Paul mad! Paul smash!

[Mike Sixel]

But breaking his wrist is ok?

[Dr. Evil]

I don't want to throw at anyone's head. I just want to do something completely stupid and funny to defuse the situation and maybe make the guy feel a little silly. Don't you think throwing at his head is sort of overboard?

[DaveW]

When he comes to bat, have Danny Santana run off the bench and depants him right before the first pitch.

Boom. Problem solved. Even better, Santana does something to contribute this year!

[SwainZag]

 

But breaking his wrist is ok?

 

Sigh.  I didn't advocate hitting anyone.  Piching inside and brushing a guy back with a pitch or two are perfectly fine by me.  If a pitch trails in and hits a batter.....then he gets 1st base.

 

1559 times as a batter been hit by a pitch this season, including 21 times where a guy has been hit more than once in the same game. How many ended in broken wrists?  Can we not equate to a guy getting hit = broken wrist?  

 

Edit: Anthony Rizzo has been hit 30 times this year.  0 broken wrists.

[TheLeviathan]

Ask the Pirates and McCutcheon about the real cost of this buffoonery.

[Dantes929]

I have read 8 pages of this and have considered all the points as evidenced by the fact that I changed my view several times and have pretty much landed on this.

Under NO circumstances do you throw at anyone.     Aside from the humanitarian side of not doing intentional violence, even if you throw a nothing ball at his ribs you are putting a guy on base for free.   Considering on average about 11 runners get on base per game you have just increased that number by 9% on one stupid pitch.     Why would you do that in the biggest game of the year?  (From this point they are all the biggest game of the year)

While originally I thought it was bush league I read the circumstances and watched the video.  In the video you can clearly see he felt disrespected while at the plate.   It reminds me of basketball where a poor free throw shooter is intentionally fouled.    Upon reflection I think if you are intentionally fouled and make the free throws or if the guy in front of you is walked intentionally and you hit a home run the natural and fair reaction is to look at the other team and say "suck eggs" and as the team that has intentionally fouled or intentionally walked someone you should just take it.    

This is where the unwritten rules of baseball should be re-unwritten.    If you intentionally walk someone and the next guy hits a home run that guy should be able to flip a bat at your dugout and you should just take it.  MINOR disrespect meets MINOR disrespect back.   End of story.

[DaveW]

 

Sigh.  I didn't advocate hitting anyone.  Piching inside and brushing a guy back with a pitch or two are perfectly fine by me.  If a pitch trails in and hits a batter.....then he gets 1st base.

 

1559 times as a batter been hit by a pitch this season, including 21 times where a guy has been hit more than once in the same game. How many ended in broken wrists?  Can we not equate to a guy getting hit = broken wrist?  

 

Edit: Anthony Rizzo has been hit 30 times this year.  0 broken wrists.

The thing is, in all of those pitches to Rizzo the pitcher wasn't AIMING to hit him. When you are aiming at a guy, it likely is going to be a fastball and it likely will be "high"

[SwainZag]

 

I have read 8 pages of this and have considered all the points as evidenced by the fact that I changed my view several times and have pretty much landed on this.

Under NO circumstances do you throw at anyone.     Aside from the humanitarian side of not doing intentional violence, even if you throw a nothing ball at his ribs you are putting a guy on base for free.   Considering on average about 11 runners get on base per game you have just increased that number by 9% on one stupid pitch.     Why would you do that in the biggest game of the year?  (From this point they are all the biggest game of the year)

While originally I thought it was bush league I read the circumstances and watched the video.  In the video you can clearly see he felt disrespected while at the plate.   It reminds me of basketball where a poor free throw shooter is intentionally fouled.    Upon reflection I think if you are intentionally fouled and make the free throws or if the guy in front of you is walked intentionally and you hit a home run the natural and fair reaction is to look at the other team and say "suck eggs" and as the team that has intentionally fouled or intentionally walked someone you should just take it.    

This is where the unwritten rules of baseball should be re-unwritten.    If you intentionally walk someone and the next guy hits a home run that guy should be able to flip a bat at your dugout and you should just take it.  MINOR disrespect meets MINOR disrespect back.   End of story.

 

And I would argue it's showing more respect to the guy who is getting intentionally walked than it is showing disrespect to the guy coming up next.  But that's just my two cents on the matter.

[Dr. Evil]

 

Sigh.  I didn't advocate hitting anyone.  Piching inside and brushing a guy back with a pitch or two are perfectly fine by me.  If a pitch trails in and hits a batter.....then he gets 1st base.

 

1559 times as a batter been hit by a pitch this season, including 21 times where a guy has been hit more than once in the same game. How many ended in broken wrists?  Can we not equate to a guy getting hit = broken wrist?  

 

Edit: Anthony Rizzo has been hit 30 times this year.  0 broken wrists.

So your saying it's ok to take that risk? I don't want to risk that. Not worth missing by a little and breaking his head. I understand you are angry though. But, it should pass soon....?

[Dantes929]

 

And I would argue it's showing more respect to the guy who is getting intentionally walked than it is showing disrespect to the guy coming up next.  But that's just my two cents on the matter.

I agree with you completely.  It is more of a compliment to Kipnis..    Sometimes it is more strategic in terms of setting up double plays, but this was not that case.   In this case, Kipnis is free to feel respected which is not mutually exclusive to Ramirez feeling slighted.    Without the preceding walk I would be ok with the Twins being angry.    Given the intentional walk I think it is just minor tit for tat.

[jimmer]

Here's an interesting article about conflicts, many centering around unwritten rules

 

 

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2015/09/30/mlb-bench-clearing-brawls-unwritten-rules-ethnic-backgrounds/73066892/

 

 

[USAFChief]

Moderator note:  Tread carefully with accusations and/or insinuations that posters might be racists.

 

 

[SwainZag]

 

So your saying it's ok to take that risk? I don't want to risk that. Not worth missing by a little and breaking his head. I understand you are angry though. But, it should pass soon....?

 

Who said anything about being angry?  There's no anger here my friend.  I said "sigh" because I said I see nothing wrong with brushing a guy back and the response I get is "so it's OK to break wrists?"  They are not mutually exclusive things.  

[jimmer]

So the article I linked, done with the backing of research, suggest that part of the reason there are so many confrontations at the major league level stems from cultural difference.  Meaning that maybe the PLAYERS' cultural upbringing may effect why some players play the game one way in regards to unwritten rules and why others play it a different way.  The study believes that many of the clashes between players happen because of this, because of a fundamental difference in how they were taught the game and how they played it where they come from. In fact, one player comes right out and says it.

 

It also just talks about how unwritten rules are in the eye of the beholder regardless of upbringing (giving more credence to the idea many are ridiculous).

 

This seems like something that should be allowed to be discussed and in no way suggest any POSTERS (or really any players) are being racist in their backing of unwritten rules. Because having conflicts due to cultural differences doesn't have to, and often doesn't, have to do with actual hate of a particular race.

[Craig Arko]

Making the error that cost his team tonight should even things out.

[TheLeviathan]

Karma and winning are so much better forms of retribution.

[HitInAPinch]

 

Okay, wait a minute, it's either disrespectful or it's not.  How could it be disrespectful for young guys to do it and not disrespectful for veterans to do it?  Isn't it, supposedly, about the act itself?  Veterans have earned the right but not you young whippersnappers. So, basically, just like grade school.

 

And there is no way Hunter (or any Veteran) doesn't get POd about getting hit. He , and most veterans, certainly aren't tipping their hats to the pitcher (especially a young whippersnapper) for doing it (nor should they) and they very likely wouldn't have thought they did anything to warrant retaliation to begin with since, as you said veterans have earned the right and like many veterans, Hunter included, have said they teach the young players how to play 'the right way'.

 

As a " USAF MSgt (Ret) "  you do not understand the concept of someone earning their strips?

[Mike Sixel]

I think everyone should play by the same rules.......respect and disrespect are about what you do, not if you are older or younger. It is rude to do things, or it is not rude to do things.

[jimmer]

 

As a " USAF MSgt (Ret) "  you do not understand the concept of someone earning their strips?

Not in this situation, no. Earning privileges based on rank doesn't extend to excusing disrespectful actions.

 

IF an action is disrespectful it wouldn't matter if it was an Airman Basic doing it or a 4-Star General doing it, disrespectful is disrespectful.  And any true leader wouldn't hide behind his rank to excuse such action.  The First Air Force core value: Integrity first.  

[Linus]

Meanwhile, this just in - the Twins didn't even come close to throwing at anybody last night.

[Willihammer]

After sleeping on it and the result of last night's game I'm glad the Twins didn't throw at Ramirez to start the game. I'm glad they didn't let the flagrant batton flip of a butthurt futility infielder distract them from the goal of winning the WC spot. Cleveland for their part did everything right. Ramirez said the right things after the game and in batting him leadoff, Francona offered Ramirez up to get the issue out of the way so there was no confusion. Water under the bridge at this point.

[Otto von Ballpark]

After sleeping on it and the result of last night's game I'm glad the Twins didn't throw at Ramirez to start the game. I'm glad they didn't let the flagrant batton flip of a butthurt futility infielder distract them from the goal of winning the WC spot. Cleveland for their part did everything right. Ramirez said the right things after the game and in batting him leadoff, Francona offered Ramirez up to get the issue out of the way so there was no confusion. Water under the bridge at this point.

Might want to revise your description of him as a "futility infielder" though, he's actually got a nice record considering his age and position. I think he is at worst a solid utility guy right now, and with any improvement a viable starter a la Escobar.

[DaveW]

The Twins also should take this year as a lesson to not throw at Ramierez next year, especially if it is a close game. April games count just as much as Sept/Oct games, I would hate to see the Twins lose an April game because they let one of their starters get tossed (and suspended) for "fixing" this fued.

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

I caught a snippet of a pregame interview with Molitor and his attitude was that they had to focus on winning the game and anything that happened the night before was going to take a back seat to winning the ballgame. There was mention that maybe the kid didn't realize the level of the infraction being committed which didn't excuse it per se, but the managers talked it out with each other and Francona talked to Ramirez.

It's hard to say if anything comes of the incident next year, hopefully the win last night is sufficient.

 

[Tcrose3636]

 

The Twins also should take this year as a lesson to not throw at Ramierez next year, especially if it is a close game. April games count just as much as Sept/Oct games, I would hate to see the Twins lose an April game because they let one of their starters get tossed (and suspended) for "fixing" this fued.

 

Unless that player is Ricky Nolasco, that might add 1 or 2 to the W column.

[notoriousgod71]

http://thebiglead.com/2015/10/02/korean-baseball-player-delivers-epic-bat-flip-on-routine-fly-out-to-left-field/