The Theory of DFAing Joe Mauer?

[caninatl04]

It has to be asked:  what is the cost of DFAing Joe Mauer?  If he's claimed, its a huge savings. If not, a 40 man roster spot opens up.

 

I doubt there are any current advantages, but could it be used in theory to free up cash and or a 40 man roster spot?

[Willihammer]

They just DFA'd Park, don't need the roster spot.

If by chance Park, Vargas, and Sano dominate AND Mauer struggles then maybe you DFA him to get Park onto the roster.

[Oldgoat_MN]

 

It has to be asked:  what is the cost of DFAing Joe Mauer?  If he's claimed, its a huge savings. If not, a 40 man roster spot opens up.

 

I doubt there are any current advantages, but could it be used in theory to free up cash and or a 40 man roster spot?

First of all, you do not save any cash if you  DFA Mauer. You pay him $46M over the next two season whether he is on the roster or not.
Second, I don't believe any other team would take on that salary based on where he is at in his career now. 
Third, he is still an on base machine. He was second only to Robbie Grossman last year with a .363 OBP while providing above average fielding at 1B.

 

I like you thinking outside the box, but this isn't likely to happen this year.

[Physics Guy]

First of all, you do not save any cash if you  DFA Mauer. You pay him $46M over the next two season whether he is on the roster or not.

Second, I don't believe any other team would take on that salary based on where he is at in his career now. 

Third, he is still an on base machine. He was second only to Robbie Grossman last year with a .363 OBP while providing above average fielding at 1B.

 

I like you thinking outside the box, but this isn't likely to happen this year.

I agree it isn't likely to happen, but I think his point is valid. If somebody claims him, I believe they pay his salary and the Twins are off the hook. I don't think it's wise at this point since Mauer is by far the best option as the #2 batter in the lineup.

[gil4]

I'm just curious, does the no-trade clause affect waivers?  If someone claims him, does he have to either go or retire? 

[gil4]

 

I agree it isn't likely to happen, but I think his point is valid. If somebody claims him, I believe they pay his salary and the Twins are off the hook. I don't think it's wise at this point since Mauer is by far the best option as the #2 batter in the lineup.

 

There is almost no chance he's claimed.  He would become a free agent and the Twins would owe him his full salary (minus whatever some team signs him for, IIRC, which would probably be the minimum.)

[Oldgoat_MN]

 

I'm just curious, does the no-trade clause affect waivers?  If someone claims him, does he have to either go or retire? 

 

Good question.

I have no idea, but you'd think the players union would have thought of that.

[Brandon Warne]

But....why? As long as he's one of the team's nine best hitters, he'll be on the squad. He still gets on base. Not to be rude, but this post doesn't make any sense. 

[HitInAPinch]

Who on earth would claim him?  And, I'm reasonably sure the a guaranteed contract still needs to be paid by somebody.

[USAFChief]

But....why? As long as he's one of the team's nine best hitters, he'll be on the squad. He still gets on base. Not to be rude, but this post doesn't make any sense.

 

"One of the team's best nine hitters" isn't the deciding factor. Most teams aren't playing their best nine hitters. They have better hitters on the bench or in the minors than their catcher, or shortstop, for example.

 

It's whether or not they have, or could have, better players at the position(s) he plays. And in this case, they probably don't.

[drjim]

"One of the team's best nine hitters" isn't the deciding factor. Most teams aren't playing their best nine hitters. They have better hitters on the bench or in the minors than their catcher, or shortstop, for example.

 

It's whether or not they have, or could have, better players at the position(s) he plays. And in this case, they probably don't.

At the beginning of the season I'd take out the 'probably'.

[mazeville]

Oh for crying out loud.

 

1. Mauer is still one of the best players on the team in terms of getting on base.

2. Mauer is the team's best defensive first baseman.

3. Nobody is going to take on that salary.

4. His numbers will look much better this year when his at-bats v. lefthanders are limited.

 

There is zero point in dropping Mauer or putting him on waivers hoping another team will claim him. I think the Twins long ago should have put Mauer at third or in right field, rather than first. But at this point, it is what it is. He's a Twin for the next two years. And he gives the Twins something they generally lack by getting on base.

[Brock Beauchamp]

No one will claim Joe Mauer.

 

That means you pay him $23m to play for the Twins or you pay him $23m to not play for the Twins.

 

Those are your two options.

[lukeduke1980]

I think the Twins are happy to try the 400 at-bat season first.  And in 5 years there will be a statue so no he will never be DFA'd.

[Steve Lein]

As much as people like to obsess about how Mauer hasn't been the same guy as he used to be, he's still pretty firmly one of their best 9 position players as a hitter. 

 

Does he need to play less and/or be part of a platoon at 1B? I think so. But that's a far cry from DFA-ing him. Absolutely zero reason for that.

[Squirrel]

No one will claim Joe Mauer.

 

That means you pay him $23m to play for the Twins or you pay him $23m to not play for the Twins.

 

Those are your two options.

Ah, the gulf between romantic theory and pragmatic reality.

[laloesch]

 

It has to be asked:  what is the cost of DFAing Joe Mauer?  If he's claimed, its a huge savings. If not, a 40 man roster spot opens up.

 

I doubt there are any current advantages, but could it be used in theory to free up cash and or a 40 man roster spot?

 

No disrespect intended but this subject has literally been beaten to a pulp.  Mauer is not going to be DFA'd no matter how much we wish it.  He's not going to retire early, etc.  Joe is going to collect every last penny of this contract and i don't blame him.  Your one chance to get filthy NASTY rich, why not do it!!! 

[Blake]

I think, though, that some people, rightly or wrongly, think the Twins have a tendency to put players on the field because, darn it, they are paying them a lot of money...even though the player is well past his "sell by" date.

 

I freely admit I was one of those when it came to Joe Mauer until I looked at his numbers. Which made me rethink my antipathy toward Mr. Mauer.

 

However, I also think people fear the Front Office will do the same and continue to play Mauer well beyond the time when he should have been let go. (this is assuming a huge drop off between now and the end of Mauer's contract)

[Thrylos]

The Twins have bigger problems than Mauer at this point, and Mauer is hardly a problem....

[Mike Sixel]

Until they have a better option, I keep him around. But comparing him to other 1B isn't exactly great news for their competitiveness. He's just pretty meh. It's not just that he's 18th among qualified 1B in wRC+....it's how far he is from the top 10.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

It has to be asked:  what is the cost of DFAing Joe Mauer?  If he's claimed, its a huge savings. If not, a 40 man roster spot opens up.

 

I doubt there are any current advantages, but could it be used in theory to free up cash and or a 40 man roster spot?

Without a waiver claim or a trade, you'd have to release Mauer and pay him his full salary to get him off the 40-man roster (and he'd be a free agent at that point, you wouldn't have the ability to outright him to AAA).  He has enough service time that he can refuse any outright assignment off the 40-man roster.

[Mike Sixel]

Here's an off the wall question....

 

Are the Twins better off with Dozier at 1B, Polanco at 2B, and the new SS.....

 

or...

 

Mauer at 1B, Dozier at 2B, and either Polanco or the new SS

 

I'm not sure the answer is obvious right now.

 

edit:

Polanco has the same wRC+ as Mauer, but plays 2B, not 1B. Dozier kills Mauer on offense. We assume new SS kills Polanco on defense.

 

So, what is the value of a much better defensive SS, replacing a 1 WAR Mauer, basically?

[ashbury]

I'm just curious, does the no-trade clause affect waivers?  If someone claims him, does he have to either go or retire? 

I'm not an expert on the collective bargaining agreement, but I would be absolutely shocked if you could get around a no-trade provision (either in a contract, or just by virtue of being a 10/5 guy) through DFA shenanigans and have him wind up on another team or in the minors or anything else.

 

A player with no-trade rights can not be told, "no, you can either earn your salary by playing for this other team, or retire and forfeit your salary."

 

Having the team's financial obligation to him magically taken off their hands is less than a pipe dream.

 

A DFA of Joe Mauer means one thing only: releasing him and eating the remaining contract. No financial resources would be freed up, just the roster spot. So forget about the money: is he so bad that, if he cost nothing, you would not put him on the 25-man?

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I'm just curious, does the no-trade clause affect waivers?  If someone claims him, does he have to either go or retire? 

"No trade" protection indeed affects waivers.  For outright assignment waivers (removing a player from the 40-man):

 

http://www.thecubreporter.com/book/export/html/3530

 

A player who has a "no trade" right (full or partial) must waive his "no trade" right before he can be placed on Outright Assignment Waivers.

 

Same with August trade waivers:

 

http://www.thecubreporter.com/book/export/html/3528

 

A player with a "no trade" right can refuse both a waiver claim and a trade assignment

 

Pretty much the only way to get Mauer off the roster would be releasing him, but we'd still owe him his full salary.

[Squirrel]

Here's an off the wall question....

 

Are the Twins better off with Dozier at 1B, Polanco at 2B, and the new SS.....

 

or...

 

Mauer at 1B, Dozier at 2B, and either Polanco or the new SS

 

I'm not sure the answer is obvious right now.

 

edit:

Polanco has the same wRC+ as Mauer, but plays 2B, not 1B. Dozier kills Mauer on offense. We assume new SS kills Polanco on defense.

 

So, what is the value of a much better defensive SS, replacing a 1 WAR Mauer, basically?

I think you already answered your own question ... I'm not sure the answer is obvious right now. I'll take it a step further and I'd say that right now, the latter. But I'm not sure how far down the line it would be the former. I'd have to see that set up in action and see it gel before giving a 'real' answer.

[ashbury]

Pretty much the only way to get Mauer off the roster would be releasing him, but we'd still owe him his full salary.

We make a good team. I provide the bland useless skepticism, you provide the facts.

[Squirrel]

We make a good team. I provide the bland useless skepticism, you provide the facts.

 

 

I think Brock pretty much nailed that point, and succinctly so, with this post.

 

 

No one will claim Joe Mauer.

 

That means you pay him $23m to play for the Twins or you pay him $23m to not play for the Twins.

 

Those are your two options.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

We make a good team. I provide the bland useless skepticism, you provide the facts.

I only hope I have "no trade" protection on this team, or a prohibitively high salary.

[laloesch]

 

Until they have a better option, I keep him around. But comparing him to other 1B isn't exactly great news for their competitiveness. He's just pretty meh. It's not just that he's 18th among qualified 1B in wRC+....it's how far he is from the top 10.

 

Kepler can play 1st.  After 2018 we might see Kepler, Vargas and Palka all their sporadically.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Kepler can play 1st.  After 2018 we might see Kepler, Vargas and Palka all their sporadically.

 

Agreed, but then they need a RF or LF to replace him.....I've often felt he matures into Morneau, with more speed.