Article: Time to Put Pelf on the Shelf

[Nick Nelson]

You can view the page at http://twinsdaily.com/content.php?r=1650-Time-to-Put-Pelf-on-the-Shelf

[AScheib50]

I feel like him being a "good guy" who has taken an interest in the younger guys will carry him further than he should be allowed to go. I like the fact that he is willing to work with younger guys and is a good teammate. But like you wrote, Nick, he isn't getting outs...thus he should work on that somewhere other than the Major Leagues. Who knows maybe the Twins are waiting for De Vries or Deduno to get healthy first...I'm all for one of those guys getting a shot first before Hendriks gets another...but that's a whole other topic, eh?

[troyhobbs]

Yep he's gotta go down, for awhile at least. Let's see what Gibsons got if Devries or Deduno aren't healthy anyway. Didn't mind Gardy sending him out for the 6th so much as leaving him out there to face Fielder with 2 men on. Pretty risky and obviously, in hind sight, not smart. Hopefully he completes his comeback someday but right now he's a liability.

[adjacent]

Well, after tonight may be we need two of DeVries, Gibson, Deduno, etc. In the case of Pelfrey, maybe is still the lack of control after surgery. But in the case of Worley, he says he is fine, but you can see from the TV that his pitches are very hittable. Everything is thigh high.

[h2oface]

I don't know how Hendricks, and his performance this year in Rocester, warrants consideration at all at this point!

[cmathewson]

Hendriks might not, but Gibson does. While we're at it, can we swap Worley for Deduno when he's ready?

[Joe A. Preusser]

I like Pelfrey very much, but he just isn't performing at the major league level right now. It's time to give Gibson an extended look up north.

[Joe A. Preusser]

Hendriks might not, but Gibson does. While we're at it, can we swap Worley for Deduno when he's ready?

 

I agree, I'd like to see Deduno up with the club as well. Worley can be a contributer for years, but he has to get it together first.

[bear333]

Yep he's gotta go down, for awhile at least. Let's see what Gibsons got if Devries or Deduno aren't healthy anyway. Didn't mind Gardy sending him out for the 6th so much as leaving him out there to face Fielder with 2 men on. Pretty risky and obviously, in hind sight, not smart. Hopefully he completes his comeback someday but right now he's a liability.

Pelfrey is getting better but he still is only good for five. He was lucky to get out of the fifth and should not have been brought out for the sixth. Gardy screwed that one up and lost the game, not Palfrey, Pelfrey was done for the night. There is no one else to bring up yet so talking about sending Pelfrey down makes no sense. Worley looks worse at this point. He is the one that should go down first but not until someone can come up and do better and that is not Hendricks. It would help if the M&M boys would hit like they are paid to. Could be a frustrating year. They really are close to being good and much better than last year. A fan can only be so patient and we have all been very patient. Thank God KC has been pitching so well. I guess time will tell. We are all praying that the help that is on its way does not wait too long.

[mako83]

I still don't understand why gardy does not stick with a five man rotation because of all thess ppds we only see worley and pelfrey. Reset the rotation have diamond,correria,hernadez 123 so when devries, deduno, or gibson is ready, we can slot them in.

[Thrylos]

Hendriks might not, but Gibson does. While we're at it, can we swap Worley for Deduno when he's ready?

 

Here are some fun numbers:

 

FIP: Worley 4.59, Pelfrey 4.58, Hernandez 4.58

BABIP: Worley .396, Pelfrey .370, Hernandez .250

 

Small sample size in a much colder than usual April. The tide will turn. Hard to make conclusions after 5 games. The Twins did the same last season with Marquis and gave up too early and then he started putting numbers similar to the top two Twins' pitchers last season (4.04, 1.302 WHIP, 7.6 K/9, 2.82 K/BB )

Give it some time.

[Linus]

The thing about this that doesn't work is his one year contract. If he isn't producing now there really isn't a payoff for the Twins in letting him "rehab" at the major league level because he is not likely to be here next year. He's valuable to the Twins only if he can produce now, not next year. That's much different than Worley who they have a vested interest in.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I wonder if Gardenhire ran him out there to force a decision. Either Pelfrey can pitch a decent six inning game or he can't. Running out of steam in the fifth inning of every game (or earlier) isn't acceptable in the Major Leagues.

 

I'd be surprised if he sticks in the rotation if he throws another clunker in his next start.

[TheLeviathan]

For all the recent optimism this thread should be a reminder of one of our biggest issue and the likely culprit for any falling off the team has. Just wait until the wheels fall off Correia....it could get ugly.

 

but yeah, said the same thing about Pelfrey two weeks ago. Guy should still be rehabbing more than trying to cut it her.

[jimbo92107]

Agreed. Pelfrey needs to work, but not at the mlb level until he finds better movement. Meanwhile, bring up Hendriks or Gibson for a cup of coffee.

[Badsmerf]

I wonder if Gardenhire ran him out there to force a decision. Either Pelfrey can pitch a decent six inning game or he can't. Running out of steam in the fifth inning of every game (or earlier) isn't acceptable in the Major Leagues.

 

I'd be surprised if he sticks in the rotation if he throws another clunker in his next start.

I think Gardy is notorious for that. He will push guys and if they can perform he gives them a little more leash, and if they fail he tightens the knot. I have felt that this is his management style. I don't disagree with it all the time, but when you have a chance to win a game against the best team in the division you should probably just try to get that win.

[Nick Nelson]

Pelfrey is getting better but he still is only good for five. He was lucky to get out of the fifth and should not have been brought out for the sixth. Gardy screwed that one up and lost the game, not Palfrey, Pelfrey was done for the night.

 

If Pelfrey is done for the night after five innings and ~80 pitches then he shouldn't be in the majors, which is basically my entire point.

[Mike Sixel]

Why not? In the era of 12-13 pitchers on a staff, with guys that can go up and down from AAA, why can't you have a guy that is good* for 5 innings, but can't go further?

 

*note, I am responding to the "if he can't go more than 5 innings" concept, not if Pelfrey can even be good or not.....

[LewFordLives]

I concur with Linus. Pelfrey is not in the Twins long term plans and if he's not effective then they should consider sending him to Rochester or eating the rest of his contract and parting ways. It was an experiment that seems to be failing. It happens. Let's move on. Once they're healthy, we need to see what guys like DeVries and Deduno can do and whether we can count on them for the future.

[Linus]

With regards to Gardy's decision to send him back out there, its easy to see everything clearly after the fact but I do tend to agree that he is too conservative on making a change. Its happened a couple times already. The thing that drives me nuts is when the rationale is "its his game, he deserved to go out there for the (plug in the inning)". What about his teammates? Don't they deserve the best possible chance to win? Isn't that more important than stroking some starters ego?

[Mike Sixel]

DeVries? We know what he is...a reliever.

[drivlikejehu]

Of the 132 pitchers with 20+ innings so far on the season, Pelfrey ranks #132 in xFIP. He's not the same guy he was previously- and he wasn't particularly good previously.

 

The Twins were most probably too aggressive by throwing him straight into the rotation. I understand that they wanted to start Gibson in AAA and a couple other back end options got hurt, but Pelfrey just doesn't have it. I'd start Albers over him at this point.

[ashbury]

I wonder if Gardenhire ran him out there to force a decision. Either Pelfrey can pitch a decent six inning game or he can't. Running out of steam in the fifth inning of every game (or earlier) isn't acceptable in the Major Leagues.

 

I tend to over-think these scenarios and assume wheels within wheels are turning in the front office and the dugout, but this is what I think could be going on as well. Pelfrey may already have refused the minor league assignment, management says "OK, show us, and given your one-year contract you may want to reconsider".

[Linus]

I tend to over-think these scenarios and assume wheels within wheels are turning in the front office and the dugout, but this is what I think could be going on as well. Pelfrey may already have refused the minor league assignment, management says "OK, show us, and given your one-year contract you may want to reconsider".

 

Well, a few more starts like this and they should really consider DFA. Again, what good is it to us if he figures it out, breaks some scar tissue loose and starts pitching better in August? At this point, I'm sure he would clear waivers as I doubt anybody will take on the contract if they can let him clear.

[Nick Nelson]

Why not? In the era of 12-13 pitchers on a staff, with guys that can go up and down from AAA, why can't you have a guy that is good* for 5 innings, but can't go further?

 

*note, I am responding to the "if he can't go more than 5 innings" concept, not if Pelfrey can even be good or not.....

Well I wasn't talking about it as an abstract concept, I was talking about this particular scenario. The Twins signed Pelfrey to be a veteran innings-eater; they can't afford to have him be a 5IP-max guy, as they're too liable for short starts elsewhere in the rotation (see: Tuesday night). And of course, Pelfrey cannot be relied upon to consistently provide even five good innings, so the point is moot.

 

I think the calls to release him are premature. He's got his velocity back and he's feeling good so I could easily see him putting together a solid second half once he's straightened out. But right now this isn't working. A 6.5% K-rate is embarrassing. That's not big-league caliber. He's getting hit and he's getting hit hard.

 

There's a real double-standard in play when Liam Hendriks is getting bumped down for far lesser offenses. I have a hard time understanding that since Hendriks is the one that actually that may figure into the long term plan.

[cmathewson]

Why not? In the era of 12-13 pitchers on a staff, with guys that can go up and down from AAA, why can't you have a guy that is good* for 5 innings, but can't go further?

 

*note, I am responding to the "if he can't go more than 5 innings" concept, not if Pelfrey can even be good or not.....

 

Because we have at least one other guy who can give us six innings and who deserves a shot. At least that's my answer.

[Mike Sixel]

Well, if it was me, I'd go with Hendriks....because I see no future in Pelfrey, nor in this year when they bascially punted on adding talent, so ya, I agree with you there. Let's see what Liam has or does not have, signing another mediocre veteran does nothing to help at all.

[stringer bell]

The Twins have a bunch of guys who might be useful as back-end starters. Hendriks is the youngest and probably has the most upside, but there is De Vries, Deduno, and Walters. If the Twins want to limit Gibson's innings, the #5 spot becomes #4. Walters is currently pitching very well in Rochester, while De Vries and Deduno are rehabbing. I would like to see some answer on the usefulness of these guys, so they can either commit or dispose of them.

[Mike Sixel]

Or move them to the bullpen, yes. but they'll never find out if Pelfrey is up here instead of them.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Well I wasn't talking about it as an abstract concept, I was talking about this particular scenario. The Twins signed Pelfrey to be a veteran innings-eater; they can't afford to have him be a 5IP-max guy, as they're too liable for short starts elsewhere in the rotation (see: Tuesday night). And of course, Pelfrey cannot be relied upon to consistently provide even five good innings, so the point is moot.

 

I think the calls to release him are premature. He's got his velocity back and he's feeling good so I could easily see him putting together a solid second half once he's straightened out. But right now this isn't working. A 6.5% K-rate is embarrassing. That's not big-league caliber. He's getting hit and he's getting hit hard.

 

There's a real double-standard in play when Liam Hendriks is getting bumped down for far lesser offenses. I have a hard time understanding that since Hendriks is the one that actually that may figure into the long term plan.

 

Exactly. If the Twins are going to give innings to a 5 IP, gonna-get-shelled-every-other-start, no-strikeout pitcher, it should be Hendriks.

 

Pelfrey is gone after this season. If you're going to throw away innings, give 'em to the guy that might turn into a decent back of the rotation type pitcher for 4+ years.