Rays 2, Twins 1: Lineup Mediocrity "Springs" Eternal

Let Larnach hit. I get the platoons but the rays did that to get Larnach out of the lineup and it worked. 
 

0-5 with RISP was the difference. Not sure how we get better here, but that is a huge difference between us (#20) and KC (#3) and Cleveland. (#6)

Man the Rays can produce good young players. I was worried that the young starters were going to be a problem. Not so - this lineup needs a re make in the off season. I’m so done with “positional flexibility “.  They need to start finding positions that guys are actually good at. 

Minor correction.  The Twins got 2 hits in the 9th for a total of 6 hits, not that it mattered.

Ryan Jeffers: 0-4, 2 K

Jose Miranda: 0-4, K

Willi Castro: 0-4, 2 K

We should be talking about how well Festa pitched but the poor offense is the story. 

18 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

And defense. Infielders in the outfield, a statue at 2nd  base.

Same slavish reliance on platoons, to the point Helman is in RF.

Wallner and Larnach 1 PA each. 

Where's the flouncer?

It looked like a circus in the outfield...that was a very ugly way to lose...

I've also been noticing that teams pretty much run on us at will. Believe me, if we enter the playoffs, this will be a factor. Good teams find a way to take advantage of your weaknesses. The inability to throw out runners is getting embarrassing. Singles turn into doubles pretty quickly. I know there is way more wrong with this team and people are definitely talking about those things. I don't see a lot of people talking about this glaring weekness though. I'm losing hope that Correa is going to come back and be the savior. I really like him, but I have a suspicion that the front office knows more behind the scenes then they are letting on. We get very few updates thrown our way. Getting Buxton back should help, but we need not only a healthy Buxton, but also a fairly healthy Correa and I'm not holding my breath. This team is OK, but just ok. I don't see them going very far in the playoffs. I hope I'm wrong. 

Festa pitched really well. I sure hope he can continue this for another 4-5 starts this month.

A sad and seemingly uninspired loss tonight in Tampa. I've been confident until now, but I'm about ready to concede the Division to Cleveland. I thought that the Guardians would sputter against KC but they are back to their winning ways based on solid pitching, some power, and pesky small-ball at times. Poor KC has been in a death spiral since losing a very good ball player in Vinnie Pasquantino.   

You simply can't go down to Tampa and lay an egg against an out-of-contention team before a sparse crowd when you are in the midst of a genuine pennant race. Rocco, play a hunch man--take a chance and throw caution to the wind just once. For the rest of September make a bonfire of your charts and graphs. Lose your "modest stillness and humility" and instead "imitate the action of the tiger." Oh, and let Buxton back even if he's only 99% healed.

I believe that the Twins will play in October but the path to the World Series is much less fraught for a division winner than a wild card.    

Going to see Buck and E-Rod play for the Saints on Weds. Maybe they should both come up this weekend to shore up the outfield defense. 

53 minutes ago, h2oface said:

What a sad game.

If Festa has players that actually can play average defense, he probably gets out of the 4th. Martin can't really play defense well at any position. Amazing that when they traded for him he was a SS. Errors that don't get scored errors. And Santana has to make that play at first. Gold glover, as he is being hyped as? Then he really has to make the play. I remember quite a few plays like this this season, where there is no error, but he could have picked the throw at first, or made the play in the field, and it wasn't scored an error. Yes, he has made some fine plays, too. But really, profession baseball players are supposed to be great in the field if you ask me, like Lee's catch and throw home for the out. Great play. That is all they have done all their life. Play baseball. Helman's throw was comical. Even if you are not playing in the Show, defensive responsibility is the same at all levels. Hero complex is not a good look first game ever. The Twin's love the guy that never made it up. Even if they might have someone better for the call up.

I really hope these guys start acting like they want to be a playoff team, and that means scoring more than 1 or 2 or 3 runs a game, and making the plays that are there to make in the field. This was a really boring baseball game to watch again. At least Thielbar didn't blow it up. And new/old guy, Tonkin. As unreliable as the top tier of relief was for the recent home stand, when you have Festa only allowing 2 in 5 (and that was really on the defense to a large degree), and Thielbar and Tonkin and Castillo putting up zeros and totally shutting the Rays down, you can't waste it.

What was Martin doing out there? Updating his profile pic on X? When I found the video, it said, 'Fly ball single to center,' so I expected one of those unfortunate bloops. Instead, it's a normal fly ball to left but Martin is frozen and then does his cartwheel (or whatever that was) at the last moment.

14 minutes ago, thelanges5 said:

Going to see Buck and E-Rod play for the Saints on Weds. Maybe they should both come up this weekend to shore up the outfield defense. 

They will probably go 4 for 9 combined with a BB  and a few rbi tomorrow.  Erod is gonna have fun playing in the same lineup as buck!

The lack of runs and the oooo fers on RISP is embarrassing. 

Festa is, in baby-step fashion, for the most part proving to live up to his hype.  Tonkin appears to be a timely pickup.  Thielbar did his part this time.....but every time he makes an appearance I keep wondering what keeps him on the roster besides nostalgia and being left-handed.  Castillo will be rewarded for his effort this time by being DFA'd again or otherwise returning to St Paul to make room for Varland.  

It is fun to watch effective pitching, but I am not holding my breath for that to happen next game with a Varland start.

5 hours ago, RonJ64 said:

I've also been noticing that teams pretty much run on us at will. Believe me, if we enter the playoffs, this will be a factor. Good teams find a way to take advantage of your weaknesses. The inability to throw out runners is getting embarrassing. Singles turn into doubles pretty quickly. I know there is way more wrong with this team and people are definitely talking about those things. I don't see a lot of people talking about this glaring weekness though. I'm losing hope that Correa is going to come back and be the savior. I really like him, but I have a suspicion that the front office knows more behind the scenes then they are letting on. We get very few updates thrown our way. Getting Buxton back should help, but we need not only a healthy Buxton, but also a fairly healthy Correa and I'm not holding my breath. This team is OK, but just ok. I don't see them going very far in the playoffs. I hope I'm wrong. 

I agree completely.  In looking at the box score one of the things that stuck out the most was the 4 stolen bases, including 3rd base as well.  Was it Festa not holding them on, or was it Jeffers not making the throw?  A little bit of both maybe?  Either way, the word will get around the league pretty fast that you can run on this guy; we have to take a look at it.  The 4 extra bases can come back to bight you more times than not.  

3 hours ago, Mark G said:

I agree completely.  In looking at the box score one of the things that stuck out the most was the 4 stolen bases, including 3rd base as well.  Was it Festa not holding them on, or was it Jeffers not making the throw?  A little bit of both maybe?  Either way, the word will get around the league pretty fast that you can run on this guy; we have to take a look at it.  The 4 extra bases can come back to bight you more times than not.  

The steal of 3rd was all on Festa, the others probably a bit of both.

I watched the game late at night. I ended it thinking "I stayed up this late to see two runners on, nobody out, followed by two bad at-bats and a Vasquez PH?" Very disappointing.

Yes Festa needs to do a better job of holding runners on.  However, the Twins have been very poor at defending steals most of the year.  The word has been out for quite some time.  In this regard it looks like Junior Varsity base stealing defense.  

Festa did fine.  U inspiring performance for the team as a whole.  

This loss was due to this team's slavish devotion to analytics and shows what will happen in the playoffs.  Roster construction is devoted to position flexibility so you end up having three infielders playing the outfield.  Stolen bases are not valued on defense or offense according to the analytics or is the sacrifice bunt.

The team refuses to develop players and make them full time players.  You sit two of your hottest hitters and when they do come in you pinch hit for one with Vasquez.  By sitting Wallner and Larnach, you then have no bench players to fill the role of pinch runner for Santana in the 9th inning.  We need regular every day players and fill the bench with specific roles in mind.  And if someone goes down call up somebody that can actually play that position.  We don't need  three utility players on the roster.  When Castro and Santana lead your team in AB's, you are not going to win consistently.  Even without injuries they still would have been in the top 5 in plate appearances.

They can't just keep dismissing the running game, teams are starting to take advantage of this.  Putting runners in scoring position so easily is leading to runs and not helping the pitcher out.  We need to start to being a little more aggressive as well, sometimes just starting a runner keeps you out of the double play.

Why not have Lee bunt the runners over, you then have two runners in scoring position and put pressure on the pitcher and defense.  I probably would bunt more than a lot of people on this board would, but how can you not bunt in that situation.  Rocco's explanation basically just confirms that he was playing for the home run again.

This team will have some success with their philosophy in the regular season because the odds say if you do x action so many times it will have success x percent of the time.  But you can't do that in the playoffs, you need your best and regular players to step up and win the game.  Last night is what a playoff game would be like, they will keep trying to playing the odds and in a short series you will lose.

Are they going to turn ERod and Jenkins into platoon players if they continue to develop as they have been.

11 minutes ago, karcherd said:

This loss was due to this team's slavish devotion to analytics and shows what will happen in the playoffs.  Roster construction is devoted to position flexibility so you end up having three infielders playing the outfield.  Stolen bases are not valued on defense or offense according to the analytics or is the sacrifice bunt.

The team refuses to develop players and make them full time players.  You sit two of your hottest hitters and when they do come in you pinch hit for one with Vasquez.  By sitting Wallner and Larnach, you then have no bench players to fill the role of pinch runner for Santana in the 9th inning.  We need regular every day players and fill the bench with specific roles in mind.  And if someone goes down call up somebody that can actually play that position.  We don't need  three utility players on the roster.  When Castro and Santana lead your team in AB's, you are not going to win consistently.  Even without injuries they still would have been in the top 5 in plate appearances.

They can't just keep dismissing the running game, teams are starting to take advantage of this.  Putting runners in scoring position so easily is leading to runs and not helping the pitcher out.  We need to start to being a little more aggressive as well, sometimes just starting a runner keeps you out of the double play.

Why not have Lee bunt the runners over, you then have two runners in scoring position and put pressure on the pitcher and defense.  I probably would bunt more than a lot of people on this board would, but how can you not bunt in that situation.  Rocco's explanation basically just confirms that he was playing for the home run again.

This team will have some success with their philosophy in the regular season because the odds say if you do x action so many times it will have success x percent of the time.  But you can't do that in the playoffs, you need your best and regular players to step up and win the game.  Last night is what a playoff game would be like, they will keep trying to playing the odds and in a short series you will lose.

Are they going to turn ERod and Jenkins into platoon players if they continue to develop as they have been.

 

11 minutes ago, karcherd said:

This loss was due to this team's slavish devotion to analytics and shows what will happen in the playoffs.  Roster construction is devoted to position flexibility so you end up having three infielders playing the outfield.  Stolen bases are not valued on defense or offense according to the analytics or is the sacrifice bunt.

The team refuses to develop players and make them full time players.  You sit two of your hottest hitters and when they do come in you pinch hit for one with Vasquez.  By sitting Wallner and Larnach, you then have no bench players to fill the role of pinch runner for Santana in the 9th inning.  We need regular every day players and fill the bench with specific roles in mind.  And if someone goes down call up somebody that can actually play that position.  We don't need  three utility players on the roster.  When Castro and Santana lead your team in AB's, you are not going to win consistently.  Even without injuries they still would have been in the top 5 in plate appearances.

They can't just keep dismissing the running game, teams are starting to take advantage of this.  Putting runners in scoring position so easily is leading to runs and not helping the pitcher out.  We need to start to being a little more aggressive as well, sometimes just starting a runner keeps you out of the double play.

Why not have Lee bunt the runners over, you then have two runners in scoring position and put pressure on the pitcher and defense.  I probably would bunt more than a lot of people on this board would, but how can you not bunt in that situation.  Rocco's explanation basically just confirms that he was playing for the home run again.

This team will have some success with their philosophy in the regular season because the odds say if you do x action so many times it will have success x percent of the time.  But you can't do that in the playoffs, you need your best and regular players to step up and win the game.  Last night is what a playoff game would be like, they will keep trying to playing the odds and in a short series you will lose.

Are they going to turn ERod and Jenkins into platoon players if they continue to develop as they have been.

 

Very.  Well.  Said.