2016 Election Thread

[Craig Arko]

 

Well, I'm just shocked, possibly naively, that the electorate can't seem to focus on what matters, that's all.

IQ is another thing that the U.S. has outsourced.

 

*edit - getting sloppy with my use of 'America.'

[USAFChief]

 

Well, I'm just shocked, possibly naively, that the electorate can't seem to focus on what matters, that's all.

There's what should be, and what is.

 

I know which one I think ends up mattering more in an election.

[nicksaviking]

 

Warren is a one trick pony. It's an amazing trick but she isn't nearly as qualified as Hillary.

 

I wouldn't dispute that, but for half the population, being qualified is a negative it seems.

[twinsnorth49]

 

There's what should be, and what is.

 

I know which one I think ends up mattering more in an election.

Maybe someday they'll be the same thing.......hopefully.

[TheLeviathan]

 

Both Bushes got ill during big functions. The younger vomited and passed out at a big state dinner. The press was pretty minimal. Yes, it was discussed, he was sick, he was going to fine, then everyone moved on.

But thanks for doubling down from the media rabbit hole.

 

George Bush STILL gets mocked for that!!!!  Seriously, this paragraph demonstrates that you've lost perspective on this issue.  

 

I was a kid and I remember the ridicule he got for that.  I even knew what the Simpsons were referring to when they joked he'd "ruin them like a Japanese banquet"

 

She passed out at a 15 year anniversary of 9/11 function and was carried to her car.  Then there was silence about her status for an hour and a half.  If that happening to the leading Presidential candidate isn't news....what the hell is?

[DaveW]

 

Maybe, but when's the last time you recall a candidate passing out on a prominent stage like that?  That'll never be back page.  

 

If Obama keels over tomorrow at a speech about energy, I guarantee you that'll get plenty of coverage too.

Didn't Bob Dole collapse and fall off a stage?

 

Nobody made that into some huge deal, it was just a funny image.

[DaveW]

 

George Bush STILL gets mocked for that!!!!  Seriously, this paragraph demonstrates that you've lost perspective on this issue.  

 

I was a kid and I remember the ridicule he got for that.  I even knew what the Simpsons were referring to when they joked he'd "ruin them like a Japanese banquet"

 

She passed out at a 15 year anniversary of 9/11 function and was carried to her car.  Then there was silence about her status for an hour and a half.  If that happening to the leading Presidential candidate isn't news....what the hell is?

The difference is that people JOKE about the Bush incidents, nobody claimed that they were unfit to be POTUS because of it.

 

Nobody is joking about the Hillary one, everyone is using it as the "Hillary is too sick and old to run!!1!" meme.

 

Fun fact: Trump is 2 years older than Hillary, and most certainly lived a more "reckless" lifestyle up to this point.

[Craig Arko]

President Ford (who's actually one of my favorites):

 

[TheLeviathan]

 

The difference is that people JOKE about the Bush incidents, nobody claimed that they were unfit to be POTUS because of it.

 

Nobody is joking about the Hillary one, everyone is using it as the "Hillary is too sick and old to run!!1!" meme.

 

Fun fact: Trump is 2 years older than Hillary, and most certainly lived a more "reckless" lifestyle up to this point.

 

And if he collapses while attending an event I doubt it'll be "back page" news.

[DaveW]

 

And if he collapses while attending an event I doubt it'll be "back page" news

You are missing the bigger (main point) nobody would be out claiming that it should/could disqualify him for being POTUS.

[TheLeviathan]

 

You are missing the bigger (main point) nobody would be out claiming that it should/could disqualify him for being POTUS.

 

First, what the opposition makes a big deal about is almost always ridiculous or overstated.  That's a given.  Second, any rampant speculation was caused by the campaigns elusive unwillingness to just take a minor issue head on rather than letting it snow ball.  They let it snow ball because they badly miscalculated things.

[Craig Arko]

Wow, actual comments about actual issues.

 

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-do-the-presidential-candidates-know-about-science/

[twinsnorth49]

 

George Bush STILL gets mocked for that!!!!  Seriously, this paragraph demonstrates that you've lost perspective on this issue.  

 

I was a kid and I remember the ridicule he got for that.  I even knew what the Simpsons were referring to when they joked he'd "ruin them like a Japanese banquet"

 

She passed out at a 15 year anniversary of 9/11 function and was carried to her car.  Then there was silence about her status for an hour and a half.  If that happening to the leading Presidential candidate isn't news....what the hell is?

Wait, the goal posts are moving here. Nobody said it shouldn't be news, they just said it shouldn't be an ongoing issue or some indication of her worthiness to be POTUS.

[TheLeviathan]

 

Wait, the goal posts are moving here. Nobody said it shouldn't be news, they just said it shouldn't be an ongoing issue or some indication of her worthiness to be POTUS.

 

It only becomes an ongoing issue when the answers are elusive. 

 

It's also a major issue if your campaign team bungles something so simple as to blow it up into a firestorm.  I mean, she got a cold and her team managed to handle that with such "skill" that it became a massive issue.

 

You know why that's a problem for me?  Will this kind of bungling nonsense continue to the point that they actually find a way to lose this thing?

 

I don't know if she has actual health issues to be worried about.  I am 95% sure she doesn't.  The other 5% of me that wonders is solely the responsibility of her team's mismanagement of a simple issue.  It wouldn't be ongoing or having reasonable people wondering aloud but for a total misfire by her campaign.

[DaveW]

Her team "mismanaged" things on a MINOR issue for what, like an hour and a half?

It's really just not that big of a deal. Trump will inevitably say something insnae in the next 72 hours which will then change the discussion...yet again.

 

 

[TheLeviathan]

 

Her team "mismanaged" things on a MINOR issue for what, like an hour and a half?

It's really just not that big of a deal. Trump will inevitably say something insnae in the next 72 hours which will then change the discussion...yet again.

 

I have no doubt about the second part.  But doesn't mismanagement of a candidate take all of a few minutes to be a problem, much less an hour and a half?

 

Hell, I'm waiting for the day Trump gives a speech with some dude in a suit standing behind him with a tazer.  Every slip is an opportunity for your opponent.  Her team just flung the doors of opportunity wide open for Trump on something obvious and stupid.

 

Personally, I hope it goes away.  I suspect it won't.

[gunnarthor]

 

Her team "mismanaged" things on a MINOR issue for what, like an hour and a half?

It's really just not that big of a deal. Trump will inevitably say something insnae in the next 72 hours which will then change the discussion...yet again.

I think there are two issues here and people are sort of talking past each other.

 

1) Does pneumonia disqualify her for being President?  Of course not.

2) Does the way the campaign dealt with this issue continue to show a problem of transparency and trustworthiness that makes people not support her?  I think yes.

 

I do think it's fair to consider the health of the candidates but if pneumonia is the only thing, then move on. But the second one, for me, is bigger.  It goes to what we constantly see - a stupid apology while at the same time saying she did something other people who weren't running for President did and wants the same, lower standard applied to her.  And when it's not, we get another round of "press treating Clinton poorly" or such.

[Craig Arko]

In general. I think we're all seeing a reflection of our own predispositions here.

[PseudoSABR]

 

In general. I think we're all seeing a reflection of our own predispositions here.

Confirmation bias is my favorite bias.

[PseudoSABR]

This isn't a surprise, exactly.  But given that the discussion of Clinton is shaded with, well, shade, let's at least put the email issue a bit into perspective. 

[Badsmerf]

I'm so bored with the email thing. Obviously gw and Cheney had their way with information. What about Powell? That administration will go down in history with many crooked things done. Let's not sry them add the standard. That's why i desire hrc to be more transparent and forthcoming. Unfortunately, i believe Asher is unable to anymore.n still might make a fine president, i just believe she it's damaged by what the media has done to her the last decade.

[PseudoSABR]

I think Obama has spoiled us a bit with transparency with what he inherited, but still lacking compared to his campaign promises and we ought to get.  That said, Obama, as much controversy as there seems there was while he was president, seems to be well liked these days (perhaps in relief to his successors). 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Make sure Clinton is rested and ready for the debates and she'll be fine.

[TheLeviathan]

 

Make sure Clinton is rested and ready for the debates and she'll be fine.

 

If the last week is any indication they'll tell us how cool and calm and ready she is before she spontaneously combusts on the stage.

[Shane Wahl]

I don't know how the Clinton campaign can be this incompetent. Good lord . . . Bill referred to it as the damn flu today. Literally do anything else to get news. I have, er, had one Trumpian FB friend. Total lunatic, and totally deplorable. He was posting for months about Clinton's health. And then the footage of her being completely unable to freaking walk and get in a vehicle . . . these people are having a field day with this. Then she later comes out of the apartment with, you know, an illness, and has a photo op with a kid which, I kid you not, caused these lunatics to talk about how she was giving the kid the illness. It is out of control . . . but people have seen these claims for months and dismissed them . . . and then this happens and it turns out that they were secretive about her health. Like . . . being secretive about something else is the WORST thing this campaign can possibly do . . . and they do it. 

 

Obama has officially started the campaign push for her, with that appearance in Philadelphia. Good god what a TOTALLY different feel and level of enthusiasm. I would probably send the Clintons back and forth between Florida and Ohio, plant Kaine in Virginia and N.C., send Obama to Michigan and Colorado, plant Biden in Ohio and Pennsylvania, and send Bernie and Warren to N.H., Michigan, and Wisconsin. 

 

Has Hillary tried La Croix, one wonders? She doesn't like water, but I wonder if she would drink more if it was essenced with flavor. I am not even kidding here. 

[Bark's Lounge]

We live in a world of extra - scrutinization.

 

I am not a great fan of Clinton, but she should be winning this by a grand amount.

 

Preparing for the worst... the god awful worst... we will need people to stand up and fight.

If Trumps wins, all those apposed need to show up and make it a big deal about it. Protest, riots... setting ones self on fire might be acceptable.

 

 

**** Trump and let the fire burn. Let it burn bright and hot as a mutha ****a!!!

[nicksaviking]

If Trump wins, and I still think there's no way he will, I just hope his supporters admit they voted for him and hold themselves accountable afterwords once everything starts falling apart.

 

I have a feeling it would be like segregation though. "What, me?! No I never supported that?"

[Brock Beauchamp]

Speaking of email, NPR posted a great article about Colin Powell ripping into both candidates after his email was hacked.

 

It's almost impossible to read that article and not think "Why isn't Powell leading the modern GOP again? He's what the party should be in 2016, not the garbage we've been subjected to in recent years."

 

http://www.npr.org/2016/09/14/493927155/powell-trump-a-national-disgrace-clinton-screws-up-everything-with-hubris

[gunnarthor]

 

If Trump wins, and I still think there's no way he will, I just hope his supporters admit they voted for him and hold themselves accountable afterwords once everything starts falling apart.

 

I have a feeling it would be like segregation though. "What, me?! No I never supported that?"

If Trump wins, Pence will be acting President.  Strong rightward tilt but not the end of the world.

[nicksaviking]

 

If Trump wins, Pence will be acting President.  Strong rightward tilt but not the end of the world.

 

Trump takes umbrage with the slightest offense, you don't really think he's going to let the RNC make policies and decisions for him after he spent the past two years embarrassing them at every turn and rubbing their nose in the fact that the conservative supporters chose him over the party itself?

 

First time Pence says something contradictory or different than what Trump wants, Trump would be looking for a new VP. If he somehow won, Pence would almost surely be the most neutered VP ever.