Can the Twins and Astros Match-Up On a Trade for a Left-Handed Bat?

[Parfigliano]

6 hours ago, twinfan said:

I can see trading Castro but not the other two unless we would get a very good return. The problem with deadline deals is you take on prospects which, if not clearly ready for the majors, can be just fillers of minor league rosters. However, if the front office feels we are not going to be contenders for a couple of years, they will probably go forward with those type of deals. So, are we closer to being a contender or closer to sinking to the bottom of the division?

Sinking to bottom of division

[Coach Wheels]

Im not interested in trading any of the OF mentioned in this post, all 3 are young and Larnach has shown improvement this year. 

Castro can be moved and bring solid talent back; starting pitching based on the last month, seems necessary again.

[RpR]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

Because for his career he's been nearly forty percent better than the average hitter. If that's not something to be high on.....

Darn , a pig just flew by my window.

[tony&rodney]

6 hours ago, Cory Engelhardt said:

I guess I see as close to zero chance that Wallner is traded as just about anyone in the organization. I'd be open to being wrong, but being a MN native and able to carry enormous ops's for long stretches of time, I don't see him getting moved.

You are almost certainly correct. However, let us just say that the front office really wanted to find a path to putting a winning team together. In that event, isn't it possible that some other team sees great potential in Wallner and is willing to trade a really good prospect for him? Wallner is pretty much all or nothing. His offense can be fun to watch. Realistically though, he will never be ok on the bases or in the field. I'm hoping that Matt Wallner becomes hugely successful as much as anyone on this site. I also wonder how the Twins will ever be a team to win like teams from 2001-2010 again. 

I don't have an answer but the current roster cannot defend adequately or create runs. In order to win, the Twins need almost everything to click. It did in May and it will again. Is it sustainable over two months?

Last November I saw huge value in moving Wallner. Then again, I believed that November of 2023 was a prime time to trade Edouard Julien and Royce Lewis. I was also willing to trade one of our 3 top starting pitchers for the right deal. I'll keep watching though.

FWIW, right now I'm watching Milwaukee use contact, speed, and defense versus Pittsburgh and Paul Skenes. The Brewers are fun to watch. They play smart too. They have not run on Oneill Cruz. If you will recall they ran freely on every Twin.

[Riverbrian]

1 hour ago, beckmt said:

If you are not going to compete for this year, Jenkins, Rodrequez, Gonzales could all be here next year.  I know Jenkins is a left handed bat and don't know about the other two.  You also have Lee and Castro who are  switch hitters and more coming.  Plus Sabato might make it here and is another 3 true outcome players.  We need to figure out who can make it and who can't.  Will never do that with players being blocked. 

Jenkins and Emma are lefties. Gonzalez and Sabato are righties. 

This whole discussion just drives me crazy. Houston wants a left handed bat. I get it... they are tremendously right handed.

The Twins are constantly looking for right handed bats despite being tremendously right handed to begin with and the few left handed hitters that we retain are punished for being left handed. They sit against left handed starters and we pull them from the game if a lefty enters the game. 

At some point in time... The Twins just need to think about developing and acquiring hitters period. Developing them prospects completely and we need to stop strip mining them for parts. 

They need to stop trying to build Frankenstein... because those parts wear out after a year and need replacement every off-season.  

If we have 7 lefthanded hitters on the 26 man roster so be it... in fact... it would be awesome since 75% of the pitching is right handed. As it stands right now... 4 left handed hitters on a Twins roster is over stocked because we don't have enough right handed hitters to cover. 

I am so platooned out... I can't stand it and I just have no room in my heart for any team looking for a left handed hitter or right handed hitter specifically. If a GM tried to explain it to me... I'd tell him to knock it off and... 

Just Go find hitters! The development price tag and roster space price tag isn't worth the tiny percentage gains in one or two individual AB's out of 6,000 plus that teams take during a given season. 

Just go FIND HITTERS.  

[Riverbrian]

7 hours ago, Schmoeman5 said:

Yes. Trade Trevor Larnach please. 

If I was Trevor... I'd want out. 

All in all, it's his Dad's fault for two reasons.

1. Not realizing that the Twins would draft him.

2. Letting him swing left handed as a child when he clearly throws right handed or... or...  providing the gene that makes swing from that goofy side of the plate.  

 

[Cory Engelhardt]

10 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

You are almost certainly correct. However, let us just say that the front office really wanted to find a path to putting a winning team together. In that event, isn't it possible that some other team sees great potential in Wallner and is willing to trade a really good prospect for him? Wallner is pretty much all or nothing. His offense can be fun to watch. Realistically though, he will never be ok on the bases or in the field. I'm hoping that Matt Wallner becomes hugely successful as much as anyone on this site. I also wonder how the Twins will ever be a team to win like teams from 2001-2010 again. 

I don't have an answer but the current roster cannot defend adequately or create runs. In order to win, the Twins need almost everything to click. It did in May and it will again. Is it sustainable over two months?

Last November I saw huge value in moving Wallner. Then again, I believed that November of 2023 was a prime time to trade Edouard Julien and Royce Lewis. I was also willing to trade one of our 3 top starting pitchers for the right deal. I'll keep watching though.

FWIW, right now I'm watching Milwaukee use contact, speed, and defense versus Pittsburgh and Paul Skenes. The Brewers are fun to watch. They play smart too. They have not run on Oneill Cruz. If you will recall they ran freely on every Twin.

I mean, I'm all for making smart deals, and I agree player changes should be made. 

[DJL44]

5 hours ago, Rod Carews Birthday said:

I would like to see the Twins do a little selling and a little buying at the deadline.  

Sell at the deadline, buy in the offseason when the price is lower.

[Schmoeman5]

1 hour ago, Riverbrian said:

If I was Trevor... I'd want out. 

All in all, it's his Dad's fault for two reasons.

1. Not realizing that the Twins would draft him.

2. Letting him swing left handed as a child when he clearly throws right handed or... or...  providing the gene that makes swing from that goofy side of the plate.  

 

Actually he started off as a switch hitter. But around 12 or 13 it was strictly left. He had more power from the right side. I only said that because if he were traded to the Astros I might get to watch Oct baseball.  Lol. 

[old nurse]

1 hour ago, RpR said:

Darn , a pig just flew by my window.

Career OPS+ 131, Career WRC+ 137. Mike eas a little at at forty, but not so much as to deserve your comment 

[Riverbrian]

12 minutes ago, Schmoeman5 said:

Actually he started off as a switch hitter. But around 12 or 13 it was strictly left. He had more power from the right side. I only said that because if he were traded to the Astros I might get to watch Oct baseball.  Lol. 

LOL... C'mon... You gotta believe in your team... through thick and thin. 

Shoulda stuck with the switch hitting. 

It's not too late. There are things that he can do.

1. During meals. Make him apply the salt and pepper at the same time with a shaker in each hand.

2. When chopping wood... make him go to the other side of the tree but make sure that he doesn't lose focus on where the house and car is located.

3. When he dances... let his wife or girlfriend lead. They end up leading in everything else in life so that alone will free his mind up for getting his feet/base set.  

If he follows those three steps, he will have it down in no time. He doesn't have to be real good at it. Just being a switch hitter will get him in the lineup for 162 games.  

[Schmoeman5]

17 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

LOL... C'mon... You gotta believe in your team... through thick and thin. 

Shoulda stuck with the switch hitting. 

It's not too late. There are things that he can do.

1. During meals. Make him apply the salt and pepper at the same time with a shaker in each hand.

2. When chopping wood... make him go to the other side of the tree but make sure that he doesn't lose focus on where the house and car is located.

3. When he dances... let his wife or girlfriend lead. They end up leading in everything else in life so that alone will free his mind up for getting his feet/base set.  

If he follows those three steps, he will have it down in no time. He doesn't have to be real good at it. Just being a switch hitter will get him in the lineup for 162 games.  

I still believe they can turn it around.  And as far as the 3 steps. The salt and pepper part he might do. He did his obligatory dance with his wife and his momma at his wedding but other than that I've never seen him dance. And as far as chopping wood. I'll leave it right there. 😃 

[Road trip]

52 minutes ago, old nurse said:

Career OPS+ 131, Career WRC+ 137. Mike eas a little at at forty, but not so much as to deserve your comment 

To add some context, your all time Twins career OPS+ numbers:

Killer - OPS+ 143
Tony O - OPS+ 131
Sir Rodney - OPS+ 131
Wallner - OPS+ 131
Herbie - OPS+ 128
Kirby - OPS+ 124 (this one was interesting and surprising to me, as Kirby's forced early retirement kept him from hurting his career numbers by going through a decline phase - I thought it would have been higher)
Mauer - OPS+124
Morneau - OPS+120

Sure...Wallner likely won't maintain his career numbers, but he doesn't have to.  If you can't be excited about the totality of what he has done thus far you aren't looking at the company he is keeping.

So yeah, don't trade him for anything other than an offer you can't refuse.


 

[tony&rodney]

25 minutes ago, Road trip said:

To add some context, your all time Twins career OPS+ numbers:

Killer - OPS+ 143
Tony O - OPS+ 131
Sir Rodney - OPS+ 131
Wallner - OPS+ 131
Herbie - OPS+ 128
Kirby - OPS+ 124 (this one was interesting and surprising to me, as Kirby's forced early retirement kept him from hurting his career numbers by going through a decline phase - I thought it would have been higher)
Mauer - OPS+124
Morneau - OPS+120

Sure...Wallner likely won't maintain his career numbers, but he doesn't have to.  If you can't be excited about the totality of what he has done thus far you aren't looking at the company he is keeping.

So yeah, don't trade him for anything other than an offer you can't refuse.


 

Wow. You put Matt Wallner in a list with Harmon, Tony, Rod, Kent, Kirby, Joe, and Justin. All of those players had years where they had plate appearances at, near, or above Wallner's career. Wallner has not, is not, and will never be in any reasonable conversation as close to any of the players you list. It isn't fair to him or to the excellence of those other players to write them together. Brant Alyea, however,  is a good comparison and there are others if you know their names.

We all hope Wallner gets some hits this year, but please use Brant Alyea and his 1970 OPS+ of 142 if you want to compare similar players. 

[TheLeviathan]

I don't love how we line up with them on need.  Their starter Ullola would fit nice, but everyone else is further away than I'd target.  

This team should be targeting AA and AAA talent.

[Mike Sixel]

3 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

I don't love how we line up with them on need.  Their starter Ullola would fit nice, but everyone else is further away than I'd target.  

This team should be targeting AA and AAA talent.

Agreed. There are better teams to deal with..

[TwinsDr2021]

14 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Wow. You put Matt Wallner in a list with Harmon, Tony, Rod, Kent, Kirby, Joe, and Justin. All of those players had years where they had plate appearances at, near, or above Wallner's career. Wallner has not, is not, and will never be in any reasonable conversation as close to any of the players you list. It isn't fair to him or to the excellence of those other players to write them together. Brant Alyea, however,  is a good comparison and there are others if you know their names.

We all hope Wallner gets some hits this year, but please use Brant Alyea and his 1970 OPS+ of 142 if you want to compare similar players. 

You aren't following the rules of the site, the rules are to make outlandish comparisons of current Twins players or prospects to all star/HOF type players regardless of they have anything close to similar situations and then defend that comparison by saying I am not really comparing to them just that something similar happened to them and any real comparison might make me feel bad about my opinion or the player . Or wild statements like Wallner was a top 20 hitter last year, but was 330th in at bats, tied for 157th in HRs, tied for 191st in doubles and tied for 90th in WAR or that he somehow belongs on a list of Hall of Famers after never have played more than 75 games in a season. 

[Road trip]

15 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Wow. You put Matt Wallner in a list with Harmon, Tony, Rod, Kent, Kirby, Joe, and Justin. All of those players had years where they had plate appearances at, near, or above Wallner's career. Wallner has not, is not, and will never be in any reasonable conversation as close to any of the players you list. It isn't fair to him or to the excellence of those other players to write them together. Brant Alyea, however,  is a good comparison and there are others if you know their names.

We all hope Wallner gets some hits this year, but please use Brant Alyea and his 1970 OPS+ of 142 if you want to compare similar players. 

That is a fair critique.  No, I don't believe Wallner will enter the Twins inner circle, and stated I expect his career OPS to drop.  Forced to guess, I'd say a career OPS+ around 110 or 115.  Valuable, but not elite.  I have no meaningful memory of Alyea, but I do expect Wallner to have a better career than some other young outfielders we had hope for like Cordova, D Young, Kielty, etc.  Hey, maybe I'm totally wrong and Wallner's just a modern day version of Randy Bush (limited defensively, only a platoon bat). But Bush never had a start like this, or really any year like Wallner's 2024...and yet he still put in a dozen pretty useful years with the Twins.  

 

 

[tony&rodney]

2 minutes ago, Road trip said:

That is a fair critique.  No, I don't believe Wallner will enter the Twins inner circle, and stated I expect his career OPS to drop.  Forced to guess, I'd say a career OPS+ around 110 or 115.  Valuable, but not elite.  I have no meaningful memory of Alyea, but I do expect Wallner to have a better career than some other young outfielders we had hope for like Cordova, D Young, Kielty, etc.  Hey, maybe I'm totally wrong and Wallner's just a modern day version of Randy Bush, but Bush never had a start like this, or really any year like Wallner's 2024...and yet he still put in a dozen pretty useful years with the Twins.  

 

 

I'm hopeful for Wallner too. Sometimes my reactions are a grumpy old man when comparisons with HOF players get made, such as a time when a poster compared a player to Willie Mays. The players work very hard, in my opinion, to find success but baseball is a tough game because so many adjustments must be made all the time. The history of any franchise is full of guys who look promising, get injured too often, and fade away. The plethora of statistics used today can be selected to make a number of players seem more productive than they may be in actuality. Wallner has shown some promise, Twins Daily writers have touted him in various ways, Matt has crushed a few balls, there are stats to make Wallner look handsome, and there is the everyday reality of the struggle against major league pitchers. I found myself saying "C'mon Matt, stay back and drive the ball" ...... "Let's go Matt, make the pitcher come to you" ..... and so forth last night. He is doing the best he can. I hope he comes out of his trance today but he is at least 5-7 years away and 3,000 plate appearances shy of comparisons to certain players. BTW, Brant Alyea was really good in several years of limited at bats.