Twins fire Dougie Baseball

[Linus]

He really was given some of the best talent in the whole minor leagues. I'm not sure how good a Manger he really was and it's pretty obvious he's not in the same mold as the FO. He was fired by his boss which is perfectly reasonable.

[Aaron Cross]

We must all remember, this organization has won ONE playoff series since 1991. Abominable. Embarrassing. Nobody should be upset with the old regime being purged. We need change badly.

[Ebby Calvin Laloosh]

I'm a big fan of Dougie Baseball. I like players who look like they are trying harder than everyone else. Yeah, guys like Robbie Cano are good and fun to watch but they make it look too easy. My favorite players are the ones who do well, but make it look hard. That's the way I played growing up, max effort at everything or else it isn't gonna work. 

 

That being said, he sure sounds petty after being fired. If that's the way you handle it, it just shows they made the right decision. We don't need that vitriol in our minor leagues.

 

I'm still blown away that Falvey and Levine weren't allowed to pick their own manager. I don't see much point in evaluating them based on this year. They are using someone else's pieces. Since the draft I've said "It looks like they have a plan." Let's let them execute it and then see whats up. I hope Molly goes next and then anyone else they want to fire. Gotta let them do their thing for a minute and see how it goes. Otherwise, why hire them?

[USAFChief]

Apparently minor league pitching coordinator Eric Rasmussen was let go last night as well.

[Brandon Warne]

 

Yes soft, aquire a serviceable back end starter who couldve contributed a few more wins and then panic and trade him for two powerball tickets.

 

Just so we're clear, you're talking about the guy with zero wins since the trade who has a 4.60 ERA, 7.4 K/9, 5.2 BB/9 and a WHIP of 1.71

[Brandon Warne]

 

He really was given some of the best talent in the whole minor leagues. I'm not sure how good a Manger he really was and it's pretty obvious he's not in the same mold as the FO. He was fired by his boss which is perfectly reasonable.

 

This. 

 

And furthermore, the Twins didn't cause the hurricane. Sure it sucks to find out when he did, but making him wait longer isn't going to make things better. Let's be reasonable here.

[gunnarthor]

Generally, I don't care if Dougie was upset and venting. He was just fired. I've been fired before and I sure as hell wouldn't be a beacon of grace in his shoes. Doesn't mean he's a bad guy or a bad manager. Maybe he is, maybe he isn't but none of us know. I hope he gets another job because I liked the guy and, IIRC, his wife or son was dealing with some medical issues and I don't want him unemployed.

 

At the end of the day, it's on Favley/Levine to run this ship and they get to do it how they see fit. They had a nice advantage of coming into a pretty solid system with good young players in place so they got a cushion. Whether or not they can create a minor league system that can restock the majors like Ryan did in the 2000s won't be answered for years. They had a nice first draft and it sounds like Steil is going to stick around, both good signs.

 

The only think I do think lacked grace was not having the call come from one of them. Dougie's been with the Twins a long time and was a key part of the team that fought against contraction. He means a lot to fans who have had to eat the Pohlad bull**** for years. They should have known that and treated him a bit better on the way out. But I don't think this means they are bad guys either, just maybe a little tone deaf.

[nowheresville]

Dougie's reaction to the firing, to me, is pretty strong evidence that letting him go was the right decision. It's never fun to be fired, but then to complain about the timing because they told you as soon as the decision was made, is childish. It's even worse to complain that he was fired by the guy who was his immediate supervisor, with whom he had a relationship, rather than directly by Falvey or Levine, who he even admits he's only talked to once. That's just complaining, publicly, for the sake of complaining. I've been in the position where I've been fired, because the head of the company changed and wanted to bring in his guy, but it was my boss, who I worked with on a daily basis, who officially gave me the news, and it would have been silly for me expect anything else.

 

I am curious about what this will mean for the other minor league coaches/managers. I spoke briefly with Tommy Watkins at the end of the season, and he was very aware that with the new management that no ones job was safe. The fact that Steil was promoted is a sign that the Twins are actually examining each position, and aren't just getting rid of people simply because they were brought in by the old regime.

[Doomtints]

He will land on his feet and manage in the minors again. This isn't a big deal.

[Squirrel]

 

Apparently minor league pitching coordinator Eric Rasmussen was let go last night as well.

Yep ... was mentioned in this thread ...

http://twinsdaily.com/topic/27527-twins-cut-ties-with-eric-rassmunsen/?do=findComment&comment=680891

[Blake]

 

Apparently minor league pitching coordinator Eric Rasmussen was let go last night as well.

Interesting.

 

Cleaning house after the minor league seasons are over. 

 

Looks to me like the new FO has spent the year looking through what they have before making decisions.

[Squirrel]

 

Interesting.

 

Cleaning house after the minor league seasons are over. 

 

Looks to me like the new FO has spent the year looking through what they have before making decisions.

Yes ... looks like they are done with their evaluations and have given everyone a chance and are now making their decisions. While we can disagree about whether or not Falvey/Levine should have/shouldn't have been the ones to deliver the news, and despite some of our personal feelings about Mientkievics, this is what happens in any business, including baseball, when new people take over. They evaluate, retain some, not retain others, institute changes in policy and long term strategy, move forward. If employees don't fit into this new strategy, well, that's that, as impersonal as it is. While I'm hesitant at this time to give Falvine a 'yea' or 'nay,' (the proof is in the pudding and I'm being patient for results that may not happen until next year), and may not always agree with their decisions with the here and now, it does appear that they have a long-term plan and are executing. Again, no 'yea' or 'nay' from me until I see into this off-season and next season.

[USAFChief]

Yep ... was mentioned in this thread ...

http://twinsdaily.com/topic/27527-twins-cut-ties-with-eric-rassmunsen/?do=findComment&comment=680891

I never read the minor league forum...

[dgwills]

Sounds like sour grapes to me. Nobody likes to get kicked out of the  country club. As far as using the hurricane to make the timing look worse, I just don't buy it. Key West is likely the worst place to live in the world if you don't like dealing with hurricanes. I doubt we'll be seeing Dougie move to Brainerd any time soon though.

[Squirrel]

 

I never read the minor league forum...

Obviously.

 

So was just helping you out.

[Blake]

 

Yes ... looks like they are done with their evaluations and have given everyone a chance and are now making their decisions. While we can disagree about whether or not Falvey/Levine should have/shouldn't have been the ones to deliver the news, and despite some of our personal feelings about Mientkievics, this is what happens in any business, including baseball, when new people take over. They evaluate, retain some, not retain others, institute changes in policy and long term strategy, move forward. If employees don't fit into this new strategy, well, that's that, as impersonal as it is. While I'm hesitant at this time to give Falvine a 'yea' or 'nay,' (the proof is in the pudding and I'm being patient for results that may not happen until next year), and may not always agree with their decisions with the here and now, it does appear that they have a long-term plan and are executing. Again, no 'yea' or 'nay' from me until I see into this off-season and next season.

I'm giving Falvey/Levine a cautious "thumbs up" due to what you said about giving everyone a chance. No knee jerk reactions from what I'm seeing.

 

Seems like the new FO may be taking an analytic approach to organization personnel.

[ThejacKmp]

Hmm, Dougie leaves town and blasts his former employer. That's surprising because? He did the same thing as a player when he left town - blasted Gardy, Morneau and Mauer along with the organization. I imagine the Twins will be glad to have let him go. As a manager, it isn't about you.

 

Jake Mauer for Twins manager!

[ThejacKmp]

 

Meintkiewicz handled it very poorly in the press by acting as a victim as though his job was somehow guaranteed or that he was deserving of "better" treatment than a normal employee. 

 

 

This is what he does. Morneau was clearly a better prospect and Doug's time was over in MN. Dougie could have left classily or he could have gone nuts to the press. He chose the press route. No one should be surprised.

 

Torii did the same thing. I never forgave him for that. The Twins offered Torii 3 years at $45 million, the Angels went 6 for $90 million. Torii chose the Angels and then went off on the Twins for not matching the offer. That's pretty crappy.

[ThejacKmp]

 

I'm a big fan of Dougie Baseball. I like players who look like they are trying harder than everyone else. Yeah, guys like Robbie Cano are good and fun to watch but they make it look too easy. My favorite players are the ones who do well, but make it look hard. That's the way I played growing up, max effort at everything or else it isn't gonna work. 

 

That being said, he sure sounds petty after being fired. If that's the way you handle it, it just shows they made the right decision. We don't need that vitriol in our minor leagues.

 

I'm still blown away that Falvey and Levine weren't allowed to pick their own manager. I don't see much point in evaluating them based on this year. They are using someone else's pieces. Since the draft I've said "It looks like they have a plan." Let's let them execute it and then see whats up. I hope Molly goes next and then anyone else they want to fire. Gotta let them do their thing for a minute and see how it goes. Otherwise, why hire them?

 

 

Just don't fire James Rowson. The work he's done with the hitting has been remarkable.

[mazeville]

Honestly, I cannot believe people are freaking out about the way in which Doug M was let go. So what if he wasn't fired by the GM. I'm nearly 100 percent certain that the CEO doesn't personally fire everybody under him. That is typically left up to workers' supervisors. And yet here it leads to charges of "classless" and all that. 

 

What are they supposed to do? Fly to Florida, personally hand Doug a pink slip and then hold him while he weeps over the lost job? 

 

He was let go by the minor league director, and someone who knew Doug far more than Falvey or Levine. There is nothing wrong with that.

 

 

[Vanimal46]

Good luck to Doug in his future endeavors. I for one am excited to see what else Falvine does as they build out the org in their vision.

[nicksaviking]

This is what he does. Morneau was clearly a better prospect and Doug's time was over in MN. Dougie could have left classily or he could have gone nuts to the press. He chose the press route. No one should be surprised.

 

Torii did the same thing. I never forgave him for that. The Twins offered Torii 3 years at $45 million, the Angels went 6 for $90 million. Torii chose the Angels and then went off on the Twins for not matching the offer. That's pretty crappy.

I agree with the Meintkiewcz take, not sure about Hunter though. I don't remember him blasting the team, I just remember him casually lamenting that they never actually gave him an offer, which no one on the team ever disputed to my knowledge.

[howeda7]

 

You can disagree with it, but if this means what I hope it means (Molitor won't be winning his job back no matter how far the Twins go)I think were in for a great future.  It's time for modern in game strategy trumping playing history as the criteria that matters most.  Fans don't have to like a move for it to be the right move.

Firing Molitor is not the same thing. The Pohlads like him. If he becomes the first manager to take turn a 100 loss team to a play-off team, it's still going to be very hard for Falvey to fire him.

[spinowner]

 

While I'm hesitant at this time to give Falvine a 'yea' or 'nay,' (the proof is in the pudding and I'm being patient for results that may not happen until next year), and may not always agree with their decisions with the here and now, it does appear that they have a long-term plan and are executing.

Concur, although it will probably take 3-5 years before the pudding can be evaluated. That's because this is baseball, where teams sign kids who are 16 years old hoping they'll be good players by age 25.

[crapforks]

I am a bit relieved about this firing. Doug was not being groomed to be Molitor's replacement and I think we all knew that. He had a sort of entitled air about him in the quotes leading up to the Molitor hiring. When most of us were certain that Molitor was done at the end of the year (July?) I had a thought that Doug would throw a tantrum over not being a shoe-in and it would get uglier when he wasn't chosen at all. He is old-school, as has been covered quite well in this thread, but he also seems to lack some ability to thrive behind the scenes rather than in the forefront. 

I know less than most here about his style of, or aptitude for, managing, but instinct tells me a few things:

He doesn't rely on the decision making processes that the front office have embraced- and he is vocally proud of that. That doesn't endear you to your new bosses.

He seems to prefer talking on the record without much of a filter. As I get older, I get more and more annoyed with people who feel that being a brash 'straight-shooter' is a valuable trait. I have employees whom I interview and hire. That is not a trait I seek out. Learning to read the room and being flexible in your ability to communicate is important.

There would be no easy way to end the relationship. Twins fans are at least as nostalgic as any other fanbase. I'm a little surprised by his on the record comments, but the Twins fans' reactions are not at all surprising. If you're going to make this move, make it ASAP and be done with it. 

[Brock Beauchamp]

Looks to me like the new FO has spent the year looking through what they have before making decisions.

Something smart managers do when entering a new organization.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I am a bit relieved about this firing. Doug was not being groomed to be Molitor's replacement and I think we all knew that. He had a sort of entitled air about him in the quotes leading up to the Molitor hiring. When most of us were certain that Molitor was done at the end of the year (July?) I had a thought that Doug would throw a tantrum over not being a shoe-in and it would get uglier when he wasn't chosen at all. He is old-school, as has been covered quite well in this thread, but he also seems to lack some ability to thrive behind the scenes rather than in the forefront.

I know less than most here about his style of, or aptitude for, managing, but instinct tells me a few things:

He doesn't rely on the decision making processes that the front office have embraced- and he is vocally proud of that. That doesn't endear you to your new bosses.

He seems to prefer talking on the record without much of a filter. As I get older, I get more and more annoyed with people who feel that being a brash 'straight-shooter' is a valuable trait. I have employees whom I interview and hire. That is not a trait I seek out. Learning to read the room and being flexible in your ability to communicate is important.

There would be no easy way to end the relationship. Twins fans are at least as nostalgic as any other fanbase. I'm a little surprised by his on the record comments, but the Twins fans' reactions are not at all surprising. If you're going to make this move, make it ASAP and be done with it.

Very well said.

[jimmer]

 

Honestly, I cannot believe people are freaking out about the way in which Doug M was let go. So what if he wasn't fired by the GM. I'm nearly 100 percent certain that the CEO doesn't personally fire everybody under him. That is typically left up to workers' supervisors. And yet here it leads to charges of "classless" and all that. 

 

What are they supposed to do? Fly to Florida, personally hand Doug a pink slip and then hold him while he weeps over the lost job? 

 

He was let go by the minor league director, and someone who knew Doug far more than Falvey or Levine. There is nothing wrong with that.

Even though I am a big fan of Doug M (still have a jersey with his name on it), I agree with all of this.

[Brandon Warne]

 

Just don't fire James Rowson. The work he's done with the hitting has been remarkable.

 

He's brilliant -- and not going anywhere. They hired him. 

[Brandon Warne]

 

Honestly, I cannot believe people are freaking out about the way in which Doug M was let go. So what if he wasn't fired by the GM. I'm nearly 100 percent certain that the CEO doesn't personally fire everybody under him. That is typically left up to workers' supervisors. And yet here it leads to charges of "classless" and all that. 

 

What are they supposed to do? Fly to Florida, personally hand Doug a pink slip and then hold him while he weeps over the lost job? 

 

He was let go by the minor league director, and someone who knew Doug far more than Falvey or Levine. There is nothing wrong with that.

 

And the primary defense is "he won down there."

 

Those guys have won up here. Falvey and Levine's teams both played in the World Series in the last half-decade, and they have the Twins doing pretty damn good right now. 

 

Benefit of the doubt is the least they've earned in a little less than a year here.