Gibson to bp?

[DEWunderlich]

What do you think about moving Gibbs to the bullpen? He seems like he's usually very solid the first time through the order and then g6ets bad after that.

[strumdatjaguar]

If the Twins trade for a stud starter, they will need to figure out who goes to the pen.  Consensus here is that Michael Pineda would go, partially so he pitches fewer innings and doesn't ruin his recuperating arm.  By the time the Twins are in the playoffs (if they don't fold), a four man rotation would then put two in the pen.   Then it's either Perez (if they need another lefty in the pen) or Gibson (who is a team player who would go where he can best help the team).

[Doomtints]

The question isn't whether or not Gibson can last 5-6 innings sometimes, the question is who would take over for him? The Twins don't have anybody else. Those minimum 3 solid innings have value and are more than the team would get from anybody else right now.

 

FYI, Gibson is second on the team in IP, so clearly he's not as bad as it seems.

[stringer bell]

Gibson is frustrating, but the overall numbers are decent. If the Twins do get another starter, perhaps a tag team of Pineda/Gibson or Pérez/Gibson would get all six starters enough innings to see who is going best when there is a stretch run or playoffs. The starters health has been excellent, so far. It stands to reason that one of the five will miss starts, so somehow I think the Twins can shoehorn six starters into five spots. 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Chris Schad would agree with the OP. https://puckettspond.com/2019/07/12/minnesota-twins-kyle-gibson-might-high-maintenance-pitcher-baseball/?utm_campaign=apple-news&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=apple-news

 

I would not... Gibson has been streaky, and maddeningly nibbly this season, however he has shown ability to throw strikes and work quickly. I think he can get there again, but if not, he’s still an improvement over Pineda and probably an improvement over Perez, most certainly better than AlkaSchmeltzer, who I like.

 

If the Twins trade for a frontline starter, moving Perez and his one stupid pitch to the Pen makes most sense. It’s a dang good pitch, but it seems a bit predictable in a starting pitcher role, like Mike Pelfrey.

[nicksaviking]

Yesterday was Gibson’s first traditional outing that didn’t go five innings. After Berrios, he’s the starter I have most faith in. I’d move Odorizzi, Perez or Pineda first.

[USAFChief]

Yesterday was Gibson’s first traditional outing that didn’t go five innings. After Berrios, he’s the starter I have most faith in. I’d move Odorizzi, Perez or Pineda first.

Yeah, I'd have to agree.

 

Quite a bit of overreaction to an outing where he had a somewhat tough inning, but gave up 1 earned run.

[nicksaviking]

Yeah, I'd have to agree.

Quite a bit of overreaction to an outing where he had a somewhat tough inning, but gave up 1 earned run.

And all the starters might look better if Sano and Adrianza switched positions.

[Mike Sixel]

I don't get this take. He's a number three starter. He gave up one earned run last night. It wasn't pretty, but still

[mrtwinsfan]

After the home run and the Big error by Ehire, { why is he at 1st adrianzza} anyway, Gibby was lost -alot of his issues r in his head,  got tired watching him - never seen him that slow - pace anyway, Does get old with him, But he does have Talent!!!

[Rosterman]

Moving Gibson to the pen would hurt his free agency value, unless, like Smoltz, you see him becoming a lights out closer as his career continues. That could be a possibility. Would he be GREAT in that type of role.

 

As it stands now, I would be hard-pressed to longterm Odorizzi, Gibson or Pineda beyond this season. Let them enter the free agent market. Of course, you could come back with an offer on any, but I don't see the need to keep any of them. I would rather spend the money elsewhere.

 

Which then brings to question who pitches for the Twins in 2020 and beyond. Of course, it would be nice if the Twins can trade for a rotation arm better than anyone they already have and continue control for at least another season or two.

 

You see the evils of prospects as Gonsalves and Romero are nowhere to be seen. Stewart is still a candidate. So is Thorpe. We see that Littel may have found a home out of the pen. All those #6 and beyond arms we thought we had going into the season have changed significantly. Smeltzer is now in the mix. So the Twins do have at least one replacement. They would have to add at least one free agent arm for 2020.

 

We have many hope, all who need at least one more season (if not two) in the minors. We can push the 20-year-old hard throwers.

 

But back to Gibson in the pen. IF we get a starter...would he be a candidate to be...say...THE CLOSER? If you stand a chance of losing him in the off-season, do you want to push him into such a valuable role? Of course, if the Twins actually get a CLOSER, that would also be moot. And like others have said, would rather see Perez as a lefty out of the pen, or perhaps Pineda to limit his innings even more.

 

I do suspect, at this time, that Pineda could be a return candidate for 2020 as his stock may not be as high as the Twins are currently paying him.

 

But we will see.

[prouster]

No.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Gibson is averaging just a hair over 5 IP per game and the MLB average is 5.4 IP.

 

Adjust for starting the season with E.coli and then getting just a single inning in his final start of the first half (due to him pitching in that double-length extra inning game) and you have a guy right around or above the MLB average in start length.

 

People really need to adjust their expectations of how many innings a modern MLB starter goes into a game. This has been going on for a long time now.

[jkcarew]

He was bad last night despite only the one earned run. But that hasn’t been the norm. Gibson’s FIP is 4.11 (to Barrios’s 3.83) and has a better K/9 and about the same H/9 as Berrios...and, as mentioned, has managed to log the 2nd most innings on the staff despite starting the year in recovery mode from the off-season illness.

 

I think several of the starters seem to be in small slumps, which happens over 6+ months of baseball. They don’t seem to have been over-worked...so, I’m optimistic on them bouncing back. In the meantime, the Twins should absolutely be looking for someone they evaluate ahead of Gibson and or Odorizzi (if not Barrios).

[jimbo92107]

On balance, you keep him in the rotation. Gibson got knocked off his Zen by a home run, and after that he started nibbling. We all know what happens when Gibson starts trying to nibble around the edges of the zone. He loses a little command on his breaking pitches, and his fast balls drift out of the zone by a foot. He's a thoroughbred, but he's a bit edgy. 

 

Hopefully Wes Johnson can help Gibson find his Zen again. When Gibby has his finely honed poise, he becomes one of the more effective pitchers in the league. He just needs to learn to breathe through his eyeballs. 

[ashbury]

Every pitcher works on the periphery of the strike zone, not down the middle. Few have the inherent stuff to do even the occasional "here it is, big boy, try to hit it" as a surprise. This whole narrative of "nibbling" is way out of proportion.

[yarnivek1972]

Every pitcher works on the periphery of the strike zone, not down the middle. Few have the inherent stuff to do even the occasional "here it is, big boy, try to hit it" as a surprise. This whole narrative of "nibbling" is way out of proportion.

Gibson has been a remarkably consistent strike thrower at a rate of a little over 61%. Yesterday, he was at 55%. So, that’s roughly 5 pitches out of the zone above his norm. After the Santana homerun, Gibson threw 30 pitches, 16 balls (actually one was hbp but still well out of the zone). For a guy that throws 61% strikes, a 30 pitch sequence where he throws more balls than strikes is definitely what I would call nibbling.

[ashbury]

Gibson has been a remarkably consistent strike thrower at a rate of a little over 61%. Yesterday, he was at 55%. So, that’s roughly 5 pitches out of the zone above his norm. After the Santana homerun, Gibson threw 30 pitches, 16 balls (actually one was hbp but still well out of the zone). For a guy that throws 61% strikes, a 30 pitch sequence where he throws more balls than strikes is definitely what I would call nibbling.

Alternative view: command that comes and goes. The homer was on a pitch that caught more of the plate than intended, while some of the other pitches during that span went the other way. The HBP seals the deal for the dugout staff, and Gibby's evening is over after just 80 pitches. Doesn't that do an equally good job of explaining the results?

 

 

[yarnivek1972]

Wouldn’t being a tad rattled after giving up a homerun and thus losing confidence also explain a sudden rash of wildness?

[ashbury]

Wouldn’t being a tad rattled after giving up a homerun and thus losing confidence also explain a sudden rash of wildness?

Given the choice, I always prefer a physical explanation over one that pretends to mind-read.

 

Here's another reason. If a pitcher is nibbling, his catcher can try to do something about it. Assuming this isn't their first game together, they talk before and after a game, and tendencies like this can be discussed. Or, if during the game the catcher notices what he considers to be an attempt to be too fine, he puts down the signal for the pitch and puts his glove more toward the middle of home plate. Among other remedies.

 

If it's a physical problem, there's not a darn thing the catcher can really do.

[Darius]

He’s having a rough stretch right now, but over the last year and half he’s been a pretty good starting pitcher. His floor right now is league average. No, you don’t move that to the pen. He’s just a back of the rotation guy.

 

If anyone is bumped from the rotation, I’d rather see Perez go. We need another lefty in the bullpen and I think he’d most benefit from not cycling through the order. Gibson’s issue is that he gets flustered with runners on and loses his command. I definitely don’t want that coming out of the pen in a high leverage situation in October.