Twins General Manager Jeremy Zoll Explains Why Walker Jenkins Hasn’t Been Called Up

[bean5302]

30 minutes ago, Greglw3 said:

For the whole month of August, 13 games .389/.450/.741

 

apparently you and I learned different ways of counting as toddlers LOL

[Whammy]

Nice editors you got there ESPN

[Whammy]

7 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

apparently you and I learned different ways of counting as toddlers LOL

I assume he lumped in this morning's two-homer finished contest from last night

[Cris E]

I think what was not said out loud in the interview was that Shelton is managing this year's locker room with these guys and a formula that they feel is working.  Jackson is inside the circle, having a place in the machine (ie allowing Jeffers to pinch hit, pinch running for Bell) and his presence does not affect the important guys. Adding Jenkins will require messing around with the guys that are playing well and there's no way they are going to do that in a race. You may not agree, but you're not in charge.

And while it is likely Jenkins' defense will be an improvement over most of the OF, there is very little basis for assuming he'll just be better than others at the plate. I would honestly map Kulpepper's surprising performance to Morris figuring things out vs how many other young pitchers that have been grinding it out this year (eg Prelipp, Matthews, Adams, etc.) with ERA over 5 and a lot of rough promise.  I expect it's far more likely that Larnach rights himself than Jenkins would come anywhere near his performance thru the end of the year.  Weren't we reading on this site yesterday how Clemens was cooked?  Larnach is not done either.  

[Cris E]

26 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

So, never call him up realistically?

The decision doesn't rest solely on his performance. They are weighing stability in the current year above his potential contribution and/or disruption. You call him up when there's a spot to play, not a spot to sit.

[90stwinskid]

14 minutes ago, purplesoldier4u said:

Gleeman? 🤣🤣🤣🤣

The one with the nice hair, yes. 😁

[chpettit19]

Just now, HarmonK03 said:

Maybe not a fair comparison, you are correct but the point is still there, someone with Jenkins talent you can find at bats for.

Someone with Jenkins "hoped for" talent. Or at least hoped for results.

What if he comes up and goes 3 for his first 30? Send him back down, apologize to Larnach, Bell, Buxton, and Keaschall for benching them multiple times because this kid was obviously going to be better than them?

How many other 21-year-old Jenkins types can you name where other teams have sacrificed ABs for guys like Buxton, Bell, Larnach, and Keaschall? Especially while being half a game up in the wild card race.

The Yankees didn't start sitting Jazz Chisholm once a week to get Lombard ABs. They didn't put Ben Rice behind the plate to get Lombard ABs. They didn't move McMahon (who's a worse hitter than anyone the Twins would move/bench) to get him ABs. They didn't move anyone around. They sat Jose Caballero and have been running essentially a 9-man lineup every day. 

The Tigers didn't bench Carpenter, Greene, or even Vierling, Perez, Meadows, or Outman types for Clark. They all got hurt. Max Clark is playing over guys named Julks and Malgeri. 

The idea of sitting 4 of your best hitters on a regular basis to get a rookie into the lineup in a playoff chase is actually rather bold. It's not a regular occurrence.

[Mike Sixel]

9 minutes ago, Cris E said:

The decision doesn't rest solely on his performance. They are weighing stability in the current year above his potential contribution and/or disruption. You call him up when there's a spot to play, not a spot to sit.

To be clear, you are in favor of getting rid of one or both of Larnach and Bell to make this happen next year? As I've said, I understand why people feel the way they do with this year, but nothing changes next year if you bring back this group. 

[HarmonK03]

1 minute ago, chpettit19 said:

Someone with Jenkins "hoped for" talent. Or at least hoped for results.

What if he comes up and goes 3 for his first 30? Send him back down, apologize to Larnach, Bell, Buxton, and Keaschall for benching them multiple times because this kid was obviously going to be better than them?

How many other 21-year-old Jenkins types can you name where other teams have sacrificed ABs for guys like Buxton, Bell, Larnach, and Keaschall? Especially while being half a game up in the wild card race.

The Yankees didn't start sitting Jazz Chisholm once a week to get Lombard ABs. They didn't put Ben Rice behind the plate to get Lombard ABs. They didn't move McMahon (who's a worse hitter than anyone the Twins would move/bench) to get him ABs. They didn't move anyone around. They sat Jose Caballero and have been running essentially a 9-man lineup every day. 

The Tigers didn't bench Carpenter, Greene, or even Vierling, Perez, Meadows, or Outman types for Clark. They all got hurt. Max Clark is playing over guys named Julks and Malgeri. 

The idea of sitting 4 of your best hitters on a regular basis to get a rookie into the lineup in a playoff chase is actually rather bold. It's not a regular occurrence.

Is Buxton going to play every day for the rest of the season, I doubt it.  My guess at a minimum he will DH at least once a week.  Sitting Larnach who has been struggling two games a week and Keaschall can move to second two games a week.  There are 5 games a week to try and give your offense a jolt.  The offense is struggling right and needs some life, there are never guarantees in life.  But this is someone you can find playing time for and I don't think it is going to totally disrupt the team.  If nothing else tell them to perform better and they wouldn't have had to make this move.

[Mike Sixel]

6 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Someone with Jenkins "hoped for" talent. Or at least hoped for results.

What if he comes up and goes 3 for his first 30? Send him back down, apologize to Larnach, Bell, Buxton, and Keaschall for benching them multiple times because this kid was obviously going to be better than them?

How many other 21-year-old Jenkins types can you name where other teams have sacrificed ABs for guys like Buxton, Bell, Larnach, and Keaschall? Especially while being half a game up in the wild card race.

The Yankees didn't start sitting Jazz Chisholm once a week to get Lombard ABs. They didn't put Ben Rice behind the plate to get Lombard ABs. They didn't move McMahon (who's a worse hitter than anyone the Twins would move/bench) to get him ABs. They didn't move anyone around. They sat Jose Caballero and have been running essentially a 9-man lineup every day. 

The Tigers didn't bench Carpenter, Greene, or even Vierling, Perez, Meadows, or Outman types for Clark. They all got hurt. Max Clark is playing over guys named Julks and Malgeri. 

The idea of sitting 4 of your best hitters on a regular basis to get a rookie into the lineup in a playoff chase is actually rather bold. It's not a regular occurrence.

I'll ask you the same, if you believe these are the four best hitters, why aren't you bringing them all back next year? And if you do....

[IndyTwinsFan]

11 minutes ago, Cris E said:

The decision doesn't rest solely on his performance. They are weighing stability in the current year above his potential contribution and/or disruption. You call him up when there's a spot to play, not a spot to sit.

Then create a spot to play him instead of sitting on your hands and pretending there's nothing you can do.

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, IndyTwinsFan said:

Then create a spot to play him instead of sitting on your hands and pretending there's nothing you can do.

That ship sailed at the deadline. Assuming you believe this team is filled with three OF and a DH. 

[tjwilliams]

The "super-young" argument doesn't really hold water, I don't think.

Walker Jenkins is the oldest, most-experienced top prospect who is still at AAA.

Here's what I mean by that: I looked at the Top 50 ESPN prospects (they just updated their list today). Of all the prospects who are as old or older than Jenkins, four are currently in the majors, eight are at AA or below and five are at AAA. Of the five at AAA, here is their experience level there - 

Walker Jenkins - 86 GP, 380 PA (started the season at AAA)
Aidan Miller - 8 GP, 37 PA (started the season at AA)
Cam Cannarella - 23 GP, 101 PA (started the season at A+)
Seaver King - 49 GP, 220 PA (started the season at AA)
Thomas White - 5 GS, 81 BF (started the season at A)

No Top 50 prospect currently at AAA is older than Jenkins, with more experience at that level than he has. Even factoring in his injury time, Jenkins has more experience this year at AAA than any prospect his age. And he's the only top prospect at his age (or older) who started the season at AAA who has not yet been called up.

And if you look at the guys who are older than Jenkins and in the majors now, they all have roughly the same AAA experience (if not less) as he has had:

Max Clark - 90 GP, 418 PA (two months older than Jenkins)
Angel Genao - 72 GP, 309 PA (nine months older than Jenkins)
Kaelen Culpepper - 74 GP, 343 PA
Luis Lara - 78 GP, 346 PA (three months older than Jenkins)

It is just not the case that Walker Jenkins is "super-young." Are there older prospects still below him? Certainly. But all of the prospects his age or older who started the season at AAA are now in the majors and the only prospects his age or older who are currently at AAA didn't start the season there and have significantly less AAA experience than him.

[HarmonK03]

This talk about the locker room is great but it shouldn't be the only criteria.  You are there to win games and if you can make a move to try and make your team better, you do it.  There are no guarantees in life.  There is a fine line between earning a spot and keeping your spot and that is where Larnach is right now.  But no he shouldn't be benched but he can sit a couple of games a week.

If Shelton is so good at managing the locker room he should be able to manage this.  But to roster a player because he's not competition to beat anyone out and continues locker room harmony is just sheer baloney.  Are we in Little League or the Major Leagues.

 

[Mike Sixel]

1 minute ago, tjwilliams said:

The "super-young" argument doesn't really hold water, I don't think.

Walker Jenkins is the oldest, most-experienced top prospect who is still at AAA.

Here's what I mean by that: I looked at the Top 50 ESPN prospects (they just updated their list today). Of all the prospects who are as old or older than Jenkins, four are currently in the majors, eight are at AA or below and five are at AAA. Of the five at AAA, here is their experience level there - 

Walker Jenkins - 86 GP, 380 PA (started the season at AAA)
Aidan Miller - 8 GP, 37 PA (started the season at AA)
Cam Cannarella - 23 GP, 101 PA (started the season at A+)
Seaver King - 49 GP, 220 PA (started the season at AA)
Thomas White - 5 GS, 81 BF (started the season at A)

No Top 50 prospect currently at AAA is older than Jenkins, with more experience at that level than he has. Even factoring in his injury time, Jenkins has more experience this year at AAA than any prospect his age. And he's the only top prospect at his age (or older) who started the season at AAA who has not yet been called up.

And if you look at the guys who are older than Jenkins and in the majors now, they all have roughly the same AAA experience (if not less) as he has had:

Max Clark - 90 GP, 418 PA (two months older than Jenkins)
Angel Genao - 72 GP, 309 PA (nine months older than Jenkins)
Kaelen Culpepper - 74 GP, 343 PA
Luis Lara - 78 GP, 346 PA (three months older than Jenkins)

It is just not the case that Walker Jenkins is "super-young." Are there older prospects still below him? Certainly. But all of the prospects his age or older who started the season at AAA are now in the majors and the only prospects his age or older who are currently at AAA didn't start the season there and have significantly less AAA experience than him.

Facts. What are they good for? I think every guy drafted before him his year is in the majors, and more than a few after....

[IndyTwinsFan]

3 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

That ship sailed at the deadline. Assuming you believe this team is filled with three OF and a DH. 

We have more DH types than we know what to do with, most of which are manning a corner outfield spot, and not very well, defensively, most games.  And not enough true outfielders.

[chpettit19]

2 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I'll ask you the same, if you believe these are the four best hitters, why aren't you bringing them all back next year? And if you do....

I don't follow the logic. Are you suggesting that these haven't been 4 of the Twins best hitters in 2026? And if you are, then I don't think there's common ground to be had. If you aren't, then I'm confused on why you're so amped to bench any of them for any meaningful number of games while the team is in the last wild card spot.

What I would do and what is reasonable for the Twins to do are different things. And the idea that there should be no expected decline for a 34-year-old bell is nothing but a strawman. Or that Larnach's arb jump has no impact on decisions. I'm pretty sure we're on the same page that Keaschall and Buxton have everyday roles in 2027. The hypothetical question has no impact on the current playoff race they're in. You know I'd have made many different decisions between last deadline and today. But the situation today is what it is. The "bring them back next year" question isn't some deep, insightful idea. It's just a strawman that ignores the reality of the differences in situations.

[Riverbrian]

If opportunity is a primary consideration. And I agree that it's a sensible consideration. 

Hang Tight. 

There will most likely be injuries. 

[tjwilliams]

29 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

 

The idea of sitting 4 of your best hitters on a regular basis to get a rookie into the lineup in a playoff chase is actually rather bold. It's not a regular occurrence.

This is pretty much what Cleveland is doing with Angel Genao right now. They called him up a few weeks ago and, recently, he's started twice at 2B so Bazzanna could DH. He's started at 3B to give Ramirez a day off and let him DH. He's started at SS to give Rocchio a day off. He's started 12 of their last 13 games and is raking. Ramirez has started 10/13, Bazzanna has started 11/13, and Rocchio has started 11/13.

Now, the big difference for the Twins is they have Josh Bell as the everyday DH and Larnach and Keaschall have been better hitters than the Guardians IF (though Larnach has a .580 OPS over the last month). It's not the craziest idea, though.

Edit: Forgot to add that Genao is hitting .341/.413/.463.

Edited 4 hours ago by tjwilliams
Added context

[chpettit19]

22 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

Is Buxton going to play every day for the rest of the season, I doubt it.  My guess at a minimum he will DH at least once a week.  Sitting Larnach who has been struggling two games a week and Keaschall can move to second two games a week.  There are 5 games a week to try and give your offense a jolt.  The offense is struggling right and needs some life, there are never guarantees in life.  But this is someone you can find playing time for and I don't think it is going to totally disrupt the team.  If nothing else tell them to perform better and they wouldn't have had to make this move.

We've been through this before, I'm not putting Keaschall at 2B for another game in his life. And I'm not benching Larnach twice a week for Jenkins. The guys in the clubhouse definitely know who's got them there and that absolutely has a very real chance of disrupting the team. Jenkins better perform or you're going to have some very cranky vets. 

But I ask again, can you name another team that has called up a Jenkins type prospect and moved a guy back to a position they already decided he couldn't field and benched one of their 4 or 5 best hitters multiple times a week to get that guy in? Your suggestion is not as mainstream as you seem to be suggesting it is.

I want to see Jenkins, too. I have no idea if he'll perform from the jump or not. I'm not forcing Keaschall back to the dirt and benching Larnach multiple times a week in the heat of a playoff chase to find out if he's going to be like most rookies (even the elite prospects) and struggle some out of the gate, or if he'll be an outlier and outperform nearly my entire roster.

[Mike Sixel]

19 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

I don't follow the logic. Are you suggesting that these haven't been 4 of the Twins best hitters in 2026? And if you are, then I don't think there's common ground to be had. If you aren't, then I'm confused on why you're so amped to bench any of them for any meaningful number of games while the team is in the last wild card spot.

What I would do and what is reasonable for the Twins to do are different things. And the idea that there should be no expected decline for a 34-year-old bell is nothing but a strawman. Or that Larnach's arb jump has no impact on decisions. I'm pretty sure we're on the same page that Keaschall and Buxton have everyday roles in 2027. The hypothetical question has no impact on the current playoff race they're in. You know I'd have made many different decisions between last deadline and today. But the situation today is what it is. The "bring them back next year" question isn't some deep, insightful idea. It's just a strawman that ignores the reality of the differences in situations.

I'm not arguing if they are or not....I'm arguing, if the Twins think this, why won't they bring them all back? 

[Mike Sixel]

21 minutes ago, IndyTwinsFan said:

We have more DH types than we know what to do with, most of which are manning a corner outfield spot, and not very well, defensively, most games.  And not enough true outfielders.

We agree, but we don't run the Twins. Luckily for everyone (but our paychecks).

[Mike Sixel]

12 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

If opportunity is a primary consideration. And I agree that it's a sensible consideration. 

Hang Tight. 

There will most likely be injuries. 

Let's pretend Buxton gets hurt, and they actually IL him right away (hahahahaha).....are they calling up Jenkins for 10 games? I think not. 

[Cris E]

3 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I'm not arguing if they are or not....I'm arguing, if the Twins think this, why won't they bring them all back? 

Because it's 2026 and we're playing this season now.  Next year they'll solve for next year.

[chpettit19]

7 minutes ago, tjwilliams said:

This is pretty much what Cleveland is doing with Angel Genao right now. They called him up a few weeks ago and, recently, he's started twice at 2B so Bazzanna could DH. He's started at 3B to give Ramirez a day off and let him DH. He's started at SS to give Rocchio a day off. He's started 12 of their last 13 games and is raking. Ramirez has started 10/13, Bazzanna has started 11/13, and Rocchio has started 11/13.

Now, the big difference for the Twins is they have Josh Bell as the everyday DH and Larnach and Keaschall have been better hitters than the Guardians IF (though Larnach has a .580 OPS over the last month). It's not the craziest idea, though.

Edit: Forgot to add that Genao is hitting .341/.413/.463.

And I think that "big difference" is what matters. You named an obvious star in Ramirez, who's actually having a very disappointing year while missing time with injuries, a rookie 2B who's been an average hitter, and a SS who's been less below average than usual this year, but still below average.

So, no, I don't think the Guardians are doing what I asked about. They aren't benching DeLauter to play Genao. They aren't benching Kwan after he finally got going this year. They aren't moving guys from the IF to the OF so Genao can play IF. 

Ramirez is a close comp to Buxton in terms of the injury and getting a "half day off" by DHing, but Buxton has significantly outperformed Ramirez this year when they've played. Those other guys you mentioned aren't the level of hitters Keaschall, Larnach, and Bell are.

[farmerguychris]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

So, never call him up realistically?

Like most rookies - unless he's banging down the door - like Lewis did - bring him up when a position is open - such as due to injury.  Like Zoll said - we don't really have a spot for another left handed OF right now.  With that said - its only a matter of time until a LH OF gets hurt for us if you know our history.

[chpettit19]

3 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I'm not arguing if they are or not....I'm arguing, if the Twins think this, why won't they bring them all back? 

Again, because Bell will be older and Larnach will be more expensive. And there will be other signings and trades and roster moves. That doesn't mean they won't bring them back, but it's reasons why that question has nothing to do with the situation right now. These 2 things are not tied together.

And why shouldn't they if they do? You know I wanted them to complete the rebuild and go young this year. But they didn't. And Bell and Larnach have performed. Jenkins is not guaranteed to be a success. Ever. And injuries will happen next year. Just like they happen every year. Way too much emphasis on the opening day roster or him being called up now. Not calling him up now when there's no everyday job available isn't some sign that they'll never call him up or they're afraid of rookies or whatever claim people want to attach to it. They just called Culpepper up for goodness sake. But that was to replace Kreidler. A guy who is clearly not a guy who should be playing more than sparingly in a utility defensive specialist role. It's not Buxton, Keaschall, Larnach, or Bell. 4 guys who've very clearly established that they are every day, or strong side platoon, players.

No team moves aside legitimate vets for rookies in a playoff race. And the discussion about bringing them back next year is so much bigger than this conversation about calling him up now.

[chpettit19]

42 minutes ago, tjwilliams said:

The "super-young" argument doesn't really hold water, I don't think.

Walker Jenkins is the oldest, most-experienced top prospect who is still at AAA.

Here's what I mean by that: I looked at the Top 50 ESPN prospects (they just updated their list today). Of all the prospects who are as old or older than Jenkins, four are currently in the majors, eight are at AA or below and five are at AAA. Of the five at AAA, here is their experience level there - 

Walker Jenkins - 86 GP, 380 PA (started the season at AAA)
Aidan Miller - 8 GP, 37 PA (started the season at AA)
Cam Cannarella - 23 GP, 101 PA (started the season at A+)
Seaver King - 49 GP, 220 PA (started the season at AA)
Thomas White - 5 GS, 81 BF (started the season at A)

No Top 50 prospect currently at AAA is older than Jenkins, with more experience at that level than he has. Even factoring in his injury time, Jenkins has more experience this year at AAA than any prospect his age. And he's the only top prospect at his age (or older) who started the season at AAA who has not yet been called up.

And if you look at the guys who are older than Jenkins and in the majors now, they all have roughly the same AAA experience (if not less) as he has had:

Max Clark - 90 GP, 418 PA (two months older than Jenkins)
Angel Genao - 72 GP, 309 PA (nine months older than Jenkins)
Kaelen Culpepper - 74 GP, 343 PA
Luis Lara - 78 GP, 346 PA (three months older than Jenkins)

It is just not the case that Walker Jenkins is "super-young." Are there older prospects still below him? Certainly. But all of the prospects his age or older who started the season at AAA are now in the majors and the only prospects his age or older who are currently at AAA didn't start the season there and have significantly less AAA experience than him.

I'm not sure what this is supposed to establish. Jenkins isn't the only 21 or younger player? How many 21 or younger players are in the majors? 21 is still "super-young" for the majors. And it's quite the trick to say "older than Jenkins" and then list 3 guys just months older than him. 2 months is really some meaningful data point for proving he isn't young?

40 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Facts. What are they good for? I think every guy drafted before him his year is in the majors, and more than a few after....

How many of the guys drafted before him have been injured as often as him? 3 of those guys were college superstars multiple years older than him. What do they have to do with whether or not Jenkins is still young for the majors?

[chpettit19]

21 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Let's pretend Buxton gets hurt, and they actually IL him right away (hahahahaha).....are they calling up Jenkins for 10 games? I think not. 

Why not?

[Riverbrian]

1 minute ago, Mike Sixel said:

Let's pretend Buxton gets hurt, and they actually IL him right away (hahahahaha).....are they calling up Jenkins for 10 games? I think not. 

If the question is what would I do.

I just might be different than Zoll, different than you and different than Chia Pet.

If it was me. I still have a pecking order. I really want Erod up first. I want to reduce the spillage. This club needs to develop Jenkins plus others.