Make it Official: Twins 5, Tigers 0: Bailey Ober Dominates Yet Again

[Peter]

Total domination!!!

[Riverbrian]

10 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

Anybody see or hear of some problem with Larnach’s health? Seems pretty odd that he didn’t DH today with Jeffers getting the nod against a RH pitcher. I read somewhere tonight that Jeffers has a nuisance injury with a foot ……seems he would get/need the day off instead of a fairly hot Larnach - right? Wondering if maybe the pitcher today has bad reverse splits? ………forgot, didn’t see the first 5 innings - bullpen game. Margot did well regardless v. RH pitchers.

I haven't heard anything. However... if I were to speculate. The Tigers have a good mix of left handers and right handers in the bullpen for a bullpen game. 

In other words... they could go any direction so it's smart to have a left handed hitter on the bench for a bullpen game. 

If Rocco did things like that on occasion... I'd complain a little less about our platoon system because it wouldn't smell as rigid. 

Then again... maybe Larnach was hurt. 

 

[Patzky]

12 hours ago, FlyingFinn said:

Just looking at the hitting side, if you take his pinch hitting #'s out, he is the hitter we wanted in the trade (but not the fielder).

Having said that he ran some balls down Sunday.

[Riverbrian]

12 hours ago, darwin22 said:

'm sure most would agree that Vazquez is far superior defensively as well as with pitch calling/framing than Jeffers.  On the flip side, Jeffers bat has been far better (until recently) than what Vasquez has done since coming to the team last year.

Never thought I'd EVER and I mean EVER be writing this, but has the time come for Baldelli to bench Jeffers and give Vazquez 5+ starts each week?

After an outstanding April----.338 avg with 5 HRs, 18 RBI with a .424 OBP and .636 slug--Jeffers has totally cratered at the plate as evidenced by these putrid numbers:

May:  .214/.295/.536, but that was mitigated by good production..7 HRs and 18 RBI

June:  .161/.238/.232--------other numbers were gruesome:  1 HR and 5 RBI for the month in 56ABs

July:  Hitting .222 (12-54) with only 1 HR and 6 RBI.  Even with hit today, Jeffers is in a 3-31 funk since July 13th.

Vazquez on the other hand in July has proven to be much more productive:

Now hitting .324 this month (12-37) with 3 HRs and 7 RBI to go along with a plus .360 OBP.

I believe that you play a player when he is hot. I'm ok with Vazquez getting more starts for the time being. Two out of three starts is ok with me. 

The Twins and Rocco seem to play more of a long game. When Jeffers was hot and Vazquez was not hitting at a major league level at all or close to. Vazquez still started every other game. 

At the catcher position... my biggest concern remains... 17 games - 6 AB's.

In the near future... August, September, Playoffs... don't know when... I don't know who... but some time in the near future... I'm willing to bet that either Jeffers or Vazquez is going to be hurt.

When the injury or injuries happen. We will need Camargo. It will be an acute need at that time because of the playoff push and the season coming to a close. 

Our third catcher was not allowed to compete for a job when it wasn't quite as acute. He wasn't given a spoonful of experience in those 17 games (one tenth of the season) to put in his pocket for use when his name will be called out of necessity with the chips on the line. 

17 games - 6 AB's held back for 198 AB's - .554 OPS. 

Camargo or the free agent pile in the stretch run? Camargo or Barnhart? Camargo or Yan Gomes? 

 

[stringer bell]

4 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

I believe that you play a player when he is hot. I'm ok with Vazquez getting more starts for the time being. Two out of three starts is ok with me. 

The Twins and Rocco seem to play more of a long game. When Jeffers was hot and Vazquez was not hitting at a major league level at all or close to. Vazquez still started every other game. 

At the catcher position... my biggest concern remains... 17 games - 6 AB's.

In the near future... August, September, Playoffs... don't know when... I don't know who... but some time in the near future... I'm willing to bet that either Jeffers or Vazquez is going to be hurt.

When the injury or injuries happen. We will need Camargo. It will be an acute need at that time because of the playoff push and the season coming to a close. 

Our third catcher was not allowed to compete for a job when it wasn't quite as acute. He wasn't given a spoonful of experience in those 17 games (one tenth of the season) to put in his pocket for use when his name will be called out of necessity with the chips on the line. 

17 games - 6 AB's held back for 198 AB's - .554 OPS. 

Camargo or the free agent pile in the stretch run? Camargo or Barnhart? Camargo or Yan Gomes? 

 

Reese McGuire? LHH and decent defensive credentials. No minor league options though. If Jeffers is indeed affected by injury, perhaps they could claim him and put #27 on the IL.

[JD-TWINS]

9 hours ago, akmanak said:

Ober looked completely dialed in and simply dominated. Jeffers needs to make some adjustments.  

Again, can Cleveland please start losing when we  start winning. 

Both 4-6 over previous 10……they opened a window & we stumbled. Watching the daily results for the Guardians reminds me of Butch Cassidy & Sundance…., “who are those guys?”!!

[umterp23]

While Jeffers has struggled, I will give this guy a pass.  No one knows how he feels or is feeling except Jeffers, his wife and and family.  This month of July is probably very difficult for him as they were expected to give birth to their 2nd child.  Can't imagine having to give birth in March to a still born way ahead of schedule.  

Yes they say time heals all wounds but to play at a high level day in and day out and dealing with a tragedy at this magnitude .... Well I tip my hat to him and wish him nothing but success.

 

[JD-TWINS]

22 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

Reese McGuire? LHH and decent defensive credentials. No minor league options though. If Jeffers is indeed affected by injury, perhaps they could claim him and put #27 on the IL.

If there was really a “problem” with Jeffer’s foot seems he would not get the nod as DH today……IMO. My view of the Manager is he likes continuity and consistency in his decisions and for clubhouse vibe. The every other day catching approach isn’t going to be altered unless there’s a necessity due to injury.

[Old Twins Hat]

Willi Castro, what a day. 

All over the bases, three hits, running every which way, getting bulldozed by Wallner on that foul pop, having to hustle back to first on that amazing catch by the Detroit LF, only to have to turn on the jets again and circle the bases on Wallner's double,

He's the energizer: put him on the scorecard, wind him up and let him go.

[Patzky]

10 hours ago, akmanak said:

  

Again, can Cleveland please start losing when we  start winning. 

You know in a few weeks we'll see if both parties can agree to this.

[Riverbrian]

1 hour ago, stringer bell said:

Reese McGuire? LHH and decent defensive credentials. No minor league options though. If Jeffers is indeed affected by injury, perhaps they could claim him and put #27 on the IL.

Yep he's another consideration.

Although... it makes me sad to suggest other considerations.

I'd rather believe that Camargo has a shot. 

[Otaknam]

I’m not a big fan of how Rocco handles his pitching staff. If Ober had a no hitter going I think even the analytics driven Rocco would have sent him out for the ninth. Giving Thielbar a low stress inning wasn’t a bad idea, given how much he has struggled. 

[Squirrel]

15 hours ago, Mark G said:

I know I am spitting into the wind here, so to speak, but I just can't shake the thought of Ober having a one hit shutout going with only 98 pitches.  The pitcher hasn't been born yet that wouldn't want to finish that shutout; would it have been so dangerous to let him go out there and see how it goes?  I might be able to see it if we were trying to get Jax or Alcala or Duran an inning just to keep them in rhythm, or some sort of bullpen rotation plan, but Thielbar getting in a mop up inning?  For a so called players manager, he manages the company line far more than he manages his players.  

I don't know, maybe the game really has passed me by because I don't recognize that mindset at all.  

Yes, the game has passed many here. I see complaints all the time about pitcher usage and blaming one person for it, but this is league wide. This is baseball today. We also have to keep in mind that pitchers are pitching harder than ever today, with more spin than ever today. That is way more wear and tear on their arms and shoulders and bodies than the pitchers of yesteryear experienced. Some amount of protection is necessary. And who knows what pitchers want today? Most have grown up in this new era of usage. Ober didn’t seem upset with being pulled when he did. Remember, he went into this game not feeling well. There was some question whether or not he’d even be able to pitch, so, all considered I think him going 8 was great.

That said, yeah, we older fans still want to see it. But, more important to me was the win. More important to me is Ober’s next win, and the win after that and after that through the rest of the season. Consideration for the long game needs to be considered. So, I’m okay with pulling him when they did. Im okay with our starters going 6-7 innings, as Ryan, López and Ober mostly do when they are pitching well enough. Just wish we had a more consistent BP.

[LambchoP]

Obers pitching great. If Pablo can continue pitching well, we have a solid 1-2-3. Bullpen needs a lefty or two. Theilbar and Okert are not going to cut it. Also, I understand the need to sit guys every now and then, but the way Rocco does it is insane. Why did Lewis need a day off? He had only been back for two games, and he just hit a homer Saturday. If he needed some rest why not DH him to at least keep his bat in the lineup. Then he decides to sit Buxton the same day so we run out a lineup with no Buxton, Correa, Miranda or Lewis. We're lucky we were able to win this one at all....

[Squirrel]

24 minutes ago, LambchoP said:

Obers pitching great. If Pablo can continue pitching well, we have a solid 1-2-3. Bullpen needs a lefty or two. Theilbar and Okert are not going to cut it. Also, I understand the need to sit guys every now and then, but the way Rocco does it is insane. Why did Lewis need a day off? He had only been back for two games, and he just hit a homer Saturday. If he needed some rest why not DH him to at least keep his bat in the lineup. Then he decides to sit Buxton the same day so we run out a lineup with no Buxton, Correa, Miranda or Lewis. We're lucky we were able to win this one at all....

I love it when people complain about the game when we win as if we lost … 🙄🤪🙄

[Craig Arko]

1 minute ago, Squirrel said:

I love it when people complain about the game when we win as if we lost … 🙄🤪🙄

Didn’t you get the memo? All games won are by luck; all games lost are because Baldelli and the FO are incompetent. Innumerable references available. 

[Mike Sixel]

15 hours ago, Blyleven2011 said:

Nolan Ryan would throw 150 plus pitches to complete a game  ,  it's definitely a different game protecting the players because of the high salaries  ... 

Ober was a fantastic  artist of his craft today  ...

Pointing out outliers doesn't really make your point. Ryan is truly unique, as studies show. 

Ober was great, and I'm very confident in him. 

[Squirrel]

15 hours ago, Blyleven2011 said:

Nolan Ryan would throw 150 plus pitches to complete a game  ,  it's definitely a different game protecting the players because of the high salaries  ... 

Ober was a fantastic  artist of his craft today  ...

This is just a weird comp, and used to promote a fallacy. Nolan Ryan is almost in a league by himself with who he was. It also is truly a different era. And no, it’s not about protecting salaries, at least not directly. There are lots of recent studies/articles out there today about how damaging the current way of pitching is to pitchers, with higher velocities and spin rates. You could toss your pitchers out there for 100+ day in and day out but you are then going to have a lot of pitchers on the 60-IL. No team has the capacity to replace that. You will also shorten a pitcher’s career to abuse them like that, something no one wants, as yes, that does have salary, contract and earnings consequences. Plus, if you bothered to listen to any reports yesterday from the team, and in Baldelli’s post-game, which you obviously didn’t because it was the first thing he addressed, Ober was not well yesterday. They weren’t even for certain he would even be able to pitch. Many of you just want to lump each and every outing into the same because you’re oh so sad and emotional it’s not how things were and not what you want because you know better. Each and every outing has a different set of circumstances. Unfortunately, our emotional states seem not to allow for any nuanced thought.

[Blyleven2011]

6 hours ago, Squirrel said:

This is just a weird comp, and used to promote a fallacy. Nolan Ryan is almost in a league by himself with who he was. It also is truly a different era. And no, it’s not about protecting salaries, at least not directly. There are lots of recent studies/articles out there today about how damaging the current way of pitching is to pitchers, with higher velocities and spin rates. You could toss your pitchers out there for 100+ day in and day out but you are then going to have a lot of pitchers on the 60-IL. No team has the capacity to replace that. You will also shorten a pitcher’s career to abuse them like that, something no one wants, as yes, that does have salary, contract and earnings consequences. Plus, if you bothered to listen to any reports yesterday from the team, and in Baldelli’s post-game, which you obviously didn’t because it was the first thing he addressed, Ober was not well yesterday. They weren’t even for certain he would even be able to pitch. Many of you just want to lump each and every outing into the same because you’re oh so sad and emotional it’s not how things were and not what you want because you know better. Each and every outing has a different set of circumstances. Unfortunately, our emotional states seem not to allow for any nuanced thought.

Thanks for your vent ...

Boy you got me wrong  , I was just responding to a quote to another twins fan and that's all  ...

I will say you were right about me not listening to Baldelli pre or post game interviews  , I never listen to him  ....

We need a major league manager  ...

Thank you thank you very much ...

[Aerodeliria]

I am guessing that Jeffers is injured but keeps saying he is fine. This seems to happen from time-to-time. As a team, the Twins seem surprisingly slow at identifying injuries. Maybe it stems from the players who obviously really want to go out there and contribute, but it does seem that some players don't want to confess that they are hurting until the season has finished and they confess or worse, the injury is exasperated and becomes a much bigger problem. The margins for success and failure are so narrow at the MLB level that even a minor but nagging injury can be the difference between success and failure.

Is this happening on other teams as well or are the Twins just not that good at reading the tea leaves?