Twins signing their extension candidates in reverse order?

[darin617]

It's nice to see the Twins starting to lock up some of the young players but would have really liked it if they could have started signing Jose Berrios first, then Eddie Rosario, then Kepler, and Polanco.

 

It doesn't mean they can't get deals done with them next. Just hate setting a bar before your best young players are signed to extensions. Simple thought would be Rosario's agent will look at Kepler's deal and want $10-20M more for the same length if he is willing to give up his Arbitration years.

 

As for Buxton & Sano they both need to prove they can stay healthy for an entire season and somewhat return to their earlier productive selves.

[blindeke]

I bet they tried...

[wsnydes]

Perhaps they are still working through them and these were the easier deals to wrap up and get signed? I could see Berrios' deal getting drawn out quite a bit given his potential and his age.

[PseudoSABR]

I wouldn't make anything out of which order the contracts are signed.  The one's that happen to get done first, don't necessarily indicate that the Twins desire to sign the others less, or that the others are less inclined to resign. 

 

Negotiations take circuitous and unpredictable paths.

[ashbury]

An above-market signing might have negative repercussions on the next round of player negotiations. I don't think anyone is saying that about the Polanco and Kepler deals. Thus, the order isn't relevant.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I wouldn't make anything out of which order the contracts are signed. The one's that happen to get done first, don't necessarily indicate that the Twins desire to sign the others less, or that the others are less inclined to resign.

 

Negotiations take circuitous and unpredictable paths.

Easier contracts tend to get done more quickly.

 

And the contracts for Kepler and Polanco are easier to negotiate than Berrios and Rosario. If they all started negotiations at the same time, I’d expect the “lesser” players to wrap up their deals first.

[darin617]

 

Easier contracts tend to get done more quickly.

And the contracts for Kepler and Polanco are easier to negotiate than Berrios and Rosario. If they all started negotiations at the same time, I’d expect the “lesser” players to wrap up their deals first.

I just don't like the idea that they set the bar and we know it will take more to sign Rosario if he is willing to sign a long term deal now.

 

As for Berrios, being a pitcher you would think he should be open to an early extension since a pitcher could have so many things go wrong. He could suffer a major injury(Tommy John or Shoulder) or lose the strike zone.

[ashbury]

I just don't like the idea that they set the bar and we know it will take more to sign Rosario if he is willing to sign a long term deal now.

It *will* take more to sign Rosario, and always was going to, regardless of the order they sign. He has more service time, by about a year versus Kepler I think, and even more compared to Polanco. That's a lot of additional negotiating power. If they sign Eddie for an equivalent length extension, arbitration rules start him from a higher negotiating point (versus just going year to year and then taking free agency). If they sign him for a year fewer than Kepler, then it will still be more on an annual basis because we've already gotten all the cheap young years out of Rosario that exist.

 

I think you're worrying about something that can't be helped, based on the Collective Bargaining Agreement. Unless you are hoping that one of the players has a rube for an agent and we can take advantage of him - IMO that would be a bad thing to hope for anyway.

[DocBauer]

Easier contracts tend to get done more quickly.

And the contracts for Kepler and Polanco are easier to negotiate than Berrios and Rosario. If they all started negotiations at the same time, I’d expect the “lesser” players to wrap up their deals first.

Exactly. Rosario and Berrios are next. Once you have Polanco and Kepler figured in to the budget, it's giving you a better idea what it takes for the next signings. And offers WILL be made. Makes me feel even better about what the FO sees with talent on hand, and the core in place. We can scream about additions, but they are playing a slow game to the future. They really like what they have and want to lock up what they have.

 

It's a valid argument believing in what you have vs augmenting what you have through FA. I'm at least excited, somewhat, that they are trying up the talent on hand.

[beckmt]

I am hoping they sign Berrios, but that may be difficult, due to valuation problems.  Rosario, I think if they want him, they will be able to sign him.  He is the most large variation player we have and may want to bet on himself.  Signing him at a price, even a slight overpay, will send a message the Twins are serious about contending on a regular basis, not like some of the other small market clubs, that are always in a state of flux.

[sweetmusicviola16]

 

It *will* take more to sign Rosario, and always was going to, regardless of the order they sign. He has more service time, by about a year versus Kepler I think, and even more compared to Polanco. That's a lot of additional negotiating power. If they sign Eddie for an equivalent length extension, arbitration rules start him from a higher negotiating point (versus just going year to year and then taking free agency). If they sign him for a year fewer than Kepler, then it will still be more on an annual basis because we've already gotten all the cheap young years out of Rosario that exist.

 

I think you're worrying about something that can't be helped, based on the Collective Bargaining Agreement. Unless you are hoping that one of the players has a rube for an agent and we can take advantage of him - IMO that would be a bad thing to hope for anyway.

To sign Rosario to say a 5 year deal, therefore him losing 2 years of free agency, makes him 32y/o when he becomes an FA. 32 y/o OF's aren't getting treated so kindly on the open market these days. Yes he's going to demand a fair ransom to give those FA years up. His big payday hangs in the balance. I suspect he will want to act very wisely. He and Berrios will be harder deals to iron out.

[Major League Ready]

The FO might not see Rosario the same way he is seen here. His WAR has been modest other than the the first half of last season. He played like an elite player for that period but that period was significantly better than any other period. The league adjusted and that period of excellence was followed by a period of equal length where he was absolutely terrible. He was the least productive of any of the regulars. Obviously, he was a pretty good player prior to 2018 but I would not expect the FO to ante up in a big way based on a half season.  

[Dman]

 

The FO might not see Rosario the same way he is seen here. His WAR has been modest other than the the first half of last season. He played like an elite player for that period but that period was significantly better than any other period. The league adjusted and that period of excellence was followed by a period of equal length where he was absolutely terrible. He was the least productive of any of the regulars. Obviously, he was a pretty good player prior to 2018 but I would not expect the FO to ante up in a big way based on a half season.  We'll 

 

We'll see how this plays out but I tend to agree with you.  They might be willing to go year to year with Rosario knowing they have Kiriloff, Wade, and a bevy of outfielders waiting in the wings.  Maybe he will end up being the odd man out and end up trade bait.  Hard to say how the Twins will play it.  I absolutely love watching Rosario play baseball.  You never know what is going happen when is at the plate, in the field or on the bases.  All you know is he is going to pick his spots to be aggressive.

 

Maybe the Twins will find there way to extension with Rosario.  I hope they will but I also wouldn't be surprised if they don't.

[yarnivek1972]

When we are talking about Rosario we are still talking about a guy with nearly a weekly brain phart on defense or the basepaths and a guy that might be the hardest to walk in MLB.

 

For analytical guys, I think that matters.

[diehardtwinsfan]

Not sure we should make much out of the order. I suspect they've talked to Rosario, Berrios, Sano, Buxton, and probably May and Gibson... doesn't mean they are not talking any more, or really anything. It's quite possibly some or all of those guys said "no thanks".  who knows. 

[Seth Stohs]

 

Easier contracts tend to get done more quickly.

And the contracts for Kepler and Polanco are easier to negotiate than Berrios and Rosario. If they all started negotiations at the same time, I’d expect the “lesser” players to wrap up their deals first.

 

Correct, because there are more such deals. The guys aren't All Star types yet. Berrios was an All Star last year. The Aaron Nola and Luis Severino contracts are in the ballpark of what he might want. Severino getting done today probably gives Berrios's camp a target. He should get around the same.

 

But in addition, guys like that also know that they can make much more money by going year to year (with associated risk too). Don't forget that Berrios and Trevor Bauer hung out in Puerto Rico at a camp that Berrios put together. Bauer's a big year-to-year guy. could they have talked? Maybe. Maybe not.  But Berrios is in that category.

 

But to the original post. as others have said, the order has nothing to do with priority, only about opportunity (and two sides being close to the same page). 

[ewen21]

As far as Sano and Buxton go with extensions, it just is  not in their best interest do it now.  It just isn't unless they won't bet on themselves and in that case that is a red flag.  Both seem hungry right now.  It's all over but the shouting.   Now they have to DO IT.  Period.

[twinsfansd]

 

To sign Rosario to say a 5 year deal, therefore him losing 2 years of free agency, makes him 32y/o when he becomes an FA. 32 y/o OF's aren't getting treated so kindly on the open market these days. Yes he's going to demand a fair ransom to give those FA years up. His big payday hangs in the balance. I suspect he will want to act very wisely. He and Berrios will be harder deals to iron out.

At the same time, 30 year olds aren't getting paid well either, so he may want to lock up a couple guaranteed years beyond arbitration.

[jpranger70]

I like the long term signings of Polanco and Kepler.  I think the next to sign should be Berrios and we have the contract extensions of Severino and Nola to base it off as they have set the market.  I do not believe they should sign Rosario to a long term contract as they need to have an outfield position available for Kiriloff available as he is the future.

 

Lets hope that both Buxton and Sano bounce back so we can then sign them to long term deals as well.  That will lock up the core players 5-7 years and give us a lot more flexibility to fill out the remaining roster positions.

[wabene]

I wouldn't not sign Rosario because you fear blocking a prospect. Guys on deals structured like these two are more valuable trade chips. Get a crowd in one area (bout time) move the excess to fill a hole

[jorgenswest]

I am not at all worried about blocking prospects. Nothing stops them from trading Kepler, Rosario or prospects should a blockage occur. The Twins absolutely should continue to extend the control of their core.

[Doomtints]

Some of the commenters are forgetting one thing: The Twins are implicitly cheap.

 

If the other guys are looking to get paid what they are worth rather than simply have a stable job while being underpaid, they're not taking the deals we have seen.

 

Considering these are negotiations, imagine what Kepler would have been originally offered by the Twins........