Ripple Effects: Cities Disconnect

[Riverbrian]

2 hours ago, The Great Hambino said:

The most damning part of all of this is this part of their response to Comcast dropping Bally in May:

 

"The Twins have no role or voice in this matter."

 

Really?  You couldn't have possibly foreseen the channel that's been falling off platforms left and right might have additional carriage issues?  

Yet another piece of evidence that they have zero long-term vision.  They could've been out on the front end of what is clearly where baseball broadcasts are headed while keeping promises made to the fanbase and doing something to engage with younger fans.  A lot of the people cutting the cord right now are the people that could potentially be bringing families to the park five-ten-fifteen years from now.  Might have hurt the short-term cash flow a little (which we've been told was mitigated by the decrease in payroll) but it could've paid off big time down the road. 

Paying something now for a larger payoff in the future: that's literally the definition of investment.

You are correct.

All anyone has to do is look at the demographics of those still with cable. Mostly older folks. 

Cable isn't reaching younger demographics because they have already cut the cord... and surprise surprise... as a result... baseball demographics look a lot the cable audiences. Mostly older folks.  

Makes perfect sense that both demo's are similar since cable is the sole vehicle utilized to deliver their product to the masses.

Hey lookie here... Cable and Baseball have the same demo's... how did that happen?  

Those who have a young family to bring to the game RIGHT NOW they have no idea what channel 623 is.    

Baseball marketing shouldn't be targeting the same folks the marketing teams for medication, hearing aids and bathroom grab bars are trying to reach if they want to have a decent sized audience in 15 years. 

 

    

[Brock Beauchamp]

3 hours ago, LastOnePicked said:

I think the word "idiot" is often overused. Most people in positions of leadership are fairly smart, fairly capable of making decent decisions peppered with mistakes.

But I'm not sure it would be overused in this case. How could Twins leadership not have a plan to build off of the Correa signing, to steer away from Bally's bankruptcy, to hook new fans on streaming packages, and to re-establish a window of contention in the process. Twins could have hooked a new generation of fans, all while reaping the immediate benefits of gate receipts, merchandise and playoff pool money. $50M spent this year is potentially hundreds of millions of added revenue by 2030.

Thankfully, all those involved in this debacle have been fired. Wait, they haven't? No consequences for leadership at all? Those idiots.

Fantastic post. 

[Major League Ready]

1 hour ago, Linus said:

That takes care of the condescending part…..

I guess I would have won the bet.  It's a bit ironic that someone complains about spending $120 to get an MLB package but expects the team to disregard profitability.  

[lukeduke1980]

I thought this was a great piece.  Well written.  I think on top of accessibility,  growing apathy has been fueled by lack of star power, driven by injuries, performance, development, strategy.   I'm afraid the team probably has to make some smart trades to get some impact youth, and then pray for health, and then let them play baseball. 

[Brock Beauchamp]

2 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

No doubt that would have been ideal for customers who are unwilling to pay the current cost of coverage. 

Good businesses follow where the customers want to go, not force customers to chase them.

[David Maro]

All this shows is this is a minor league organization trying to be something they aren't.And the pajama looking city connect uniforms need to be put in the trash,they are bad luck.

[TheLeviathan]

This team had the second best record in the AL in July.  They were playing a fun, high scoring brand of baseball.  What did Target Field look like?  Ghost town.

The disconnect is deeper than wins and losses.  It's a culmination of decades of malfeasance on the part of the organization.  Their broadcasting plans have always been pure foolishness.  They thought partnering with a streaming service charging $25 a month was a viable platform.  They avoided opportunity after opportunity to put their product in front of their fans.

They have systematically killed baseball loving culture in this town.  The on-field product hasn't helped (playoff streak, Yankee dominance, etc) but ownership has always been condescending, cheap, and idiotic.  

They're reaping the rewards.

[Craig Arko]

5 minutes ago, TheLeviathan said:

This team had the second best record in the AL in July.  They were playing a fun, high scoring brand of baseball.  What did Target Field look like?  Ghost town.

The disconnect is deeper than wins and losses.  It's a culmination of decades of malfeasance on the part of the organization.  Their broadcasting plans have always been pure foolishness.  They thought partnering with a streaming service charging $25 a month was a viable platform.  They avoided opportunity after opportunity to put their product in front of their fans.

They have systematically killed baseball loving culture in this town.  The on-field product hasn't helped (playoff streak, Yankee dominance, etc) but ownership has always been condescending, cheap, and idiotic.  

They're reaping the rewards.

The advertising was also abominable. They kept running these ads about exciting baseball featuring Correa and Buxton, when of course neither was to be found on the field. Some flexibility and adaptation to what’s really going on would have helped. They had good players like Lopez, Ober, Jax, Wallner and even Santana they might have pimped better.

[Riverbrian]

16 hours ago, Craig Arko said:

The advertising was also abominable. They kept running these ads about exciting baseball featuring Correa and Buxton, when of course neither was to be found on the field. Some flexibility and adaptation to what’s really going on would have helped. They had good players like Lopez, Ober, Jax, Wallner and even Santana they might have pimped better.

I listened to those ads and was thinking the same thing as you. They can't update their advertising package to fit the context of the day?

Voiceover talent should be on the ready and production should be on retainer, distribution should be already in place so that new ad produced Friday Night after the July 5 game can be all over the ****ing place on Saturday Morning. The Ad should go something like this.

It's rare to see something that only comes around every 70 years. Something that only comes around every 70 years is special. Today you can tell everybody that you were there to see it. Jose Miranda has 10 straight hits. That's hard to do. The All-Time baseball record of 12 was set back in 1952. Can Jose do it two more times... can he do it three more times... when will the Jose Miranda hit streak come to stop. Come see for yourself. Come to Target Field today at 1:10 and watch Jose Miranda go for history. 

Can't do that because they set it and forget it with ads produced back in March. 

 

 

 

[Major League Ready]

2 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Good businesses follow where the customers want to go, not force customers to chase them.

Are people who are unwilling to pay for coverage "customers".  $120 will get you coverage of 81 games.  There are people here who elect to go without coverage for 75 cents a game and then complain about what the team is spending.  

[spanman2]

7 hours ago, Vanimal46 said:

If Dave St Peter worked in a marketing/demand generation role at any other company with these results, he would have been fired years ago. Unfortunately he has a lifetime pass to the Twins Country Club. 

I’m very concerned that he is leading the TV contract negotiations. He is so far behind the times it’s crazy. 

Well said...lifetime membership for certain!  Would be interesting to shadow him for a day.  See what he does for his big $$$.

[chpettit19]

29 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

Are people who are unwilling to pay for coverage "customers".  $120 will get you coverage of 81 games.  There are people here who elect to go without coverage for 75 cents a game and then complain about what the team is spending.  

What service gets you coverage of exactly half the games?

[spanman2]

On the penultimate game of the 2024 season, a fan brought an anti-Pohlad sign to the game. Yes, it was hostile and inflammatory...

Spare me...what was hostile or inflammatory about it.  Common interviewed him yesterday and it was quite interesting.  

 

[USAFChief]

13 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

What service gets you coverage of exactly half the games?

Exactly. And For $120?

 

Or for .75 cents a game?

 

 

[Major League Ready]

2 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

What service gets you coverage of exactly half the games?

MLB.TV

[Steve Lein]

5 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

No doubt that would have been ideal for customers who are unwilling to pay the current cost of coverage.  Let's keep in mind that going away from Bally's would have meant that every customer currently paving for a Bally's provider would have been forced to pay an additional fee for streaming.  There are no perfect fixes to and changing market such as this one and it does not change the fact the poster could have gotten coverage and elected not to do so. 

If you give consumers the two options of:

A: $20/month to be able to stream Twins games, or 

B: $100+/month to have whatever cable package carries Bally's to watch Twins games...

I can guarantee you're going to have more people paying for that streaming option than the full cable package when the product in question is only Twins games. 

The major issue on this is Option A didn't even get put on the table. 

As Riverbrian has pointed out, Cable TV as a product is rolling it's death saving throws at this point, at disadvantage because of it's user's demographics. Just put it out of it's misery already. Certainly don't blame the consumer base that is rejecting them for obvious reasons like you are here.

[chpettit19]

11 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

MLB.TV

Yeah, next time you want to be this condescending and blame customers for clearly poor business plans maybe at least know what you're talking about.

Your belief is that Ballys signed an exclusive distribution rights deal with the Twins that barred the Twins from streaming home games only? You can't stream any game that the Twins are playing in if you live in their home market. Whether they're playing at Target Field or in Antarctica. That's what "exclusive" means. 

[Brock Beauchamp]

1 hour ago, Major League Ready said:

Are people who are unwilling to pay for coverage "customers".  $120 will get you coverage of 81 games.  There are people here who elect to go without coverage for 75 cents a game and then complain about what the team is spending.  

[Riverbrian]

3 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

This team had the second best record in the AL in July.  They were playing a fun, high scoring brand of baseball.  What did Target Field look like?  Ghost town.

The disconnect is deeper than wins and losses.  It's a culmination of decades of malfeasance on the part of the organization.  Their broadcasting plans have always been pure foolishness.  They thought partnering with a streaming service charging $25 a month was a viable platform.  They avoided opportunity after opportunity to put their product in front of their fans.

They have systematically killed baseball loving culture in this town.  The on-field product hasn't helped (playoff streak, Yankee dominance, etc) but ownership has always been condescending, cheap, and idiotic.  

They're reaping the rewards.

Exactly, Winning team for most of the year. Attendance didn't seem to reflect that.  

If your marketing team isn't pumping the second best record in July. People won't know that they had the 2nd best record in July. They won't know that something is happening in July. 

If it's not selling the Jose Miranda hit streak as it happens, you don't sell seats you could have sold on July 6th. If it's not selling the Royce Lewis Grand Slams after one occurs, the arrival of Brooks Lee and David Festa, Matt Wallner exit velocities over 1 million miles an hour.

Your Marketing team isn't pumping out positives. 

If you don't pump out positives what is going to fill the void? 

Negatives will fill the void. The Pohlads are cheap, the Twins don't care about winning, Rocco Baldelli is a terrible manager becomes the narrative. 

If you don't market your team, sell your team... others will do it for you and the others... you clearly don't want them marketing your team.

Because it'll start looking like a Twinsdaily game thread.     

[USAFChief]

7 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

This team had the second best record in the AL in July.  They were playing a fun, high scoring brand of baseball.  What did Target Field look like?  Ghost town.

?

The Twins were 12-11 in July, good for 7th best in the AL (13th in MLB.) They did go 6-5 at TF in July.

Both the Tigers and Royals had better July records than the Twins.

BTW, the Twins averaged over 29,000 fans per game in July, by my quick, back of the napkin math. They drew over 320,000. 

I'm guessing you weren't among those of us who actually made it there, since you're obviously unaware of what actually took place.

[USAFChief]

2 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

Exactly, Winning team for most of the year. Attendance didn't seem to reflect that.  

If your marketing team isn't pumping the second best record in July. People won't know that they had the 2nd best record in July. They won't know that something is happening in July. 

If it's not selling the Jose Miranda hit streak as it happens, you don't sell seats you could have sold on July 6th. If it's not selling the Royce Lewis Grand Slams after one occurs, the arrival of Brooks Lee and David Festa, Matt Wallner exit velocities over 1 million miles an hour.

Your Marketing team isn't pumping out positives. 

If you don't pump out positives what is going to fill the void? 

Negatives will fill the void. The Pohlads are cheap, the Twins don't care about winning, Rocco Baldelli is a terrible manager becomes the narrative. 

If you don't market your team, sell your team... others will do it for you and the others... you clearly don't want them marketing your team.

Because it'll start looking like a Twinsdaily game thread.     

I guessing those in the game threads would have called BS on the marketing staff if they claimed "2nd best record in the AL in July."

I'll cut you some slack since you've told us you didn't pay much attention with the cable TV fiasco.

 

[Woof Bronzer]

3 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

MLB.TV

Tell me more about this 81 game Twins package on MLB.TV, sounds great!

[Riverbrian]

46 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

I guessing those in the game threads would have called BS on the marketing staff if they claimed "2nd best record in the AL in July."

I'll cut you some slack since you've told us you didn't pay much attention with the cable TV fiasco.

 

I suppose you also tell me that Wallner exit velo's are nowhere near a million miles an hour. 

 

[USAFChief]

11 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

I suppose you also tell me that Wallner exit velo's are nowhere near a million miles an hour. 

 

Well, we don't actually know, since the Twins marketing staff is so inept.

[TheLeviathan]

6 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

Exactly, Winning team for most of the year. Attendance didn't seem to reflect that.  

If your marketing team isn't pumping the second best record in July. People won't know that they had the 2nd best record in July. They won't know that something is happening in July. 

Because it'll start looking like a Twinsdaily game thread.     

No one needs reminders about that toxicity.  But I should be clear because I conflated two ideas in my head and misspoke, the Twins had the best record in baseball from May-mid August and were in the top 4 of the AL.  Fans weren't showing up in droves.

It's no longer strictly about winning, not in this market.

[TheLeviathan]

7 hours ago, Steve Lein said:

If you give consumers the two options of:

A: $20/month to be able to stream Twins games, or 

B: $100+/month to have whatever cable package carries Bally's to watch Twins games...

I can guarantee you're going to have more people paying for that streaming option than the full cable package when the product in question is only Twins games. 

The major issue on this is Option A didn't even get put on the table. 

As Riverbrian has pointed out, Cable TV as a product is rolling it's death saving throws at this point, at disadvantage because of it's user's demographics. Just put it out of it's misery already. Certainly don't blame the consumer base that is rejecting them for obvious reasons like you are here.

I'm here to tell you that Option A is a bad one too.  Sure, to hardcore baseball fans it seems great, but I guarantee you it's as good as dead at that price point.  Casual fans are not going to spent $20 a month for nothing but baseball.

Part of the dilemma here is that they waited too long for a viable long term solution.  They kept hitching their wagon to the death throws as long as they could milk a few bucks in the short term.

[USAFChief]

1 hour ago, TheLeviathan said:

I'm here to tell you that Option A is a bad one too.  Sure, to hardcore baseball fans it seems great, but I guarantee you it's as good as dead at that price point.  Casual fans are not going to spent $20 a month for nothing but baseball.

Part of the dilemma here is that they waited too long for a viable long term solution.  They kept hitching their wagon to the death throws as long as they could milk a few bucks in the short term.

$20/mo is the price for MLB.TV, single team.

$22/mo for all teams.

It won't be cheaper than that.

Of course, that's if the Twins actually allow streaming.

You and Majorleagueready should maybe brush up before commenting. 

 

[chpettit19]

7 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

I'm here to tell you that Option A is a bad one too.  Sure, to hardcore baseball fans it seems great, but I guarantee you it's as good as dead at that price point.  Casual fans are not going to spent $20 a month for nothing but baseball.

Part of the dilemma here is that they waited too long for a viable long term solution.  They kept hitching their wagon to the death throws as long as they could milk a few bucks in the short term.

Fans of 3 teams already are paying $20/month for nothing but baseball.

[Riverbrian]

6 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

No one needs reminders about that toxicity.  But I should be clear because I conflated two ideas in my head and misspoke, the Twins had the best record in baseball from May-mid August and were in the top 4 of the AL.  Fans weren't showing up in droves.

It's no longer strictly about winning, not in this market.

I knew what you meant.

Chief knew what you meant.

Chief knew what I meant by a million miles an hour. 

On August 17th... The Twins were 72-53. Just 2 games behind Cleveland. 2.5 games behind the Yankees. 

I believe you are right. It's not just about winning. 

 

[TheLeviathan]

3 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

Fans of 3 teams already are paying $20/month for nothing but baseball.

Do we have any numbers on how viable that is long term?  Padres and Diamondbacks went to this as a patch (the Twins should have as well) but they are making substantially less money this way in all likelihood.  And maybe that's just the pill they have to swallow going forward.

Padres are making 4.5M off of it.  Yeah - good as dead.  That isn't a viable strategy.  It might've made fans happy to have it on air temporarily but it's not a solution.