Joe Mays/Carlos Silva

[twinscowboysbulls]

Who starts more games this year? Thoughts?

[mikeee]

lol

[Vanimal46]

What year is this? 

[Craig Arko]

What year is this?

[gunnarthor]

You know, Mays really had a great 2001 season - led the league in ERA+, 3rd in ip, 2nd in pitching WAR (and nearly a full win ahead of third place), and first in adjusted pitcher wins.  Not too bad.

[Negativity Police]

One more post like this and you'll find yourself in the clink. You're on notice, mister.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

I'm not an old byto guy, I don't know what's going on, but I like it

[USAFChief]

I'm not an old byto guy, I don't know what's going on, but I like it

I AM an old BYTO guy. It's no help. I don't know what's going on either.

[rghrbek]

 

You know, Mays really had a great 2001 season - led the league in ERA+, 3rd in ip, 2nd in pitching WAR (and nearly a full win ahead of third place), and first in adjusted pitcher wins.  Not too bad.

 

He was very good, better than anyone could expect.  Unfortunately I think we had a few years of control left and we went all crazy and then he was terrible.

 

Same with silva...

 

[notoriousgod71]

Sean Bergman > Joe Mays

[DaveW]

Avian Flu > Joe Mays

[Jham]

Silva once through a complete game shutout in 66 pitches, with I believe 6 double plays.  He then flung the ball into the second deck in celebration.  It might take him 132 pitches and 12 double plays now... somehow...  and his celebratory toss may only reach the ondeck circle now, but he couldn't do any worse than Ron Washington instantly tearing his hamstring or Hrbek registering a 4.2 on the Richter scale in their respective legend's game appearances.

[Paul Pleiss]

I'll take Nick Punto +2. That's easy money.

[gunnarthor]

 

He was very good, better than anyone could expect.  Unfortunately I think we had a few years of control left and we went all crazy and then he was terrible.

Yeah, he started 2002 pretty shaky and then missed nearly 3 months with an arm issue.  He came back and was iffy to end the year - 4.50 era in 83ip, very few strike outs but a ton of ground balls.  His 03 was gawd-awful and I believe he got rotator cuff surgery at the end of the year, missing all of 04. 

 

At the time, people were blaming TK for making him throw so many innings in 2001.

 

Silva actually had a few good enough seasons that he got a big FA contract.  His 06 season was horrible but otherwise he was pretty solid. 

[DaveW]

 

I AM an old BYTO guy. It's no help. I don't know what's going on either.

Yeah I am a bit confused as well, but I love to see a TwinsCowboysBulls thread now and again.

[twinscowboysbulls]

Has either of these guys been called up yet? We're dying for some quality starts right now!

[LaBombo]

 

You know, Mays really had a great 2001 season - led the league in ERA+, 3rd in ip, 2nd in pitching WAR (and nearly a full win ahead of third place), and first in adjusted pitcher wins.  Not too bad.

 

It's almost always fun to for us to look back on crazy outlier seasons by Twins players, because we're baseball nerds and wired/weird that way. 

 

But in the case of Joe Mays, it's a little more sad for me than fun.    His 2001 season pitching line looks like the kind you'd choose in order to illustrate the absolute folly of evaluating pitching performance primarily on the strength of ERA and wins.

 

Unsustainably low opponent batting average on balls in play?    Check.

 

Suspiciously good strand and home run rates?   Check and check.

 

Strikeout and walk rates chugging toward nearly meeting up at a golden spike ceremony in the neighborhood of a ghastly 3 per 9 innings?    Check.

 

Virtually every red flag was there in 2001 to warn the Twins of Mays' looming future of 5+ ERA's, demotion to bullpen mop up two years later, and an exit from the league at just 31 years of age.    Infinitely more importantly, one could have hoped that the cautionary tale of Joe Mays would have shaken to the core the way in which the Twins applied statistical analysis to player scouting.

 

Instead, even after having eyebrow-singing front row seats to Mays' predictable implosion, a decade later the Twins still managed to trademark the phrase "pitch to contact",    make hapless journeyman and Joe Mays carbon copy Nick Blackburn a multimillionaire,   and place a pretty large chunk of front office responsibility in the hands of an assistant GM who thinks BABIP is a Sinclair Lewis novel.

[diehardtwinsfan]

I seem to remember Gardy going with Mays for game one of the ALCS in 2002 much to everyone's chagrin. 

 

And then Mays channeled his 2001 self for one game...

[ShouldaCouldaWoulda]

Are these the nicknames for Gibson and Milone? Or Hughes?