other team where Margot could provide value. The Rockies outfield has been bad with Jake Cave 2nd in WAR among outfielders. Their RH batting rookie outfielder Beck has a broken hand. That's a team where Margot can definitely contribute. Are there any others? The White Sox signed Tommy Pham and the Rangers just acquired Robbie Grossman or they might have had interest. Would someone else be willing to pick up the remaining $3M for Margot to see if they can get him back to his career average performance?

[RpR]

Castro is NOT a better fielder by any stat.; Margot's failing is his bat is cold.

[USAFChief]

Nobody is trading for Margot.

Least of all teams far down in the standings.

 

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, RpR said:

Castro is NOT a better fielder by any stat.; Margot's failing is his bat is cold.

You can't look at career stats for Margot, he's clearly not the same player. Looking just at the raw athletic skills on Statcast for 2024.

Player Range, Arm Strength, Sprint Speed

Castro 81st percentile, 89.1 mph, 27.9 ft/s

Margot 17th percentile, 82.7 mph, 27.1 ft/s

Looking at outfielder jump

Castro 0.6 reaction, 0.8 burst, -0.2 route => 1.2 ft above average

Margot 1.1 reaction -2 burst, 0.2 route => 0.6 feet below average

Castro gets about 1.8 feet more jump on the ball, has a higher top speed and a better arm.

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, USAFChief said:

Nobody is trading for Margot.

Least of all teams far down in the standings.

Bad teams are exactly the kinds of teams who play guys like Manuel Margot. They often need a placeholder to let them keep their prospects from gaining service time. The Rangers just acquired Robbie Grossman to fill in because their outfield depth is depleted. I don't think the Twins would get much beyond salary relief for Margot.

[USAFChief]

23 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

Bad teams are exactly the kinds of teams who play guys like Manuel Margot. They often need a placeholder to let them keep their prospects from gaining service time. The Rangers just acquired Robbie Grossman to fill in because their outfield depth is depleted. I don't think the Twins would get much beyond salary relief for Margot.

 I guess Falvine concurs.

I repeat...nobody is trading for Manny Margot. Least of all teams that aren't contending.

 

[jorgenswest]

11 hours ago, DJL44 said:

Manuel Margot seems to have the least value to the organization of any player on the roster. Willi Castro is a much better option as a RH bat in the outfield and a better fielder as well. Austin Martin and DaShawn Keirsey look like adequate depth in AAA. As bad as he's been so far there is at least one other team where Margot could provide value. The Rockies outfield has been bad with Jake Cave 2nd in WAR among outfielders. Their RH batting rookie outfielder Beck has a broken hand. That's a team where Margot can definitely contribute. Are there any others? The White Sox signed Tommy Pham and the Rangers just acquired Robbie Grossman or they might have had interest. Would someone else be willing to pick up the remaining $3M for Margot to see if they can get him back to his career average performance?

I wondered if Margot’s lack of value would be shown by the Twins recent use of their roster. Only one player has started fewer games and had fewer plate appearances in the last 14 days. I believe the data from BR is updated through the 25th. Margot has appeared in 11 games and started 5 with 22 plate appearances. Farmer has appeared in 8 games and started 4 with 18 plate appearances. You would hope their 6th and 8th ranked salary commitments would bring more value.

Lewis’ return will reduce the need for both players as Castro can play 2B as well as the outfield. Unfortunately, I don’t think anyone is picking up either contract through waivers or a trade.

[Schmoeman5]

8 hours ago, DJL44 said:

You can't look at career stats for Margot, he's clearly not the same player. Looking just at the raw athletic skills on Statcast for 2024.

Player Range, Arm Strength, Sprint Speed

Castro 81st percentile, 89.1 mph, 27.9 ft/s

Margot 17th percentile, 82.7 mph, 27.1 ft/s

Looking at outfielder jump

Castro 0.6 reaction, 0.8 burst, -0.2 route => 1.2 ft above average

Margot 1.1 reaction -2 burst, 0.2 route => 0.6 feet below average

Castro gets about 1.8 feet more jump on the ball, has a higher top speed and a better arm.

Those numbers are all well and good. But if one takes bad routes or angles they're useless. And Castro seems to hesitate a lot on balls hit shallow so I'm not so sure about that reaction time. But in fairness he has looked better than Margot. 

[Parfigliano]

10 hours ago, DJL44 said:

Bad teams are exactly the kinds of teams who play guys like Manuel Margot. They often need a placeholder to let them keep their prospects from gaining service time. The Rangers just acquired Robbie Grossman to fill in because their outfield depth is depleted. I don't think the Twins would get much beyond salary relief for Margot.

Salary relief you say...works for me.

[tarheeltwinsfan]

20 hours ago, DJL44 said:

 Would someone else be willing to pick up the remaining $3M for Margot to see if they can get him back to his career average performance?

I'll chip in for a portion of the $3M.

[stringer bell]

The thing about Margot is that he seems to have drastically reduced speed. I know he had knee troubles, but his sprint speed was better last year than it had been in 2022. This year, he is below average, when he used to be pretty close to elite. Out of shape? Maybe. In today's professional sports environment, that shouldn't happen, especially with a 29-year-old.

[Jocko87]

I think this is they right way of thinking about this.  He has value to some and if the Twins have to take 1-2m salary to get a A level something back it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.  He's covered by Castro and while Martin hasn't looked great he has upside and options.  I'm completely disappointed by Martin in the outfield but similarly with Margot as well. 

The options are the key here, and will be very important soon.  Tampa might be the place, he's an old friend and they aren't exactly tearing it up in the outfield.  The familiarity might be enough.  He's here as a placeholder for the kids, if the kids are better than him its time to go. 

Speaking of old friends, he was part of an old trade for Emilio Pagan as well.  Huh.

[Jocko87]

On 5/26/2024 at 3:02 PM, USAFChief said:

 I repeat...nobody is trading for Manny Margot. Least of all teams that aren't contending.

Does he pass through waivers then?  A stash at AAA would not be the worst outcome.  My guess is that he would get claimed and in that case, cash considerations has a very high WAR.

[jorgenswest]

9 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

Does he pass through waivers then?  A stash at AAA would not be the worst outcome.  My guess is that he would get claimed and in that case, cash considerations has a very high WAR.

Honest wonders…

He has over 7 years of service time. At that point can he elect to become a free agent instead of going to the minors? If someone were to add him would they pay the minimum and the Twins the rest?

[TopGunn#22]

This is the classic addition by subtraction move.  The question is, who in the heck would have any interest in Margot?  When Lewis gets here there will need to be a move made.  The move to keep Farmer is looking worse and worse each day as well.  A LOT of salary squandered on those two (not to mention the $10 million for Vasquez).

I was surprised Farmer was retained due to Brooks Lee lurking.  Then Lee got hurt and it made sense...for about 5 games.  Farmer's struggles at the plate really exposed the folly of bringing him back for $6+ Million.  I wasn't a fan of the Margot trade from the get go.  Yes, Margot has been terrible, but I didn't like giving up a Platinum Gold Glove SS in the deal either.  

[DJL44]

Atlanta just lost Acuna for the season. Do they have much depth in the minors?

[tarheeltwinsfan]

44 minutes ago, TopGunn#22 said:

I wasn't a fan of the Margot trade from the get go.  Yes, Margot has been terrible, but I didn't like giving up a Platinum Gold Glove SS in the deal either.  

Agree 100%

[bean5302]

Margot is not as good as what teams can find for the league minimum salary or on the waiver wire. I don't think people understand how terrible Margot has been. Nobody pays money for that. If Margot is going to be moved, it'll be through DFA/release. I don't know as Falvey will do it since he hung on to Gallo last year for months and months or terrible results.

Margot is the weakest player on the roster, and he's incapable of fulfilling the only role the Twins really needed him to handle.

[AlwaysinModeration]

This is an odd question to ask in this thread, because I can’t figure out how it would work, but would the Twins be better off giving Victor Robles a shot over Margot?  He was just DFAed by the Nats, and has a higher salary than Margot.

[Mike Sixel]

Just DFA him. No one is trading for him.