Article: Twins Promote Eight for September

[USAFChief]

I'm sure Bernier's is a nice guy, and perhaps giving him a month's MLB salary is nice and all, but...it seems to me a team in the Twins position, with a "top rated minor league system" and all, could find better ways to invest in the future.

 

As to the rest...pretty underwhelming, as well.

 

BTW, this is a comment more about the actual status of the Twins minor league system than the individuals themselves. The system will look better if, and I repeat if, Buxton and Sano return to something like they looked a year ago, but that's no given. And without them, things don't look nearly as rosy.

[crapforks]

 Bernier hit .280 with a .740 OPS, Florimon hit .257 with an OPS of .717 and is seven years younger.  I am not a Florimon fan, but beyond this year, I'd rather have him than Bernier.

 

Not to nit pick, but hasn't Florimon convinced everyone he can only play short? Why do I remember reading that he isn't even considered for a backup role because he can't/won't/doesn't play elsewhere?

[stringer bell]

Not to nit pick, but hasn't Florimon convinced everyone he can only play short? Why do I remember reading that he isn't even considered for a backup role because he can't/won't/doesn't play elsewhere?

Florimon played all three infield spots in Rochester after he was sent down. He made a lot of errors, but that seems to go with playing on minor league fields.

[SwainZag]

I'm sure Bernier's is a nice guy, and perhaps giving him a month's MLB salary is nice and all, but...it seems to me a team in the Twins position, with a "top rated minor league system" and all, could find better ways to invest in the future.

 

As to the rest...pretty underwhelming, as well.

 

BTW, this is a comment more about the actual status of the Twins minor league system than the individuals themselves. The system will look better if, and I repeat if, Buxton and Sano return to something like they looked a year ago, but that's no given. And without them, things don't look nearly as rosy.

 

I wouldn't look at promoting Bernier as investing in the future but more as....he has played well enough to earn a promotion, he is 34, the Twins are going nowhere and more of a nice thing to do for a guy who is probably getting near the end of his career.  I'm going to guess he isn't going to see the field much this month, really no harm promoting him and letting him live the life for a few weeks.  At least how I see it.  It would be different if they promoted him and played him over a younger player with a real future with the team.

[goulik]

I agree swainzag with the added "as long as he isn't in the way oof any other promotions" which he isn't. If there were others to promote, they would DFA florimon or Colabello now...

[USAFChief]

I agree swainzag with the added "as long as he isn't in the way oof any other promotions" which he isn't. If there were others to promote, they would DFA florimon or Colabello now...

That's my point...shouldn't a system as deep, and as ready to cure what ails the Twins, have others to promote?

[jokin]

Maybe next August. Made no sense to call him up this year. Dozier is playing almost every day and it is time to give Santana some run at SS.

 

I disagree about Polanco.  The guy is absorbing baseball acumen like a sponge and appears major league savvy well beyond his youthful age.  They should have kept him playing part-time with the big club,  getting a few reps at 2nd, 3rd and SS, while serving notice and challenging the current lineup to not get too complacent about their spots, as Polanco continues assembling the building blocks towards his very bright future.

[stringer bell]

That's my point...shouldn't a system as deep, and as ready to cure what ails the Twins, have others to promote?

During the season, they have established youngsters Santana and Vargas. Regulars certain for next year are Mauer, Dozier, Plouffe, Arcia, and Suzuki. They are returning both Pinto and Hicks. I think that is almost all of the position players that will be heading north from Fort Myers in late March/early April. Within a year from now, we may see Buxton, Rosario, Sano and maybe Polanco.

 

To me, the pitching side is much less defined and predictable. I'm almost certain that, if healthy, Meyer will be promoted before midseason. We'll also see much turnover in the bullpen. There really isn't much to promote right now.

[jokin]

That's my point...shouldn't a system as deep, and as ready to cure what ails the Twins, have others to promote?

 

 

Yep, the cupboard is pretty barren of anything but very marginal major league quality, at both AA and AAA, The exceptions, a couple sure-fire starter prospects (Meyer and Berrios), a few relievers and maybe a starter or two that show some promise, and very little else, if anything, with the exception of Polanco, and probably still Rosario, if he gets his act together in the AFL, but they now look like 2016 debuts, at best. Meanwhile, AAAA-ness abounds at both levels.  A total of 15 players between the two levels that are age 28 or older. (7 of 13 Roc. position players age 28 or more, for a total of 10 in all-  by comparison, the Twins major league 25-man roster has 12 players over age 28). 

 

Hopefully the wave coming up from Ft Myers in 2015, plus Sano and Buxton, clears away much of the roster detritus at the upper levels.

[Shane Wahl]

Bernier isn't going to be good. I don't understand not promoting Romero instead. As far as Polanco is concerned, he will definitely need more time defensively, at the least. He is destined to start 2015 at New Britain. That's quite good.

 

The September Twins INF thing is changed. Now Santana must get some time at SS, so the Twins also don't want to promote.

[stringer bell]

Bernier isn't going to be good. I don't understand not promoting Romero instead. As far as Polanco is concerned, he will definitely need more time defensively, at the least. He is destined to start 2015 at New Britain. That's quite good.

 

The September Twins INF thing is changed. Now Santana must get some time at SS, so the Twins also don't want to promote.

Romero's future in professional ball isn't with the Twins IMHO.  He wasn't promoted when the regular 3rd baseman and one of his primary backups were disabled on the same day.  He turns 28 this month, so he's not young, he hit 8 homers for Rochester in almost 500 PAs, so not much power, 0 stolen bases, not much speed and his rep as a defender is substandard.  Besides all of this, one of the Twins' mega-prospects is a third baseman--the only position Romero has played with any regularity (40+ games at first in his over 800 minor league games).

[drjim]

That's my point...shouldn't a system as deep, and as ready to cure what ails the Twins, have others to promote?

I think this is a little too aggressive in expectations. The Twins will graduate 5 everyday position guys (if you count Hicks/Pinto) and a handful of pitchers in two years. Very few teams can match that. And the top three still haven't made it.

 

No farm system ever can turn over a roster in only a couple of years.

[drjim]

I disagree about Polanco. The guy is absorbing baseball acumen like a sponge and appears major league savvy well beyond his youthful age. They should have kept him playing part-time with the big club, getting a few reps at 2nd, 3rd and SS, while serving notice and challenging the current lineup to not get too complacent about their spots, as Polanco continues assembling the building blocks towards his very bright future.

Those positions are all locked in for September. He had a great year but was at AA for less than half a season.

 

All we need is just a little patience.

[stringer bell]

I'm not defending Bernier's promotion.  If he starts more than one or two games, I'll be howling about that.  Letting him sit on the bench and using him as a late-inning defensive replacement or pinch-runner is fine.  Otherwise, maybe Doug can get a coaching gig.  Does he speak Spanish?

[DJL44]

Why not Stephen Pryor? 7.1 BB/9, that's why.

[DJL44]

I'm not defending Bernier's promotion. 

 

I think MLB expands benefits with 60 days service time. If the Twins get him those benefits he can probably afford to go into coaching in the low minors.

[old nurse]

43 days on the roster for pension, 1 day for lifetime healthcare. The minimum pension is 34k/yr. 10 yrs/100k for pension. For everything else it is pro rated.  For some of the fringe players cycled through the Twins, the last few years, their time here was very valuable. Albers, Komatsu Kris Johnson and a few others should be thankful for the Twins. Pension does not kick in until age 62. They still have to find some work.

Edited September 2, 2014 by old nurse

[Mike Sixel]

Lifetime Healthcare is so huge. It frees you up to take a job and to move around......so huge.

[Seth Stohs]

I disagree about Polanco.  The guy is absorbing baseball acumen like a sponge and appears major league savvy well beyond his youthful age.  They should have kept him playing part-time with the big club,  getting a few reps at 2nd, 3rd and SS, while serving notice and challenging the current lineup to not get too complacent about their spots, as Polanco continues assembling the building blocks towards his very bright future.

 

I'm guessing this is a bit trolling, but why would they want to call up a top prospect to play part time, or to play multiple positions... makes so much more sense for him to play every day, in AA where he didn't dominate, at the position they hope he can take over in two years?

[tobi0040]

I think September will say a lot about the future of Santana and Pinto.  I don't believe the Twins view Santana as a SS or Pinto as a catcher.  If they don't see significant reps with the extended rosters, that will confirm my thoughts.

[Mike Sixel]

Ryan was on the radio two weeks ago saying santana is a SS long term.

[drjim]

Ryan was on the radio two weeks ago saying santana is a SS long term.

 

And he is quoted yesterday as saying Pinto has made significant strides in all aspects of catching.

[TheLeviathan]

Time to start getting both of them playing those positions then.  Like, yesterday.

[SwainZag]

And he is quoted yesterday as saying Pinto has made significant strides in all aspects of catching.

 

I really hope this means we will get to see him catch more than once a week for the month.

 

Of all the opinions how he can't catch are out there, he only caught 18 games for the Twins this season.  No reason not to give him some reps, we all know he can hit. 

[IndyTwinsFan]

Ryan was on the radio two weeks ago saying santana is a SS long term.

With Hicks now called up, it's time to show that TR and the organization actually believes that.  Santana should be in the lineup for virtually every remaining game as shortstop.  Let's see what he can do defensively, rather than just speculate.

[Otto von Ballpark]

I think MLB expands benefits with 60 days service time. If the Twins get him those benefits he can probably afford to go into coaching in the low minors.

Bernier already has 85 days MLB service, most of it from 2013 with the Twins.

[Thegrin]

It has been stated many times over the years that a players top years of production is between age 28 and age 32.  Why are people complaining that we have a lot of players in this age range, both with the Twins and at Rochester ?

[Mike Sixel]

It has been stated many times over the years that a players top years of production is between age 28 and age 32.  Why are people complaining that we have a lot of players in this age range, both with the Twins and at Rochester ?

 

this actually isn't true anymore, if I recall correctly. Peak age has come slightly earlier rather than later, now that teams are calling up players that are younger. I would have to dig a bit to find the research that was done last year on this.......

 

I'd guess the Rochester complaint is that if they are in AAA still, and 30, they probably aren't that good. At least that's what I would say, if I was saying anything about Rochester.

[Mike Sixel]

Here you go, it won't make most people here very happy......

 

"In the past few seasons, hitters no longer improve once they arrive in the majors. Instead, their performance is constant until they begin to decline, which, on average, is at 26 years old. Improved training and development is probably behind the shift. If fans are hoping for a young position player’s performance to peak, they might be sorely disappointed. Chances are the player is likely producing at his career-best already."

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/hitters-no-longer-peak-only-decline/

 

Remember, this is what to expect to happen, not will for each player. And, a team should plan on what they expect to happen......

Edited September 2, 2014 by mike wants wins

[Craig Arko]

Here you go, it won't make most people here very happy......

 

"In the past few seasons, hitters no longer improve once they arrive in the majors. Instead, their performance is constant until they begin to decline, which, on average, is at 26 years old. Improved training and development is probably behind the shift. If fans are hoping for a young position player’s performance to peak, they might be sorely disappointed. Chances are the player is likely producing at his career-best already."

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/hitters-no-longer-peak-only-decline/

 

Remember, this is what to expect to happen, not will for each player. And, a team should plan on what they expect to happen......

I guess most of us geezers should be dead already.