Should Torii Return?

[Mike Sixel]

Part time player, maybe. Full time player, no. I don't think that he's part of the future, and it is time for the future, imo. He clearly helped them this year, but at some point, they need to trust the process and the minors. I'd say that time is now.

[COtwin]

No.  And while we are at it, no on Robinson too.  He would be our 4th best defensive outfielder.  Would rather give Arcia a shot until Kepler or Walker make it.  Our defensive everyday outfield will be so solid that it would be ok to plug Arcia into a corner occasionally.  Robinson will just end up blocking one of Walker or Kepler or Arcia from coming up and maybe working into the rotation with the 3 starters.  

[diehardtwinsfan]

I'm not sure many teams will offer Hunter a starting role next spring, call me crazy.  It's quite possible he changes his mind after he fields the offers..  He could also simply retire...  I could see him doing that, but I think right now he thinks he can still start.

 

That said, as a starter, no.  As a bench guy, absolutely. 

[Minniman]

I am on record stating that I did not want Hunter to be signed for the 2015 season at that salary.

 

Hunter does have value for a team that needs some pop, but other players could have provide that value too. Hunter was overpriced and underperformed.

 

The Twins are not going to win the race with retreads. They need to purchase some new performance tires that have a lot more rubber for grip, stability, and bad weather traction.

[kab21]

 

No.  And while we are at it, no on Robinson too.  He would be our 4th best defensive outfielder.  Would rather give Arcia a shot until Kepler or Walker make it.  Our defensive everyday outfield will be so solid that it would be ok to plug Arcia into a corner occasionally.  Robinson will just end up blocking one of Walker or Kepler or Arcia from coming up and maybe working into the rotation with the 3 starters.  

The Twins should have a veteran on the bench so Walker or Kepler can either get full time AB's in AAA or full time AB's on the Twins.  Neither should spend the season in the majors on the bench.

 

The biggest question about the Twins OF next year is whether or not Arcia is on shaky ground with the Twins FO (issues behind the scenes) or they just chalk his 2nd half collapse (Drew Butera level ineptitude) to a nagging injury and will actually give him a shot next year.  He certainly has talent but whatever happened to him has me concerned that he won't be given a shot next training camp.

[Boom Boom]

I am on record stating that I did not want Hunter to be signed for the 2015 season at that salary.

 

Hunter does have value for a team that needs some pop, but other players could have provide that value too. Hunter was overpriced and underperformed.

 

The Twins are not going to win the race with retreads. They need to purchase some new performance tires that have a lot more rubber for grip, stability, and bad weather traction.

Are you saying that Torii is too bald?

[Otto von Ballpark]

If Torii grows his hair out, I will endorse re-signing him.

[Minniman]

 

Are you saying that Torii is too bald?

 

Well, ... no, but he does provide a bumpy ride.

[Mike Sixel]

Rumor has it the A's are looking for veteran clubhouse presents*

 

*yes, I know the difference in the spelling**

**yes, it is sad I felt I had to do that

[Major League Ready]

 

I am on record stating that I did not want Hunter to be signed for the 2015 season at that salary.

 

Hunter does have value for a team that needs some pop, but other players could have provide that value too. Hunter was overpriced and underperformed.

 

The Twins are not going to win the race with retreads. They need to purchase some new performance tires that have a lot more rubber for grip, stability, and bad weather traction.

This makes no sense to me given we have an abundance of great OF prospects.  Why would you go trade or sign free agents only to block the great prospects.  Anyone that is any good at all will require multiple years.  We need a guy to help transition to the new guys given Buxton and Kepler on on the verge of being here to stay.

 

I also don’t see what happens with Plouffe being much of consideration in terms of bring back Hunter.  The offense impact of Plouffe leaving is more a product of what happens at DH.  Regardless, Hunter coming back should be determined by his acceptance of a role where he helps transition to the outfield of the future.  2016 in terms of the outfield needs to focus on transitioning Buxton and Kepler to the ML team and eventually determine which of those three stay.   Personally, I hope they don’t give up on Arcia so he probably needs to be added to the mix.  Hunter is actually an ideal candidate for this role if he is willing.

[Monkeypaws]

I would sign him, but let him know I was unleashing the hounds on him - Arcia, Buxton, Kepler, Hicks, Rosario, even Walker: these guys are hungry and want to play.

 

"Mr. Hunter, we welcome back your person into the team, but beware, you might want steel reinforced underwear, because they'll be chomping at ya.

 

Competition is never a bad thing.

 

BTW, if you look at Jeter's 39-40 seasons, and Hunter's, Torii mops up the floor with the captain, or Ripken. The one guy off the top of my head who performed better at 40 was Ibanez. And Thome offensively - Torii still plays the field.

 

He really is a phenomenon.

[Thrylos]

 

I would sign him, but let him know I was unleashing the hounds on him - Arcia, Buxton, Kepler, Hicks, Rosario, even Walker: these guys are hungry and want to play.

 

"Mr. Hunter, we welcome back your person into the team, but beware, you might want steel reinforced underwear, because they'll be chomping at ya.

 

Competition is never a bad thing.

 

 

That works is you have a 60-man roster.  But you don't.  And cannot have 8 OFs on the 40 man roster.  That's how it works.

[jokin]

 

I would sign him, but let him know I was unleashing the hounds on him - Arcia, Buxton, Kepler, Hicks, Rosario, even Walker: these guys are hungry and want to play.

 

"Mr. Hunter, we welcome back your person into the team, but beware, you might want steel reinforced underwear, because they'll be chomping at ya.

 

Competition is never a bad thing.

 

BTW, if you look at Jeter's 39-40 seasons, and Hunter's, Torii mops up the floor with the captain, or Ripken. The one guy off the top of my head who performed better at 40 was Ibanez. And Thome offensively - Torii still plays the field.

 

He really is a phenomenon.

 

Molitor in his 40 and 41 age seasons collectively:  .325/.375/.453/.828

[Mike Sixel]

Jim Bowden of ESPN thinks he should be back.

[Blackjack]

No. Not unless he's willing to start 80 games or less. If he agrees to a part time role, then I think he would be a good influence on the team. 

[DaveW]

 

No. Not unless he's willing to start 80 games or less. If he agrees to a part time role, then I think he would be a good influence on the team. 

He already said he wouldn't accept that.

 

Time to move on. He had one of the worst all around seasons for RF in Twins history (check out the stats), no need to repeat it.

[blindeke]

Nope.

[Blackjack]

 

He already said he wouldn't accept that.

 

Time to move on. He had one of the worst all around seasons for RF in Twins history (check out the stats), no need to repeat it.

People change their minds all the time.  With Buxton and Kepler probably going to AAA for a few months and Arcia a crapshoot, there would be room for Hunter.  Baseball is as much mental as it is physical, if he could help some of these young players, great. 

[by jiminy]

I would say, definitely not, but that's what I said last year, and some of the same situations remain: Arcia, Buxton, Kepler, Robinson are all far from sure things to be major league ready. Rosario could regress, and it's too early to consider Hicks a sure thing despite his strong finish. Coming up with three playoff-team quality outfielders is not easy, certainly nothing to take for granted. Torii played a very useful role this year, against my expectations. Still, though, no.

 

A .702 OPS just doesn't cut it, unless you're a superb defensive fielder, which Hunter is not. It's hard to see him contributing much even as a part timer. Torii faded at the end of the year and his career trajectory is not going up.

 

You can doubt Arcia all you want, with good reason, but despite all his flakiness, Arcia STILL had a higher OPS than Hunter by season's end.  If you're only gonna get a .702 OPS, you can get that with a prospect, while also getting him either some on the job training or exposure as a dead end, both of which are useful.  And then of course if Kepler or Buxton or Arcia do catch fire, you can't block them. So Hunter is really only useful if everyone else bombs. If they soar, he's a problem. And if they do bomb, he's not much of a solution anyway. He still has something to contribute, but is it worth it? Not if he's a malcontent on the bench.

 

The kind of team that would want Hunter, frankly, is one so awful that they just want a famous name to dangle in front of their fans because their present is hopeless and their prospects if any aren't ready.

 

Philadelphia and Milwaukee come to mind. Miami used to do this a lot. So did the Twins -- Brett Boone, Ruben Sierra, Rondell White, Kenny Rogers, Bob Wells, Sidney Ponson -- you could  add Kubel and Bartlett last year. Everybody does it -- dangle a familiar name to draw fans when you don't have much else to offer. Sometimes these work out okay, like Torii this year, but usually they're embarrassments. Next year, the Twins have too many young players with upside to clog the arteries like this.

 

One possible location that intrigues me for Huner is Detroit. Ausmus is on record as saying the Tigers lost a lot of intangibles when Torii left, and they didn't realize how much they'd miss him. If they lose Cespedes, why not bring him back?

[kab21]

Hunter isn't a problem if all of the prospects are doing awesome.  You can only start 3 and whichever prospect isn't starting should be in AAA getting everyday AB's.

 

But Hunter would have to accept a part time role which he has said he won't so it doesn't matter much unless he changes his mind.

[Kwak]

What will be next year's budget?  I recall last October where Ryan and St. Pierre had a joint news conference and smugly proclaimed that $85MM was enough for 2015.  Magically another $20MM appeared in November and Hunter and Santana were signed.  The Twins have six free agents and several arbitration eligible players along with almost $70MM committed in contracts for existing players.  I'm all in favor of a higher payroll, but I don't believe the Twins agree with that thought.  If they want to hold the line to the 2015 level, and address the bullpen problem--people have to go--and Hunter's name is right after Pelfrey on the expendable list.  If these guys need "further mentoring", then I predict they are not the foundation for a winning team.  It's time for the boys to grow up and put the big-boy pants on and demonstrate that they can carry the responsibility, even if 2016 has a losing record as a result.

[nicksaviking]

I'm all for reducing payroll.

 

Of course that's assuming the team magically finds a way to get some combination of Nolasco/Hughes/Santana/Mauer off the books.

 

That's with no ill-will towards any of those players, but emphasis on magically.

[ashbury]

I believe the young outfielders will need to step-up and actually block Hunter's return next year.

Since the contract decision on Torii will have to happen sometime around December, just like last time, I am not sure what you think the youngsters in question can actually do in the meantime. Step up and sign a petition?

[mickeymental]

hard to imagine one teammate choking another in this clubhouse:

 

https://www.facebook.com/Twins/videos/vb.45991614840/10153648821024841/?type=2&theater

 

nevertheless (and aside from the possibility of returning as a coach) his work is (or at least should be) done. leave on a high note, torii!

[DaveW]

hard to imagine one teammate choking another in this clubhouse:

 

https://www.facebook.com/Twins/videos/vb.45991614840/10153648821024841/?type=2&theater

 

nevertheless (and aside from the possibility of returning as a coach) his work is (or at least should be) done. leave on a high note, torii!

Fwiw: Hunter has punched a team mate before (I don't think it's a big deal, happens all the time, ditto with papelbon- who is a huge douche anyways, but the choke was overblown bc it was caught on TV)

[mickeymental]

 

Fwiw: Hunter has punched a team mate before (I don't think it's a big deal, happens all the time, ditto with papelbon- who is a huge douche anyways, but the choke was overblown bc it was caught on TV)

overblown? did you see the same footage i did? papelbon clearly went after him with malice. the reason it isn't seen more often is because if and when it happens it's typically in a place that doesn't have cameras. and the reason it was a big deal is the very reason you point out: papelbon lost control and couldn't contain himself until he was out of camera range.

[DaveW]

Anytime anyone punches someone it's done with malice. Hunter taking a swing at Morneau and Papelbon choking Harper are basically the same thing IMO

[mickeymental]

 

Anytime anyone punches someone it's done with malice. Hunter taking a swing at Morneau and Papelbon choking Harper are basically the same thing IMO

and if a tree falls in the forest ... in other words, there have presumably been a lot of teammate-on-teammate punches thrown between the morneau incident and the harper incident. but very few where one of the players totally lost control in public and didn't care that cameras were taking it all in.

 

meanwhile, i'm guessing it'll be a long wait to see footage of the next papelbon team-building exercise.

[Minniman]

 

This makes no sense to me given we have an abundance of great OF prospects.  Why would you go trade or sign free agents only to block the great prospects.  Anyone that is any good at all will require multiple years.  We need a guy to help transition to the new guys given Buxton and Kepler on on the verge of being here to stay.

 

Prospects are just prospects until they make it big. If Buxton or Kepler are what you say they will be, then any good signing can be traded for value. It certainly makes sense to sign a bird in the hand than to constantly wait for the bird in the bush that may never come.

 

[Mike Sixel]

Prospects are just prospects until they make it big. If Buxton or Kepler are what you say they will be, then any good signing can be traded for value. It certainly makes sense to sign a bird in the hand than to constantly wait for the bird in the bush that may never come.

Not until July......teams don't trade before July. There are only 25 spots, and only 4-5 for OFers. Every old mediocre player on the roster is one less young, potentially better player not on the roster.