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Posted

I laugh a bit when I see some commentators saying we can't trade away "upside talent".   They forget the other side of the equation in that we would be bringing back ESTABLISHED talent.

I agree on the three prospects that would be untouchable:  Jenkins, Culpepper and Houston (again I am not as high on Houston as others but will trust the evaluation of his defensive talents at SS and he seems to be able to hit enough to make that work).

I would say there is another list of "wow" you have to blow me away with the offer and Riley Quick would  be on that list.  I would be willing to trade Quick for an established starter who has some level of team control left.  

Everyone else, including Keaschall and Brooks Lee should be a player that we can trade in any deal.

But again, this depends on the ownership doing a 180 and deciding they will float a payroll that will get teh team to at least league average to be competive.  If this is not the case, then they need to trade away players to build up the prospect bank for the rebuild.  

Posted

I agree on the top 4. As for the others... I'm far less certain I'd be will to move any of the others for anyone without years of control. I get it, it's been a much more enjoyable season than I expected.

If you're going to keep most or all the band together and take a shot at it. I'm trading from the lower 1/3 of the prospect list. 1-2 rental BP arms should fit in that range.

Now if you're looking for another starter and a nonrental. OK there's a name or two I'd consider. Because the name is popular on the site. Let's say Reid Detmers. I'd be willing to move Tait or E rod, due to redundancy, plus lack of options for E Rod, I'd guess it'll take Matthews and at least one more from the 15-30 range as well. That's a pretty high price for a 25% chance to make it into the playoffs this season and a 10% chance to get through the WC round.

Honestly, I'd rather reinforce the DP with rentals, take a shot at it with the current crew and save my bullets for next season. but that's just me.

Posted

I don't think that those 4 prospects (or any prospects) are ever really untouchable, but at the same time, I don't believe they should be touched right now.

If, for the sake of argument, we were 57-43 right now and felt like we were one SP and one big bat away from being the AL favorite, then anyone is on the table in the right deal.

But we're not 57-43. We're 49-51 and clinging to playoff relevance, so yes, there are some guys that are "2026 untouchable"

But at the same time, I'm going to disagree with some people in this thread that don't want to see ANY assets moved away at the deadline for marginal 2026 improvement and are still interested in the idea of selling assets. I understand your points. I just don't agree with that philosophy under the current circumstances. I believe that:

  1. There are difficult to quantify benefits to having your franchise play meaningful baseball in September and October, and
  2. Generally speaking, odd stuff can happen over small samples (the playoffs). 

If the threshold for pushing our chips in the middle is "I think we're as good as the Dodgers," then we're never pushing. 

Posted
1 hour ago, MMBoys93 said:

Very fair point out of CES and Steer.

I had not remembered immediately how far up the prospect boards Steer had jumped.

My overall point here, though is for small market teams, the top-tier organizations are Cleveland, Tampa Bay, Milwaukee

Tampa Bay is great at development, but they don’t shy away from trading away major league, talent and adding major league talent in the off-season or at the deadline. They don’t heavily guard their prospects as much as the twins do.

Cleveland does not trade their players very often, but their development is the best amongst all three of these teams, and they have shown that they can win without needing to do this. What Cleveland has done is trading from a surplus to add prospect Or major league talent in areas where they feel they need it.

And then there’s Milwaukee who does a lot of everything. They acquire good major league talent when they need it, they trade their talent away when they know they won’t resign them.

All 3 teams maximize the value of their players.

The twins haven’t delevoped MLB talent near the rate of the 3 orgs. They’ve  extended one homegrown player in the last 7 years. Every year their team is filled with one year deal FAs, and prospects from their organization since the beginning or from years they sell at the deadline. They’ve had a surplus of corner outfield prospects for years now, but they’ve been terrified to trade from a position of strength to strengthen an area that’s weaker. 
 

Now they’re on the verge of losing Jeffers to FA without ever attempting to extend or move him. That’s exactly the type of player that Cle,TB,Mil would have maximized value out of. 

 

The best small market orgs maximize the value at every stage of a players lifecycle. The Twins don’t extend players early, don’t trade them at peak value, and don’t aggressively convert prospect capital or positional strengths into major league talent.

100 percent Tampa trades Jeffers if he's on their team. I'd say it's about fifty fifty for the other two, but maybe 60 prevent they do. 

We have no idea if the Twins tried to extend him or not. 

Generally, however, I agree. The twins lag those three by a lot in development, but then nearly every team does. That's not going to cut it.... They need to get better. 

Posted
1 hour ago, amjgt said:

I don't think that those 4 prospects (or any prospects) are ever really untouchable, but at the same time, I don't believe they should be touched right now.

If, for the sake of argument, we were 57-43 right now and felt like we were one SP and one big bat away from being the AL favorite, then anyone is on the table in the right deal.

But we're not 57-43. We're 49-51 and clinging to playoff relevance, so yes, there are some guys that are "2026 untouchable"

But at the same time, I'm going to disagree with some people in this thread that don't want to see ANY assets moved away at the deadline for marginal 2026 improvement and are still interested in the idea of selling assets. I understand your points. I just don't agree with that philosophy under the current circumstances. I believe that:

  1. There are difficult to quantify benefits to having your franchise play meaningful baseball in September and October, and
  2. Generally speaking, odd stuff can happen over small samples (the playoffs). 

If the threshold for pushing our chips in the middle is "I think we're as good as the Dodgers," then we're never pushing. 

Nice straw man. Zero people are saying the twins have to be the best team in baseball to add. Was a good post until then. 

Posted

Tagging on to the other article, I wonder what it would take to get Detmers and Peralta or Gausman and move Zebby and Prielipp to the bullpen this year.

Detmers would be a big cost.  Could Emmanuel Rodriguez and Charlee Soto be the start to get it done?  If it was those 2 and another piece or two.  Soto, Rodriguez and Bohorquez for Detmers?

Peralta or Gausman should be cheaper.  Mets traded 2 prospects for Peralta (and a reliever).  Jett Williams (was top 50 before), Brandon Sproat (in the majors).  How about Ryan Gallagher, Henry Mendez and Khadim Diaw?

Posted
3 hours ago, amjgt said:

The AL is the worst it's ever been. 

 

I picked just a small sentence here to questions a common thread that has run across seemingly every media platform - mediocrity in baseball and especially in the American League with the AL Central sticking out for many people.

Can I push back a little on this? Is is possible that the widespread/standard usage of analytics and video across baseball have pinched together most clubs? There has been a loud call for parity across MLB by many fans. I think they mean every team has relatively the same financial wherewithal as it concerns spending on players. Perhaps parity as far as competitiveness has already arrived.

Like many of those who come to Twins Daily I follow MLB pretty closely and it seems like there are so many games decided by 3 runs or less every day. The talent level seems pretty close, closer than it has seemed in the past. However, I admit I have not done any research to determine if this is true. I'm merely forwarding the notion that one league is not well below the other and that MLB teams all have good talent. There were a pile of comments that suggested the AL All Star team would be shut out and struggle mightily versus the NL hurlers. This verbage was led by Cory Provus but was also mentioned by many others. The end result - the AL junk ball artists, including Joe Ryan, baffled the NL and against all odds (Fan Duel/Bally, Etc.) the weaker AL won.

Posted
10 hours ago, um_stevenel said:

I’m not sure what the restrictions are on recent draftees; but I assume the reason Lackey isn’t listed is that he will not yet be eligible to be traded. Is that correct?

Drafted players cannot be traded until the conclusion of the World Series.

Posted
1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

Nice straw man. Zero people are saying the twins have to be the best team in baseball to add. Was a good post until then. 

You’re right. Last part wasn’t necessary.

I was trying to make a point about competitiveness vs contention but it didn’t work. 

Posted
5 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

Sure, but that's not really the way the world works, right? No one is dealing the best pitcher in baseball with years of control left for any of these guys......you know what this post is about. 

Impossible to know since the Twins hoard their prospects like gold

Posted
14 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

I picked just a small sentence here to questions a common thread that has run across seemingly every media platform - mediocrity in baseball and especially in the American League with the AL Central sticking out for many people.

 

“Worst” can mean a few different things. I believe if we look at purely mathematically (win/loss percentage), my statement is true. But the meaningful sample there is quite small, because up until interleague play started, it was always 50%. Then as interleague play trickled in, it could only barely deviate from 50%. Now with roughly 30% of everyone’s schedule being against the other league, those percentages can start to get a little whackier. And this year they have. The NL is destroying the AL in interleague. 

So mathematically, it’s true. The AL has never been worse. And that matters for the wild card. 

But what I’ve typed above can be true and there could still be a couple really good teams. A team or two that feel inevitable to reach the ALCS. This year I just don’t see that. Of the (subjectively) 10 best teams in the league, probably 3 of them are in the AL. And are any of those 3 in the top 5? Maybe. But barely. 

That’s more what I meant when I said it’s the worst it’s ever been. 
 

Posted

I don't mind moving a handful of these prospects whose value that I have many questions about - more specifically in my opinion Rodriguez and Tait. Just depends what the return is, this team should not be buying any rentals but if they can find the next Pablo Lopez / Sonny Gray / Kenta Maeda trade, then pull the trigger with one of these prospects. Flip a couple major league assets for something, whether that be a AAA failed starter and try to turn into a reliever or a lottery ticket.

Moving Rojas doesn't make sense to me. The farm system has had a lot of pitching talent graduate and there are going to be fewer arms coming up for 2027-28, they need him whether it be as a starter or reliever.

Posted

It would seem that lots of players are untouchable up until a great offer comes along. The current team development would suggest they are building to be competitive long term starting in 27/28. We need to load up on pitching and be prudent in trading off assets when the best return is available.  
The current squad is a little exciting but underwhelming for the most part. Its time to build for the future!

Verified Member
Posted

One reason I’m reluctant to “go for it” is I don’t deem the Twins farm system to be as strong as some people. They have depth in the form of a bunch of FV 40-45 prospects which don’t usually translate into difference makers in the bigs. They have one elite prospect in Jenkins (I’m leaving Lackey out of this discussion because he can’t be traded).  I consider Culpepper and Houston to be good prospects and EmRod a total wild card. After that it gets iffy and highly volatile. Is Kyle DeBarge or Winokur going to be highly valued in a trade scenario?  I doubt it, maybe Tait moves the needle for some team but adding a really good pitcher to this team is going to cost one of their top four which is why I think it’s folly. They need to be adding prospects with a ceiling not trading them away. 

Posted
12 hours ago, MMBoys93 said:

I will never disagree with having a list of untouchable prospects. Every major league team has some variation of that list.
 

Unfortunately, where the twins have really come up short the last decade is a complete unwillingness to trade decent prospects for major league talent. Outside of Petty for Gray they have tightly held onto any legitimately ranked prospect. 
 

Unwilling to spend money-  

Poor talent development -

Won’t trade for major league talent-

1 playoff series win in 20 years-

Not entirely true. They went for it in 2022, trading 4 prospects for Jorge Lopez, 3 for Tyler Mahle, and 1 for Michael Fulmer. The results were underwhelming, but with the exception of an ok MLBer in Steer, none of the other prospects has become an MLB regular.

Posted
12 hours ago, amjgt said:

If we assume Jeffers is gone in 2027, which is likely but not 100%...

2027 - Caratini (7M) + Jackson (Arb2)
2028 - Lackey (Rookie) + Jackson (Arb3)
2029 - Lackey (Rookie) + Tinney/Tait (Rookie)

That assumes things go pretty well on the prospect side, but none of that feels too crazy. 

How about Tait/Diaw!

Posted
4 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

I picked just a small sentence here to questions a common thread that has run across seemingly every media platform - mediocrity in baseball and especially in the American League with the AL Central sticking out for many people.

Can I push back a little on this? Is is possible that the widespread/standard usage of analytics and video across baseball have pinched together most clubs? There has been a loud call for parity across MLB by many fans. I think they mean every team has relatively the same financial wherewithal as it concerns spending on players. Perhaps parity as far as competitiveness has already arrived.

Like many of those who come to Twins Daily I follow MLB pretty closely and it seems like there are so many games decided by 3 runs or less every day. The talent level seems pretty close, closer than it has seemed in the past. However, I admit I have not done any research to determine if this is true. I'm merely forwarding the notion that one league is not well below the other and that MLB teams all have good talent. There were a pile of comments that suggested the AL All Star team would be shut out and struggle mightily versus the NL hurlers. This verbage was led by Cory Provus but was also mentioned by many others. The end result - the AL junk ball artists, including Joe Ryan, baffled the NL and against all odds (Fan Duel/Bally, Etc.) the weaker AL won.

Pushing back in kind: the worst division is the AL West, which is -42 games. The AL Central is just -18.

Posted
15 hours ago, um_stevenel said:

I’m not sure what the restrictions are on recent draftees; but I assume the reason Lackey isn’t listed is that he will not yet be eligible to be traded. Is that correct?

drafted players can't be traded until after the World Series.  Chase Petty was one of the quickest traded draft picks going to Cincy for Sonny Gray eight months after being drafted

 

Posted
5 hours ago, dxpavelka said:

drafted players can't be traded until after the World Series.  Chase Petty was one of the quickest traded draft picks going to Cincy for Sonny Gray eight months after being drafted

 

Thank you!

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