Non-Twins Off-season news, tidbits and transactions

[cmoss84]

 

Twins have no money on the books I believe after this year.  The issue with the strike could be a reason for most teams not writing contracts into 2022.  That issue could be if the players in a strike would have to be paid because they have a signed deal. 

Do players get paid when they are striking? Or is it on a player by player basis depending on their contract?

[cmoss84]

 

I think for LeMahieu, that is light.

Will be interesting to compare how well LeMahieu/Dozier/Schoop/Lowrie do in the next year or two. 

[beckmt]

 

Do players get paid when they are striking? Or is it on a player by player basis depending on their contract?

I believe this would be the following.

1. Strike would start after the 2021 CBA expires. (if authorized by the union)

2. Players who are not free agents after their contract ends for 2021, would still be owned by the team they were on in 2021.  These players who are on strike would not be paid.

3. Players who are free agents are just that, they would not be paid.

4. Players under contract terms for 2022 and beyond are the issue.  As far as I know this has not been resolved(at least since 1995).  These players could say they are going to report at the standard time, idea being to convert this to a lockout of these players and these players could then sue for breach of contract (though MLB still has the supreme court exception to a lot of these rules, but under a different court this may or may not be upheld, and it is a major threat to the owners if they lost this exemption.) This is why I do not feel the strike would last long into the next season, because losing this exemption is worth a ton of money.  But this is very unknown territory, and if you lost this exemption, you could start a new baseball league.  Also think the minor leaguers will want some protection and compensation changes which will also be a issue because they are not part of the union.  Interesting area, because by the time this issue comes up the Supreme Court may be very anti-union.

Be aware this is a very gray area, as it will also affect like professional people like IT with how much is owned by the company and what is the employees.

 

[bird]

 

Jed Lowrie signs with the Mets. 2/$20 ish range.

The Mets are continuing to spend money and trying to win. I commend them for that.

 

 

I'm just curious, Vanimal. If Schoop has a better season than Lowrie, does this mean the Mets weren't trying to win? 

 

I kinda think this "trying to win" stuff is, well, a bit insulting towards the FO. They disagree with us a lot. We want them to do things they choose not to do. Why tie it to effort? Why can't they have their own reasons, right?

[Vanimal46]

I'm just curious, Vanimal. If Schoop has a better season than Lowrie, does this mean the Mets weren't trying to win?

 

I kinda think this "trying to win" stuff is, well, a bit insulting towards the FO. They disagree with us a lot. We want them to do things they choose not to do. Why tie it to effort? Why can't they have their own reasons, right?

The Mets have done more than just this signing to show they are trying to win.

 

Acquisitions:

 

Cano

Diaz

Ramos

Familia

Broxton

Lowrie

 

All for their MLB roster. Some of these moves aren't going to work out with enough hindsight, but at the moment they're generating excitement for the fans. For me, that's trying to win more than other clubs are showing this offseason. Including our favorite ballclub.

[Mike Sixel]

I don't understand the Yankees here at all. They are sitting on billions in profits. I hope they lose a playoff spot by one game, hopefully caused by their SS.

[cmoss84]

Ottavino signs a 3/27 deal with the Yanks. Good for them, he will fill a huge gaping hole in a really bad bullpen. Now they only have 4 potential closers and 3 RP that strike everyone out (along with 2 other shut-down 6th inn guys). Good luck scoring runs on them from the 6th inning on. Looks like they have a good shot of overtaking the Red Sox this year. Red Sox better resign Kimbrel or they are going to be in rough shape. 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Oliver Drake DFA'd.

 

 

Again.

 

Item #43,847 that needs addressing in the upcoming CBA / Work stoppage

[TheLeviathan]

Sonny Gray for some B- dude from Cincy. Ugh.

[beckmt]

Sonny Gray in another band box, ugh!

[Regular Sized Rudy]

 

Sonny Gray in another band box, ugh!

Poor Sonny Gray has his work cut out for him. But the Reds are already discussing an extension with him, so good for Sonny.

[TheLeviathan]

3 years and 30M for Gray.  Tell me that doesn't sound really good.

 

Ugh, we should've been all over that.

[biggentleben]

Also a draft pick that went...and that's not a small thing.

[nicksaviking]

 

3 years and 30M for Gray.  Tell me that doesn't sound really good.

 

Ugh, we should've been all over that.

 

I've never been a Sonny Gray fan and after last season I couldn't believe the Yankees had any leverage to get anything for him. I've never cared for Brian Cashamn, but he did some good work there forcing teams to bid on Gray's road splits. I'm pretty surprised the other clubs didn't laugh at him until the asking price was in line with his actual performance.

[nicksaviking]

Asdrubal Cabrera is less than half as valuable as Jonathan Schoop I guess?

 

[biggentleben]

 

I've never been a Sonny Gray fan and after last season I couldn't believe the Yankees had any leverage to get anything for him. I've never cared for Brian Cashamn, but he did some good work there forcing teams to bid on Gray's road splits. I'm pretty surprised the other clubs didn't laugh at him until the asking price was in line with his actual performance.

 

Gray and Chris Archer are absolutely on the same page to me. I'll pay for a #3 starter if I'm trading for them, and there is value in that, but neither is an ace, no matter what split you pull up.

[Mr. Brooks]

Asdrubal Cabrera is less than half as valuable as Jonathan Schoop I guess?

 

https://twitter.com/JeffPassan/status/1087756565279588352

Cabrera's ceiling is significantly capped by his age (6 years older than Schoop), and dreadful fielding.

He's topped 2 bWAR just once in the last 7 years (2.8), whereas Schoop is only 1 bad year removed from a 5.2 bWAR season (and 2.4 the year before).

Cabrera could very well outperform Schoop this year, but I'd much rather gamble on the ceiling of Schoop.

[biggentleben]

About the only thing that Cabrera has on Schoop is switch-hitting. I'd trust Schoop for better defense, better contact, better power, and more ability to play multiple positions around the infield if that's a need over Cabrera.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

 

Gray and Chris Archer are absolutely on the same page to me. I'll pay for a #3 starter if I'm trading for them, and there is value in that, but neither is an ace, no matter what split you pull up.

Gray in context of the Twins would be a monumental step up over Martin Perez and has a higher likelihood than Pineda of being "good".

 

He got 3/30 extension and already has 7 on the books for 19. 4 years 37 million for a mid rotation starter is perfectly reasonable, and he seems to be a better bet than Ricky Nolasco. 

[nicksaviking]

Gray and Chris Archer are absolutely on the same page to me. I'll pay for a #3 starter if I'm trading for them, and there is value in that, but neither is an ace, no matter what split you pull up.

Our view of Gray is significantly different. He looks like a swing man to me. That road split everyone was excited about was smoke and mirrors. He had 12 road games last year and half were against Baltimore and Toronto. One start was against the White Sox and another against the Twins (where he was chased after 3 innings). He had four road games against non terrible teams and had two OK outings, one bad outing and a butt whipping by Boston.

 

His improvement wasn’t on the road, it was when he got moved to the pen, where his ERA dropped by a full run the last two months of the season. That’s where he belongs, just like everyone predicted when he was drafted. He proved everyone wrong for about three years though, albeit playing in a pitcher’s paradise in Oakland.

[biggentleben]

 

Gray in context of the Twins would be a monumental step up over Martin Perez and has a higher likelihood than Pineda of being "good".

 

He got 3/30 extension and already has 7 on the books for 19. 4 years 37 million for a mid rotation starter is perfectly reasonable, and he seems to be a better bet than Ricky Nolasco. 

 

I've never complained about this particular deal. I do think it's on the high side of value, primarily because I've heard the value of a lot of teams of the pick that the Reds just gave up, and combining that with Long, who is one of their top-10 prospects is more of a #2 value, rather than a #3 that should be on the low end of his value right now. However, overall, this is not a bad deal for what Gray's overall value is.

 

That said, I'll continue to beat the drum that many Twins fans beg for brand names when they have guys with as much or more talent sitting in AAA that are getting pushed out by additional name guys. It's why I mentioned the pitching strategy I did early in the offseason. Using guys like Gonsalves, Romero, Littell, Stewart, De Jong, Thorpe, and guys like Poppen, Jax, Wells, and more as they got ready.

 

Rather than dump big money into a guy that you can't pull out of the rotation due to your investment, getting guys like Perez that are flyers and can be shoved to the bullpen or released if they don't succeed are great gambles. The Braves had multiple guys like that last year, two of them competing to the end of camp for a job in Anibal Sanchez and Scott Kazmir. Kazmir's money was paid for already through the deal to acquire him, so cutting him didn't hurt at all, and he wasn't able to win a job in the rotation or bullpen. Sanchez was stellar and continued that into the regular season. That's more what the Twins should target while leaving the door open for their young guys to push their way to jobs.

[biggentleben]

 

Our view of Gray is significantly different. He looks like a swing man to me. That road split everyone was excited about was smoke and mirrors. He had 12 road games last year and half were against Baltimore and Toronto. One start was against the White Sox and another against the Twins (where he was chased after 3 innings). He had four road games against non terrible teams and had two OK outings, one bad outing and a butt whipping by Boston.

His improvement wasn’t on the road, it was when he got moved to the pen, where his ERA dropped by a full run the last two months of the season. That’s where he belongs, just like everyone predicted when he was drafted. He proved everyone wrong for about three years though, albeit playing in a pitcher’s paradise in Oakland.

 

I think we agree, but in different ways. If you read scouting reports, a guy with excellent two-pitch mix at good velo with stamina enough to last in the rotation will often be pushed to develop a third pitch to a fringe-average level. Then he can put up 200 average to above-average innings as a predominantly two-pitch guy, working as a 3/4 guy in a rotation. That's how I see Gray and Archer both - dominant two-pitch guys with fringy stuff otherwise but the stamina to work a lineup multiple times (and often good K numbers to make people think they could be more than they are).

 

A good example from the recent past is Derek Lowe. He was essentially a two-pitch pitcher, with a dominant sinker and slider. He used his change over 10% of the time multiple times in his career, but it was never a great pitch for him, working within 5 MPH of his sinker as a starter. He was able to be dominant as a closer and an inning-eater mid-rotation guy, making at least 32 starts for the next 10 years.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

I've never complained about this particular deal. I do think it's on the high side of value, primarily because I've heard the value of a lot of teams of the pick that the Reds just gave up, and combining that with Long, who is one of their top-10 prospects is more of a #2 value, rather than a #3 that should be on the low end of his value right now. However, overall, this is not a bad deal for what Gray's overall value is.

 

That said, I'll continue to beat the drum that many Twins fans beg for brand names when they have guys with as much or more talent sitting in AAA that are getting pushed out by additional name guys. It's why I mentioned the pitching strategy I did early in the offseason. Using guys like Gonsalves, Romero, Littell, Stewart, De Jong, Thorpe, and guys like Poppen, Jax, Wells, and more as they got ready.

 

Rather than dump big money into a guy that you can't pull out of the rotation due to your investment, getting guys like Perez that are flyers and can be shoved to the bullpen or released if they don't succeed are great gambles. The Braves had multiple guys like that last year, two of them competing to the end of camp for a job in Anibal Sanchez and Scott Kazmir. Kazmir's money was paid for already through the deal to acquire him, so cutting him didn't hurt at all, and he wasn't able to win a job in the rotation or bullpen. Sanchez was stellar and continued that into the regular season. That's more what the Twins should target while leaving the door open for their young guys to push their way to jobs.

Long would be somewhere in the 10-20 range for the Twins and a comp pick for a year of a solid mid rotation starter isn’t so bad.

 

I’m with you on Perez, better to go in house than Perez.

 

A- you need more than one pitcher with 20+ MLB starts under his belt for 2020

 

B- Mejia as the floor is just as good if not better than Perez and Mejia is a strikeout/fly ball guy which fits the team fielding strength better than the ground ball machine.

[Otto von Ballpark]

B- Mejia as the floor is just as good if not better than Perez and Mejia is a strikeout/fly ball guy which fits the team fielding strength better than the ground ball machine.

FWIW, Mejia finished the 2018 season on the shelf. Not sure how much we can count on him yet? A non-guaranteed deal for Perez would have been better, obviously...

[biggentleben]

Cold weather across the country apparently turned on the heat on the hot stove:

 

A.J. Pollock to the Dodgers

 

Dodgers now turning energy to Realmuto

 

Brad Brach to Cubs

 

Hunter Strickland to Mariners

[Danchat]

The Astros got Wade Miley on a one year deal for  $4.5M... that's a bargain compared to what Martin Perez got!!

[Mr. Brooks]

The Astros got Wade Miley on a one year deal for $4.5M... that's a bargain compared to what Martin Perez got!!

Martin Perez has a better ERA+ than Wade Miley, and is 5 years younger. And the Twins got an option.

[sweetmusicviola16]

Nolan Arenado with a record 26 mil arb settlement.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Nolan Arenado with a record 26 mil arb settlement.

I think technically the sides reached a settlement, but wow. And he's worth it

[sweetmusicviola16]

 

I think technically the sides reached a settlement, but wow. And he's worth it

Yes it was a mutual settlement. Rox offered 24mil, Arenado asked for 30mil. I guess the team "won" the settlement. Wow indeed.