2023 MLB Draft Day 2 Thread

[Dave Borton]

13 minutes ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Looks like we got another high strikeout pitcher in Santos.   See what the staff can do with him.  Likely a senior sign to save a few dollars, or maybe they really like him.  

He just completed junior year. Trx'd in from Miami Dade CC.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

17 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Can? Sure. Likely? Um, no? 

Lets just look at the 2017-2021 drafts by the Twins excluding 2020. 

2017 -   Faucher 10th, Ober 12th

2018 -  Winder 7th, Williams 8th, helman 11th, Grace 13th Schulfer 19th  

2019- Headrick 9th, Varland 15th, Julien 18th   

2021 - Festa

The 2022 draft has several players that have a chance at being quality players drafted in the 6th round or later.  I don't know if you are just trying to be a negative nancy or what.  Yes each pick doesn't have a high probability but the Twins have shown they can consistently find ball players throughout the draft.  

[weitz41]

5 minutes ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Lets just look at the 2017-2021 drafts by the Twins excluding 2020. 

2017 -   Faucher 10th, Ober 12th

2018 -  Winder 7th, Williams 8th, helman 11th, Grace 13th Schulfer 19th  

2019- Headrick 9th, Varland 15th, Julien 18th   

2021 - Festa

The 2022 draft has several players that have a chance at being quality players drafted in the 6th round or later.  I don't know if you are just trying to be a negative nancy or what.  Yes each pick doesn't have a high probability but the Twins have shown they can consistently find ball players throughout the draft.  

It only takes one.

As of right now Ober comes to mind. I doubt there's any other 12th round or later picks with 2.9 WAR this season from that or any draft class since.

It only takes one.

[Mike Sixel]

14 minutes ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Lets just look at the 2017-2021 drafts by the Twins excluding 2020. 

2017 -   Faucher 10th, Ober 12th

2018 -  Winder 7th, Williams 8th, helman 11th, Grace 13th Schulfer 19th  

2019- Headrick 9th, Varland 15th, Julien 18th   

2021 - Festa

The 2022 draft has several players that have a chance at being quality players drafted in the 6th round or later.  I don't know if you are just trying to be a negative nancy or what.  Yes each pick doesn't have a high probability but the Twins have shown they can consistently find ball players throughout the draft.  

I'm suggesting getting a catcher late, is less likely than pitcher, hence, keep taking pitchers. That list is pretty pitcher full. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 minute ago, weitz41 said:

It only takes one.

As of right now Ober comes to mind. I doubt there's any other 12th round or later picks with 2.9 WAR this season from that or any draft class since.

It only takes one.

Since this regime has came in they have had a crazy knack for finding diamonds in the rough.  Not sure what the reasoning is or whether just dumb luck.   

Out of the ones named you have had some that have had a cup of coffee in the MLB.  Then you have 3 that have positive WAR's. 

Varland .5      Julien .7    Ober 5.1     

[weitz41]

5 minutes ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Since this regime has came in they have had a crazy knack for finding diamonds in the rough.  Not sure what the reasoning is or whether just dumb luck.   

Out of the ones named you have had some that have had a cup of coffee in the MLB.  Then you have 3 that have positive WAR's. 

Varland .5      Julien .7    Ober 5.1     

Technically you could add CES soon and Steer.

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, weitz41 said:

Technically you could add CES soon and Steer.

None of whom are catchers, which is the post I was responding to....suggesting to not take a C in the upcoming picks, but to wait....

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

6 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I'm suggesting getting a catcher late, is less likely than pitcher, hence, keep taking pitchers. That list is pretty pitcher full. 

Yet you have 2 players that are Catchers that are doing pretty damn well from the time period selected plus 2022 (had already responded as Cossetti)  .  Williams in the 8th and Cossetti in the 11th just for the Twins.  I understand what you are saying but you can find players anywhere, and the Twins have been pretty good at it whether pitcher or catcher.   Right now the Williams and Cossetti are both major depth pieces for the catcher position for the Twins.   Eh . . .  let me go on my way.  

[Mike Sixel]

2 minutes ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Yet you have 2 players that are Catchers that are doing pretty damn well from the time period selected plus 2022 (had already responded as Cossetti)  .  Williams in the 8th and Cossetti in the 11th just for the Twins.  I understand what you are saying but you can find players anywhere, and the Twins have been pretty good at it whether pitcher or catcher.   Right now the Williams and Cossetti are both major depth pieces for the catcher position for the Twins.   Eh . . .  let me go on my way.  

I get that.....you need 13 pitchers in the majors, and a like number at every level. Give me pitchers! But sure, you CAN find players anywhere. I merely expressed a preference, not some kind of criticism or anything more or less. 

Anyway, really liking this draft.

[weitz41]

5 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

None of whom are catchers, which is the post I was responding to....suggesting to not take a C in the upcoming picks, but to wait....

Oh. I confused your response with another. My bad. Still Texas took Langford before the Twins could take him and now my 2nd day catcher...Hopefully both works out in the Twins favor.

[Mike Sixel]

1 minute ago, weitz41 said:

Oh. I confused your response with another. My bad. Still Texas took Langford before the Twins could take him and now my 2nd day catcher...Hopefully both works out in the Twins favor.

we can only hope at this point! Truth. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

25 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I get that.....you need 13 pitchers in the majors, and a like number at every level. Give me pitchers! But sure, you CAN find players anywhere. I merely expressed a preference, not some kind of criticism or anything more or less. 

Anyway, really liking this draft.

Yes I am also really like this draft.  Just to further drive home my point lets look at the rest of the Twins organizational depth at Catcher.  Alex Isola -29th, Winkel 9th, Tatum 20th round, Schmidt 33rd, Baez 11th.     I am not saying the Twins have great depth at the catcher position.  However,  I would say catching is the 1 position the Twins have continually punted, and continued to find solid organizational pieces throughout the draft.  Then you thrown on Cossetti and Williams who have a chance to be more than an organizational piece with Williams knocking on the door of the big leagues.  

I will state the depth at the catching position this year is pretty barren unlike last year.  I would expect a couple draft picks tomorrow be catchers - that's been the Twins MO lately and then see if they can hit on 1.   

[jmlease1]

nice run on college pitchers right now for the Twins. No objections to them digging around in the college ranks to see who they can find that might take another step up with their coaching and program; they've had some nice results mining smaller programs too.

[nicksaviking]

Don't know much about them, but I like the size of the last two pitchers taken.

[weitz41]

Watching the MLB steam. Kudos to Mayo still rocking the bow tie 4 hours in. 😁

What's up with Texas Tanner Witt on their draft board #76

[nicksaviking]

3 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Don't know much about them, but I like the size of the last two pitchers taken.

Edit: Make that the last three pitchers.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

Twins end with a draft special in the 10th - Ross Dunn 140th ranked prospect Left handed pitcher.  Had a 14.9 k/9 in 2022,  11 in 2023.  Need to find more on him.  

Additional info,  has 3 solid pitches across the board,  appears to be primarily command issues.  Will see if the Twins can help him.  I think the Twins have a good shot at finding a quality arm in these last 5 draft picks.  Will see if 1 or more can excel with the Twins tutelage. 

[Mike Sixel]

52 minutes ago, weitz41 said:

Watching the MLB steam. Kudos to Mayo still rocking the bow tie 4 hours in. 😁

What's up with Texas Tanner Witt on their draft board #76

IIRC, there might be an injury issue.

[wabene]

1 hour ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Since this regime has came in they have had a crazy knack for finding diamonds in the rough.  Not sure what the reasoning is or whether just dumb luck.   

Out of the ones named you have had some that have had a cup of coffee in the MLB.  Then you have 3 that have positive WAR's. 

Varland .5      Julien .7    Ober 5.1     

I agree but aren't the picks made by Sean Johnson who has been with the team forever? Maybe it's a combination of him getting better at his job and the Twins doing a better job of developing some of these players?

[Dman]

7 pitchers out of 11 picks that should go a ways toward restocking the lower levels.  Need to take more tomorrow but I am pretty happy with what they have done so far.  All the hitters with above average hit tools with maybe the exception of Winokur who we will have to wait and see.  Loved the high school picks and now they just need to develop those young guys.

[roger]

2 hours ago, weitz41 said:

I like this draft at this point.

Winokur and Hall stand out to me on day 2. Winokur has all kinds of upside and add a tick or two to Hall's stuff and he could go from good to really good. If the pool money works out Questad is interesting as well. Grow 2 inches and add 20 lbs of muscle and he could be a starter as well. A lot of Marco Raya in size and stuff right now. Harry has that none 20-80 scale factor. He's just a good ball player.

Haven't picked a catcher yet...How about Julian Brock from ULL

Agree with weitz41’s concern over need to get some good catchers in the organization.  Like most years, know nothing about the pitchers taken rounds 4-10.  Crossing my fingers it turns out like the last few years and a couple turn out to be good ones.

[FlyingFinn]

Some bad news from last years draft, Connor Prielipp is now done for the season according to the Cedar Rapids roster.

[Mike Sixel]

9 minutes ago, FlyingFinn said:

Some bad news from last years draft, Connor Prielipp is now done for the season according to the Cedar Rapids roster.

Dang. I still argue it was with the risk. 

[jmlease1]

41 minutes ago, FlyingFinn said:

Some bad news from last years draft, Connor Prielipp is now done for the season according to the Cedar Rapids roster.

Tough break for him. But you have to take some chances in the draft. And he could still work out, but this is a significant setback for him. Hopefully he can get his arm right and come back next season.

[DocBauer]

2 hours ago, weitz41 said:

Watching the MLB steam. Kudos to Mayo still rocking the bow tie 4 hours in. 😁

What's up with Texas Tanner Witt on their draft board #76

Forgive me if I have some of this a little off...but he went through surgery,  TJ I believe, and tried to come back this spring with really poor results. From I've gathered here and there is he will go back to Texas for his senior year to be 100% healthy, and re-establish his draft stock for next year, unless he got a much bigger than expected bonus offer to go ahead and turn pro.

I actually thought someone might be creative and try something like that. I haven't seen if anyone took him yet or not as work prevented me from following the draft as I would have like to. But I wondered if $2M in the bank and turn pro...hedging any chance he  ever comes back...and work with pro coaches and trainers might entice him.

[jkcarew]

2 hours ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Twins end with a draft special in the 10th - Ross Dunn 140th ranked prospect Left handed pitcher.  Had a 14.9 k/9 in 2022,  11 in 2023.  Need to find more on him.  

Additional info,  has 3 solid pitches across the board,  appears to be primarily command issues.  Will see if the Twins can help him.  I think the Twins have a good shot at finding a quality arm in these last 5 draft picks.  Will see if 1 or more can excel with the Twins tutelage. 

Wonder if he’ll sign. I assume he has one year of eligibility remaining…may return and hope for much better signing $ next year. Probably was expecting to go much sooner this year.

[DocBauer]

Last thing I want to do is derail the thread, BUT, the catcher conversation is worth looking at in regard to the draft.

The past 2 drafts, the Twins have selected 5 catchers, all from college: Winkel, Cardenas, Tatum, Baez and Cossetti.  Carmago, Williams, and Isola were acquired via trade and a couple later draft picks.

Carmago was pushed to AAA after just starting to really have his bat come alive in 2022. I was surprised. He started really slow, and then has really heated up after the first month or so. He's solid behind the plate, has power, but is not a finished product yet. He's best not appearing at the ML level until sometime in 2024. 24yo. 

Williams is a 26yo who CAN CATCH, in the way a lot of guys "can catch". He's actually a solid receiver and game caller and is smart behind the plate. But injuries to his arm have limited him. He began his career as a catcher, but is primarily a DH/1B at this point who will do a good workman like job behind the plate. An injured senior signing, who missed 2020, he's a bat first player. Power and an almost 1.000 OPS says he should get a shot as a 1B/DH who can be a 3rd catcher. If something ACTUALLY CHANGES at the ML level, he could be part of a 3-some with Larnach and Wallner being promoted in some combination with Kirilloff playing more corner OF. But there's little to no room if the Twins don't actually make changes. But even at 26yo, his bat deserves a legit look.

Isola is as much of a 1B/DH as he is a catcher. He's still only 24yo, but he looks like a catcher the way Williams is.

Winkel and Cardenas are at AA and A+. Winkel is at AA, Cardenas is at A+. Both seem to have good eyes, but Cardenas seems to have a better one, probably a better athlete, and more pop/power potential even though we haven't seen it yet. They are both 23yo.

Cossetti, also 23yo, has been promoted to A+ with Cardenas after blowing through the FSL. While he hasn't the same way so far with Cedar Rapids, he's still holding his own in his first year. 

Baez, 22yo, drafted last year, is almost a clone of 1st round Teel from this draft, if you just look at athleticism and numbers posted in their draft seasons. The primary difference being Teel has been a primary catcher for more than one year. Now, I'm sure there is more to the equation beyond that. But pure athleticism and hit and power ability, there is a real similarity between those two. Unfortunately, Baez has had an injury that I can't recall right now, that has slowed him this season. Just saying, he's very similar in overall talent and shouldn't be dismissed despite his slow start.

11-20, the Twins should take a shot at a catcher or two for hope and depth. But just wanted to add, they actually have an interesting collective of possible catchers in their system I'm not sure everyone recognizes.

Camargo, Winkel, Cardenas, Cosseti, and Baez, are all a year to 3 from maybe being a ML catcher. How well they do depends as they're ALL 24yo or younger. And we don't have a TOP prospect there. In theory, we don't need one with Vasquez and Jeffers, but I still wouldn't ignore a catcher or two on day three. You need catchers, and you never know if lightening might strike. 

[weitz41]

45 minutes ago, DocBauer said:

Forgive me if I have some of this a little off...but he went through surgery,  TJ I believe, and tried to come back this spring with really poor results. From I've gathered here and there is he will go back to Texas for his senior year to be 100% healthy, and re-establish his draft stock for next year, unless he got a much bigger than expected bonus offer to go ahead and turn pro.

I actually thought someone might be creative and try something like that. I haven't seen if anyone took him yet or not as work prevented me from following the draft as I would have like to. But I wondered if $2M in the bank and turn pro...hedging any chance he  ever comes back...and work with pro coaches and trainers might entice him.

I respect your thoughts and opinion. You tend to be neither pro or against what's happening today and look at most things beyond only this season.  IDK If you or others have heard whether he's doing the senior thing. More power to him. The lack of being drafted says something is going on there. If he can get healthy and show his talent more power to him, 2nd or 3ed round twin next year.😊

Just kind of riding it out. I think we missed out on a catcher or two but none the less I really like this draft. through 10 rounds.

[DocBauer]

1 hour ago, weitz41 said:

I respect your thoughts and opinion. You tend to be neither pro or against what's happening today and look at most things beyond only this season.  IDK If you or others have heard whether he's doing the senior thing. More power to him. The lack of being drafted says something is going on there. If he can get healthy and show his talent more power to him, 2nd or 3ed round twin next year.😊

Just kind of riding it out. I think we missed out on a catcher or two but none the less I really like this draft. through 10 rounds.

Thanks for the compliment.  While I was born and raised a Twins fanatic.."damn you father" LOL...I do always TRY to approach everything from the draft, to the minors, to the Twins themselves with a honest and long term view. I try to be pragmatic in all things, even though emotion comes in to play once in a while. Again, thank you for the TREMENDOUS compliment.

I had actually held out some hope that the Twins MIGHT save enough bonus $ at some point to take a shot at Witt. I'm pretty sure his father has some influence here, and he should. There's every reason to believe a healthy senior season should land him anywhere in the top 3 rounds, maybe the 1st. I can't argue against betting on yourself and feeling you're going to be GOOD TO GO in 2024. More power to the kid.

As far as catchers go, I believe to this day they are undervalued as to their importance. And one of my pet peeves with the FO has been ignoring the Latin market for catching options, even though history has produced a tremendous amount of talent there. 

Finding a high quality catcher that can be a 2-way producer is equivalent of finding an ACE pitcher, IMO. But in every draft, how many catchers are drafted early who turn out to be studs on both sides? 

There are just so few 1st round catchers who become STUDS. I still remember Harper being a transformation player who went to the OF. Right or wrong, the Twins have Vazquez for 2 more years. The underrated Jeffers is under control, for the same. There IS some catching talent in the system, though their future is TBD. The Twins haven't ignored the catching position, but they recognize a Mauer type only comes along so often. So they draft guys, similar to any position, that have potential to grow.  And I would say with easy confidence, a catcher is usually grown and developed,  seldom drafted to be a stud. 

[Dave Borton]

15 hours ago, IA Bean Counter said:

Looks like we got another high strikeout pitcher in Santos.   See what the staff can do with him.  Likely a senior sign to save a few dollars, or maybe they really like him.  

Bethune Cookman Div III. Not sure how tough opposition was but scout surely was familiar with it. Lots of unearned runs relative to total ERs in Santos' stats. Some sloppy ball.

Threw two games against Div I (Univ So Fla/South Carolina) and got hammered. https://bcuathletics.com/sports/baseball/roster/nolan--santos/4716