Tyler Duffey - Color Me Impressed

[Pitz]

I don't get a chance to watch a whole lot of games, so I mostly end up looking at box scores and some highlights. I was able to watch a good chunk of yesterday's game though, and I just wanted to say that I was quite impressed with Tyler Duffey. He seems to have good enough stuff to at least stick in a big league rotation. I know there has been a goal for him to develop his change up to add to his repertoire and help his FB/CB play up even more. But what I liked most about watching him was the competitive spark I saw on the mound. He wants the ball and he wants to succeed. I hope the Twins continue to give him the former and he continues to do the latter.

 

I'm sure he's probably been talked about a great deal, so I'm sorry if I'm rehashing any old discussions. But I thought it may be worthwhile to highlight his very solid performance. Here's to looking for brighter days ahead...

[Dman]

I always liked mainly because of his strike out numbers but several people on here felt to really only had two pitches and that he tends to get hit harder the second and third time through the lineup.  Those are the knocks he needs to overcome and if he does look out as that curve can carve up the hitters.

[Pitz]

 

I always liked mainly because of his strike out numbers but several people on here felt to really only had two pitches and that he tends to get hit harder the second and third time through the lineup.  Those are the knocks he needs to overcome and if he does look out as that curve can carve up the hitters.

 

Couple interesting reads from Fangraphs from March on his pitches:

 

More than 2-Pitch Repertoire

 

Shockingly Interesting Twin

 

 

[Craig Arko]

He did strike out 4 guys in the bottom of the 7th,

[Danchat]

If he gets bumped for Gibson (when he comes back from his injury), I'm going to be mad. He's been the best guy in the rotation in the last 2 weeks (though that's not saying much).

[gunnarthor]

I remember reading scouting reports on him that said his curve had the chance to be plus (a 60 on the scouting grade).  I think it might be better than that.  He's really looked good.  Still early, of course, but let's hope he's for real.

[bluechipper]

 

If he gets bumped for Gibson (when he comes back from his injury), I'm going to be mad. He's been the best guy in the rotation in the last 2 weeks (though that's not saying much).

With performances like Sunday's, I think Duffey would stay and Hughes or Nolasco would be bumped to the bullpen when Gibson comes back.

[Mike Sixel]

He sure can look very effective.........he should, imo, be in the rotation the rest of the year. This team needs to know what they have for the future.

 

Move Hughes to the bullpen......or trade someone over 27 years of age.

[Pitz]

 

He sure can look very effective.........he should, imo, be in the rotation the rest of the year. This team needs to know what they have for the future.

 

Move Hughes to the bullpen......or trade someone over 27 years of age.

I wonder if the Twins should consider moving to a 6-man rotation. (And when I suggest that, I'm doing so in full agreement of both of your suggestions.) They need to let Berrios, Duffey, and Meyer pitch in the rotation this year. Moving to a 6-man would help keep their innings down. 

Of course I'd also advocate for getting May back into the rotation, so maybe move Hughes to the bullpen and trade someone over 27 years of age.

[ShouldaCouldaWoulda]

 

He sure can look very effective.........he should, imo, be in the rotation the rest of the year. This team needs to know what they have for the future.

 

Move Hughes to the bullpen......or trade someone over 27 years of age.

C'mon guys, have you not been paying attention to the script this year?! You should all know what is about to come next. It starts tonight. Berrios will look dominant at times, but have some bad luck that either gets him hooked around the 5th inning or give up like 3 runs after bad route to a ball that should have been caught with two outs. Berrios will then get sent back down in favor of Gibson. This is too easy to predict.

[Dantes929]

Nolasco is somehow off the hot seat with two quality starts in 6 games.    I would rather have kept Milone.   Duffey was the best starter last year and the best starter this year and has 9 QS in his last 12 games.    The pecking order should have Duffey in the 1st spot by a wide margin, Santana, Berrios, Gibson, Hughes and Nolasco in that order.   Better yet, Duffey, May, Santana, Berrios and Gibson.   If this team is to get jumpstarted into winning ways it will be because of Duffey, Berrios and Santana getting them on track.  Hopefully starting with Berrios tonight.

[SwainZag]

 

Nolasco is somehow off the hot seat with two quality starts in 6 games.    I would rather have kept Milone.   Duffey was the best starter last year and the best starter this year and has 9 QS in his last 12 games.    The pecking order should have Duffey in the 1st spot by a wide margin, Santana, Berrios, Gibson, Hughes and Nolasco in that order.   Better yet, Duffey, May, Santana, Berrios and Gibson.   If this team is to get jumpstarted into winning ways it will be because of Duffey, Berrios and Santana getting them on track.  Hopefully starting with Berrios tonight.

 

The problem was that Duffy was lit up in spring training.  You can look to last year all you want, but he was missing something this Spring and you cannot just ignore that.

 

Milone on the 1 year deal is a lot easier to waive and hopefully have someone claim rather than Ricky and his multi years left on his deal.  As Twins fans we should be rooting for Ricky to string together some good starts and hopefully bump up his trade value to someone needy come July.

[Pitz]

 

The problem was that Duffy was lit up in spring training.  You can look to last year all you want, but he was missing something this Spring and you cannot just ignore that.

 

Not necessarily disagreeing with you, but spring training performances get ignored all the time. 

[SwainZag]

 

Not necessarily disagreeing with you, but spring training performances get ignored all the time. 

 

Completely agreed, but as of right now, it looks like it was a pretty good decision.

[Pitz]

 

Completely agreed, but as of right now, it looks like it was a pretty good decision.

 

After posting my comment, I wondered what would have happened if Duffey had made the starting rotation out of spring training. He didn't necessarily put up great numbers in AAA so perhaps he would have struggled even more if he had been up. So yeah, maybe he needed a few more starts to get going.

[bluechipper]

 

After posting my comment, I wondered what would have happened if Duffey had made the starting rotation out of spring training. He didn't necessarily put up great numbers in AAA so perhaps he would have struggled even more if he had been up. So yeah, maybe he needed a few more starts to get going.

Well they were decent numbers. A 1.72 ERA in 15.2 innings.

[nicksaviking]

Duffey has throw his change-up more this year, still not a ton, but he's doubled his usage from 2.5% to 5.5%. Perhaps that is an attempt to assuage the "only a two pitch pitcher" critics. As his curve is working currently, I wouldn't want him to increase the change-up usage. Perhaps he will if batters start keying in on the curve(s).

 

Still, if he has two curves that function entirely different, I'm still in the camp that he has enough pitches for a long look, as he can make his curve act unpredictably. After all, no one criticizes a knuckleballer for being a one or two pitch pitcher.

[Pitz]

 

Well they were decent numbers. A 1.72 ERA in 15.2 innings.

 

I was thinking more of the 7 BBs and 1.40 WHIP. 

His last AAA start was very solid though.

[bluechipper]

 

I was thinking more of the 7 BBs and 1.40 WHIP. 

His last AAA start was very solid though.

Ok that makes sense.

 

It is something to wonder about how he would have pitched if he had started the season with the Twins. Only missing a few weeks might end up being what's the best for him.

[Pitz]

 

Ok that makes sense.

 

It is something to wonder about how he would have pitched if he had started the season with the Twins. Only missing a few weeks might end up being what's the best for him.

 

Well he avoided the 0-9 start at least... not that things have improved all that much since.

[Pitz]

Wait, I was trying to stay positive with this thread.

 

 

[Dantes929]

 

The problem was that Duffy was lit up in spring training.  You can look to last year all you want, but he was missing something this Spring and you cannot just ignore that.

 

Milone on the 1 year deal is a lot easier to waive and hopefully have someone claim rather than Ricky and his multi years left on his deal.  As Twins fans we should be rooting for Ricky to string together some good starts and hopefully bump up his trade value to someone needy come July.

Ricky's and Duffey's ST numbers were not all that different and Duffey had the excuse ob being instructed to work on his change up.     I think he has an elite curve ball and an underrated fastball.  He throws both pitches with enough variations to effectively be classified as much more than just a two pitch guy, imo.     No one else is even close to his 9 QS in 12 outings so to me he is the de facto ace.     I fear that Berrios is the odd man out unless he pitches a gem tonight.

[Don Walcott]

Duffey looked great yesterday.  His fastball topped out at 91, but it seemed a lot faster to me.  I'm sure it seemed faster to some of the White Sox hitters who were looking for the curve.  Jack Morris loves the guy because of his competitive nature, as well.  And I think Jack knows what he's talking about on that topic.

 

Seems like Berrios hasn't pitched in ages.  As a fan, I'm looking forward to Berrios and Duffey starts, and would be looking forward to Meyer starts as well. 

 

I hope this is a case of it being darkest before the dawn.

[Mr. Brooks]

Duffey continues to pitch great in the majors.

Some guys are just better than the sum of their parts, that's the fun part of sports.

 

This FO didn't think this guy was one of our 5 best starting pitchers, based on a few practice games!

[ashbury]

This FO didn't think this guy was one of our 5 best starting pitchers, based on a few practice games!

He wasn't, until he got that extra AAA seasoning.

[Mr. Brooks]

He wasn't, until he got that extra AAA seasoning.

Not sure if serious.

[DocBauer]

Couple interesting reads from Fangraphs from March on his pitches:

 

More than 2-Pitch Repertoire

 

Shockingly Interesting Twin

If anyone hasnt clicked on those 2 links a d read them, you are doing yourself a real disservice.

 

One of the things about baseball that has always intrigued me...sometimes baffled me...is how the game is so lacking in the pure physicality and physical predictability of other sports. In the NBA, the game is played differently than the college game. Draftable prospects are rated more on pure physical ability, often, than pure numbers, and projectability. The smart, tenacious shooter but more limited athlete often doesn't make it, or must be content as a role player. In the NFL, size, strength, speed and explosion are valued greatly as the game is, obviously, very physical in nature. That's not to say there isn't technique and smarts involved, but many times pure physical ability can compensate. You can teach tecnique, but you can't teach speed. And players can get bigger and stronger through hard work.

 

In baseball, how many times does a top 4 or 5 tool prospect just never get the fine points of the game and washes out, but a "lesser" gifted prospect just knows how to hit, field and play the game? How many times do we see the top pitching prospect with the big fastball never learn control, never refine other pitches, or just never grasp the sequence of pitching? But then there is that guy who seems to have more average stuff, but knows how to use it, and has a "feel" for setting up hitters and hitting his spots. Duffey is that kind of guy. Not to say he doesn't have decent stuff, but he was never rated as a top prospect or can't miss arm.

 

What he does have is solid control, great mound presence, and a great feel for pitching. The above mentioned articles go in to all of that very well. It's hard to say what happened to him in ST...trying too hard, not getting an initial feel for his pitches, or spending too much time working on his change...but since he's been up, he looks just like the guy we saw last season. And while an at least decent change would make him that much more effective, again referencing the details in the listed links, he really does throw 2 very different fastballs, and 2 very different curveballs, one of them a big hook, the other almost a slider.

 

I am just so impressed by this kid! Give the Twins scouts and milb pitching coaches credit where credit is due, but this is one of those wonderfully rare times when you also just get lucky with a prospect.

[ashbury]

Not sure if serious.

Well obviously I wasn't literally serious that the specific number of games at AAA was the final missing piece to his success going forward.

 

But I guess whatever serious aspect there was in my post, was to caution against certainty. His stats in Spring weren't that great. Maybe they had a specific thing or two they spotted and wanted him to work on in AAA, so he did it, and is now back up. Tipping pitches would be an example of something specific that could be ironed out pretty quickly. I don't know for a fact that this isn't how it went; do you?

[Mr. Brooks]

Well obviously I wasn't literally serious that the specific number of games at AAA was the final missing piece to his success going forward.

 

But I guess whatever serious aspect there was in my post, was to caution against certainty. His stats in Spring weren't that great. Maybe they had a specific thing or two they spotted and wanted him to work on in AAA, so he did it, and is now back up. Tipping pitches would be an example of something specific that could be ironed out pretty quickly. I don't know for a fact that this isn't how it went; do you?

Of course neither of us know anything for sure.

 

He is pitching just like he did last year when the games counted.

 

The only outlier is his performance in practice games, when by the way, he was working on a change up, not results, because he had been falsely told he had already earned a rotation spot based on games that counted (which he should have).

 

Given how the Twins looked in ST this year (like WS contenders), compared to how they look in games that count, I hope this is finally the year the Twins realize that ST results mean absolutely nothing.

[jimmer]

 

I wonder if the Twins should consider moving to a 6-man rotation. 

This rotation doesn't have enough quality to fill out a 5 man rotation much less give inferior pitchers starts that the better ones could take.