Two way star McKay

[gunnarthor]

This article was posted on minor league ball and the timing is good seeing we just saw Ohtani.

 

https://www.minorleagueball.com/2018/5/13/17349416/tampa-bay-rays-are-moving-prospect-brendan-mckay-up-the-ladder

 

McKay has been moved up to high A after killing it on both sides of the ball in A ball. I'm still not convinced that he can do both at the ML level but I'd like to see him make it so we get more of these kind of guys.

[Blake]

 

This article was posted on minor league ball and the timing is good seeing we just saw Ohtani.

 

https://www.minorleagueball.com/2018/5/13/17349416/tampa-bay-rays-are-moving-prospect-brendan-mckay-up-the-ladder

 

McKay has been moved up to high A after killing it on both sides of the ball in A ball. I'm still not convinced that he can do both at the ML level but I'd like to see him make it so we get more of these kind of guys.

With teams struggling to find a balance between bench players and pitching staffs, I think this portends an interesting future.

 

We've already seen, or are seeing, the end of the pure "DH" and this is probably the next logical step.

[Shaitan]

Like two-sport athletes, I think this will briefly be a trend but will disappear the second there's a serious injury.

[Doctor Wu]

Thanks for posting that. I remember all the pre-draft hype about McKay's potential as a 2-way player but had nearly forgotten about him. With Otani succeeding so far, that definitely adds more intrigue to the idea of other teams trying it. And what about the high school kid that the Reds drafted? Another potential 2-way player that was pegged as a possible number one pick (and was on the cover of SI). Sorry, but I'm having a brain fart and can't remember his name! How is doing so far this season?

[NapoleonComplex]

Hunter Greene. He is now pitching exclusively and struggling mightily in the MWL.  It's very early in the development process, but as of now, Falvey and Levine are looking like geniuses.  

[Comrade Bork]

It's real nice seeing our boy ROYCE right on his heels despite being 3 years younger

[Nine of twelve]

I have wondered if Dave Winfield was ever called on to pitch an inning or two in a blowout game. Success in college certainly doesn't automatically translate to MLB but he was a key starting pitcher at the U.

[Nine of twelve]

I was thinking about whether it is better for a skilled pitcher who is also a skilled batter to be on an AL team or an NL team.

Under NL rules the manager could bat him somewhere in the middle of the order and this would provide a significant advantage compared with AL rules. However, that only applies on days he pitches. I'd be hesitant to use him as an outfielder on other days out of concern for potential arm issues, but there would be value in having an extra pinch hitter.

Under AL rules the manager is pretty much forced to use a DH for him because not doing so could become a significant disadvantage late in a game, especially in extra innings. But it also allows him to DH on days he doesn't pitch.

I'm inclined to think AL rules are better suited for optimal use of this type of player.

[Nine of twelve]

Picture Ohtani and the success he's having. Now multiply by ten and you have Babe Ruth. Offensively he was so far beyond his peers that even the best players of the last 60 years were no better. Couple that with the fact that he was an outstanding pitcher, and there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that he was the best all-around baseball player ever.

[nicksaviking]

McKay's lack of velocity kept me from wanting him as the top pick. Thinking about the Twins taking a guy #1 overall who throws 92 MPH seemed like a stereotypical "play it safe" Twins move. I don't think his bat is going to be anything better than an extra-innings emergency pinch-hitter considering he plays the offensive dependent 1st base, but maybe his arm is more live than his college velocity let on. We'll probably know more once he faces better competition.

[Mike Sixel]

Hunter Greene. He is now pitching exclusively and struggling mightily in the MWL. It's very early in the development process, but as of now, Falvey and Levine are looking like geniuses.

How so? All five or six of the first picks are top fifty prospects. Only Greene is struggling and he's 18 or 19 years old.

[gunnarthor]

 

I have wondered if Dave Winfield was ever called on to pitch an inning or two in a blowout game. Success in college certainly doesn't automatically translate to MLB but he was a key starting pitcher at the U.

I think Winfield is on the short list of players who you could imagine having success as a two-way player had they been allowed to do it. 

[Thrylos]

I dunno about 2-way star.  He are his numbers on the plate as a 22 year old in the Midwest League:

 

.254/.484/.333. 

 

Other than his good great pitch discrimination, the rest are uber pedestrian.  

 

For comparison's sake: 

 

.343/.387/.414

 

4-year younger Royce Lewis's line in the same league this season.

[NapoleonComplex]

 

How so? All five or six of the first picks are top fifty prospects. Only Greene is struggling and he's 18 or 19 years old.

 

My comment is in regards to performance, not a number on a list. I agree with baseball writers across the board, Hunter Greene definitely should be a top 50 prospect.  He's immensely talented. However, if we are looking purely at performance results to this point, Falvey and Levine are looking like geniuses considering all the questions around selecting Royce #1. Although there wasn't necessarily a consensus top pick in the draft, Greene was seen by most as that player. I'd also say for the Twins specifically, many people weren't happy we passed on McKay. 

[gunnarthor]

 

My comment is in regards to performance, not a number on a list. I agree with baseball writers across the board, Hunter Greene definitely should be a top 50 prospect.  He's immensely talented. However, if we are looking purely at performance results to this point, Falvey and Levine are looking like geniuses considering all the questions around selecting Royce #1. Although there wasn't necessarily a consensus top pick in the draft, Greene was seen by most as that player. I'd also say for the Twins specifically, many people weren't happy we passed on McKay. 

Well, I wanted Wright ...

[NapoleonComplex]

I was all-in on Greene with Wright as a close second.  That's basically why I work in corporate America and not in the front office of an MLB team.

[Mike Sixel]

 

My comment is in regards to performance, not a number on a list. I agree with baseball writers across the board, Hunter Greene definitely should be a top 50 prospect.  He's immensely talented. However, if we are looking purely at performance results to this point, Falvey and Levine are looking like geniuses considering all the questions around selecting Royce #1. Although there wasn't necessarily a consensus top pick in the draft, Greene was seen by most as that player. I'd also say for the Twins specifically, many people weren't happy we passed on McKay. 

 

fair. I just think less than 12 months in is a bit early to decide. But so far, sure, Lewis looks great, no question.

[h2oface]

 

With teams struggling to find a balance between bench players and pitching staffs, I think this portends an interesting future.

 

We've already seen, or are seeing, the end of the pure "DH" and this is probably the next logical step.

 

There are a lot of college pitchers that also play the field, and are hitting everyday because they hit well. Let them hit if they can. To shut it down while they still hit at the level they are in always seems like such a waste to me.

[h2oface]

Buxton was going to be the next Mike Trout at this level. Sometimes it happens, most of the time it doesn't. I hope they all find greatness, and we are talking about this draft for years to come, and McKay keeps doing both, too.

[old nurse]

 

How so? All five or six of the first picks are top fifty prospects. Only Greene is struggling and he's 18 or 19 years old.

Kohl Stewart was a top 50 prospect at one point. That does not mean a whole lot now.

[h2oface]

 

I was all-in on Greene with Wright as a close second.  That's basically why I work in corporate America and not in the front office of an MLB team.

 

Nobody's risen to the Show yet. I would hold off on your self admonishment until more of the story unfolds (said the tortoise).

 

I read that Greene is not hitting right now to focus on pitching, but the plan was still to start up again, in a planned process.

[h2oface]

 

I was thinking about whether it is better for a skilled pitcher who is also a skilled batter to be on an AL team or an NL team.
Under NL rules the manager could bat him somewhere in the middle of the order and this would provide a significant advantage compared with AL rules. However, that only applies on days he pitches. I'd be hesitant to use him as an outfielder on other days out of concern for potential arm issues, but there would be value in having an extra pinch hitter.
Under AL rules the manager is pretty much forced to use a DH for him because not doing so could become a significant disadvantage late in a game, especially in extra innings. But it also allows him to DH on days he doesn't pitch.
I'm inclined to think AL rules are better suited for optimal use of this type of player.

 

 

??

 

What is the rule you refer to about limiting where the/a pitcher can hit in the order in the American League? I am not aware of a limit. Or am I misunderstanding your post?

 

But definitely an AL team, for the two way player, because of the DH and he doesn't have to play the field to be in the lineup.

[RaoulDuke]

We set the precedent for this last year, Chris Gimenez didn't even just DH he caught when not pitching!

[Nine of twelve]

??

 

What is the rule you refer to about limiting where the/a pitcher can hit in the order in the American League? I am not aware of a limit. Or am I misunderstanding your post?

 

But definitely an AL team, for the two way player, because of the DH and he doesn't have to play the field to be in the lineup.

In the AL, if a pitcher is in the batting order the team loses the DH for the rest of the game. I was referring strictly to the NL rules in having a good-hitting pitcher batting somewhere other than 9th.

[darin617]

 

How so? All five or six of the first picks are top fifty prospects. Only Greene is struggling and he's 18 or 19 years old.

Same could be said about the prior years draft class. I would love to see a prospect list with 2016 top 5 draft picks to see how they rank now compared to right after they were drafted.

[Mr. Brooks]

In the AL, if a pitcher is in the batting order the team loses the DH for the rest of the game. I was referring strictly to the NL rules in having a good-hitting pitcher batting somewhere other than 9th.

The league you're in doesn't need to change where you'd bat him though.

You essentially start play under NL rules, so you could bat him anywhere, then double switch later, just as you would in the NL.

[Nine of twelve]

The league you're in doesn't need to change where you'd bat him though.

You essentially start play under NL rules, so you could bat him anywhere, then double switch later, just as you would in the NL.

True, but then you're burning more players than the other team is because you have given up the DH. That's a significant disadvantage in the late innings and that's especially true if the game goes extra innings. You'll wind up with pitchers batting while the other team still has their DH.

[Riverbrian]

With Ohtani showing it's doable and McKay showing it's possible. The door is opening and other teams are going to want one or two. 

 

If Front Office personnel, Managers or coaches think it can only be done by someone special like Ohtani. They will probably be the type of person who also didn't think a Microwave could cook food. If after watching the microwave cook food, if they still are of the opinion that it must be a special microwave. They will be Dinosaurs to be replaced as the game advances past them. 

 

The game will shift and these type of players will increase and those who refuse to believe it will be out of baseball.  Don't know how long this will take but it will happen. 

 

I believe that players who can both hit and pitch have always been around. They were just never given the chance to do it because teams would force them to specialize in one thing. 

 

Of course... I am the President of the "Baseball Player Positional Flexibility Club"

[Mr. Brooks]

True, but then you're burning more players than the other team is because you have given up the DH. That's a significant disadvantage in the late innings and that's especially true if the game goes extra innings. You'll wind up with pitchers batting while the other team still has their DH.

But that's true regardless of where in the order you bat him.

[Nine of twelve]

But that's true regardless of where in the order you bat him.

Looking back I can see how you were misled by how I wrote about batting the pitcher in the middle of the order. I was merely referring to how a good-hitting pitcher could be placed somewhere in the order other than ninth under NL rules. Our later posts were referring to having the pitcher bat for himself in a game played under AL rules. The point I'm making is that it is a disadvantage to start a game with the pitcher batting for himself in a game played under AL rules.