SF Chronicle reporter wants to keep hope alive for a repeat trip to the World Series... and that hope depends on a MN Twin?

[jokin]

http://www.rantsports.com/mlb/files/2014/10/Plouffe-Brad-Rempel-USAT.jpg

 

 

 

John Shea is the national baseball writer for the Chronicle.  You see an article with a headline about the defending WS champs and what his #1 prediction is for keeping hope alive in the City by the Bay, Trevor Plouffe's name is somewhat surprising as the first one to spring into Shea's mind, not only that, he also sees Plouffe not so much as the guy to hold down the spot until something better is available, but as the anchor over the intermediate term:

 

 

Of the potential trade targets the Giants could presumably have in mind, Minnesota Twins third baseman Trevor Plouffe should top the list.

The advantages of targeting a player of Plouffe’s caliber should make sense to the Giants. They need to replace Sandoval’s production in the lineup, and Plouffe can help accomplish that. The Twins’ third baseman exceeded Sandoval’s OPS (.739) by 12 points in 2014. Plouffe also nearly matched his OPS+ (111). Even though Plouffe is not as competent of a fielder as Sandoval, his total 4.9 WAR exceeded Sandoval’s mark of 4.0.

Pulling the trigger on Plouffe would help alleviate the black hole left behind by Sandoval. It would also guarantee the Giants a solid third base option for at least three seasons.

 

Shea acknowledges that the Twins might very well be inquiring on Vogelsong, but he doesn't stop there in assuming the Twins would still have a yawning need for more arms. He envisions that at the upcoming Winter Meetings, a tap on the shoulder proposal from Brian Sabean to a swap for need on Terry Ryan's part would be very amenable to the Twins GM:

 

 

The Twins aren’t prepared to contend in 2015, despite recently signing Torii Hunter to a one-year contract and their rumored interest in Vogelsong. Minnesota has a bounty of needs across their 40-man roster, but third base isn’t one of them. 

 

Miguel Sano isn’t expected to become big-league ready for at least another full season, and his performance hinges largely on how he’s able to recover from surgery. But that shouldn’t deter the Twins from potentially dipping into the Giants’ pitching-rich farm system, which has a stout reputation for developing capable big league starters.

[Bark's Lounge]

I'm not too keen on the idea.

 

Kyle Crick is a necessary component. What else do we get?

[Homer Hanky]

That is a great article thanks for writing... 

 

I would love for the Twins to trade Ploooof and get some arms! 

 

Maybe we can trick the Giants into another [Nathan, Fransico, and Boof trade] 

 

I hope this can happen! 

[USAFChief]

What's Halsey's take on this?

[jokin]

I'm not too keen on the idea.

 

Kyle Crick is a necessary component. What else do we get?

 

That is a good question, and this whole exercise will make a great thought experiment in light of the Donaldson trade.  

 

The Giants have 4 SP prospects on the brink of major league readiness, plus Crick. And they have the long-term answer for any club at the Catcher position, Andrew Susac (Shea obviously didn't mention him, but I suspect that both Susac and Crick would be the first guys that Ryan would ask for in return).

[Otto von Ballpark]

Kyle Crick is a necessary component. What else do we get?

Would Crick for Plouffe straight up be a rough equivalent of Meyer for Span?

[Bark's Lounge]

That is a good question, and this whole exercise will make a great thought experiment in light of the Donaldson trade.  

 

The Giants have 4 SP prospects on the brink of major league readiness, plus Crick. And they have the long-term answer for any club at the Catcher position, Andrew Susac (Shea obviously didn't mention him, but I suspect that both Susac and Crick would be the first guys that Ryan would ask for in return).

Jokin, in an unrealistic way, I am Plouffe's biggest fan and I will be the poster who demands all of the riches of the world for another team to acquire Plouffe from the Twins.

 

I do believe, that most on this site under value Plouffe, or straight up don't like him. Trevor was one of our 2 best position players last season and he improved a great deal defensively.

 

The last few years have been pretty down offensively in MLB all around... but those kind of things ebb and flow. Who knows offense might be up next season and Plouffe hits 20+ HR's with improved offensive and defensive stats.

 

Crick is a fair starting point.

[jokin]

Would Crick for Plouffe straight up be a rough equivalent of Meyer for Span?

 

The main difference I see is major league readiness at the time of the trade, and Crick has less control than Meyer.

[Bark's Lounge]

Would Crick for Plouffe straight up be a rough equivalent of Meyer for Span?

I wouldn't do the deal, but I am biased. I think most would be thrilled on this site if that happened.

 

Would it be a rough equivalent of the Meyer/Span Trade - I am not sure I have the expertise to make that claim.

[jokin]

Jokin, in an unrealistic way, I am Plouffe's biggest fan and I will be the poster who demands all of the riches of the world for another team to acquire Plouffe from the Twins.

 

I do believe, that most on this site under value Plouffe, or straight up don't like him. Trevor was one of our 2 best position players last season and he improved a great deal defensively.

 

The last few years have been pretty down offensively in MLB all around... but those kind of things ebb and flow. Who knows offense might be up next season and Plouffe hits 20+ HR's with improved offensive and defensive stats.

 

Crick is a fair starting point.

 

Yeah, I seem to recall that you were one of the guys who waxed eloquently on that magical, mystical "Month of Plouffe" back in 2012 when for a short time he was the Babe Ruth of baseball.  Which begs the question, how much more could the Twins demand in July vs now if Plouffe were able to have a month in 2015 anywhere close to that of 2012?

[nicksaviking]

I 'm in for a trade, though I'll admit I probably undervalue him. A .750 OPS in a career year doesn't do a lot for me, but I probably still haven't adjusted to post steroid era numbers nor the fact that the 3B position is no longer populated by sluggers in today's game.

[cmb0252]

While I doubt TR will trade Plouffe, when you have 4 horrid seasons you have to listen to anyone. If they offered Susac I would take it and run.

[Bark's Lounge]

Yeah, I seem to recall that you were one of the guys who waxed eloquently on that magical, mystical "Month of Plouffe" back in 2012 when for a short time he was the Babe Ruth of baseball.  Which begs the question, how much more could the Twins demand in July vs now if Plouffe were able to have a month in 2015 anywhere close to that of 2012?

I'm not sure I can or want to answer that question as I believe that Plouffe is our future 3B. I do not believe that Sano will be a third baseman. I certainly could be wrong on this, but I am gonna ride it out and stick to that belief.

 

As for July v. Now, I couldn't tell ya, but maybe I'll try. I have not done my research... contending teams that might need a 3B mid season 2015. At this point - Obviously SF... after that the Angels, Dodgers, KC (maybe), White Sox, Cleveland, Yanks, Braves, DC (if Rendon plays 2B).

 

It is too early in the offseason to forecast the trade scenarios and what we could get right now v. next summer as most FA and trade moves have yet to take place this offseason. I will say this - I want a lot for Plouffe in a trade. I want a top 75 prospect and a few B prospects... something like that... maybe more.

[Bark's Lounge]

Yeah, I seem to recall that you were one of the guys who waxed eloquently on that magical, mystical "Month of Plouffe" back in 2012 when for a short time he was the Babe Ruth of baseball.

That is correct my friend.

[jorgenswest]

I have seen Crick pitch a few times when he was in San Jose. In one game, the other team couldn't come close to solid contact. Some of the walks were a result of the batters having no chance to hit his strikes. There is so much movement. Every count went deep. He is the opposite of pitch to contact. I recall saying to my son that I would sure like to see Crick in the Twins organization.

 

I would probably trade Plouffe for Crick, but I am skewed by the games I saw.

[gunnarthor]

I don't think the Twins trade Plouffe.  They might not be competing for the division but they should be pushing .500.  Getting rid of Plouffe doesn't help and Sano is still at least half a season away and even when he's ready, it's possible to use Plouffe elsewhere.  Obviously, we'll listen to any offer but it would have to be pretty amazing - Crick + Susac + something.

[jokin]

I don't think the Twins trade Plouffe.  They might not be competing for the division but they should be pushing .500.  Getting rid of Plouffe doesn't help and Sano is still at least half a season away and even when he's ready, it's possible to use Plouffe elsewhere.  Obviously, we'll listen to any offer but it would have to be pretty amazing - Crick + Susac + something.

 

Would Ryan gamble on waiting out half a season on Sano with Escobar at 3rd until then, or by putting Mauer there for the full season?  (He's already hinted that Sano might be headed to the OF.)  Plouffe for a package featuring Crick and Susac would make such a move more tempting.

[twinsfanstreif]

Would Ryan gamble on waiting out half a season on Sano with Escobar at 3rd until then, or by putting Mauer there for the full season?  (He's already hinted that Sano might be headed to the OF.)  Plouffe for a package featuring Crick and Susac would make such a move more tempting.

I feel like Crick and Susac would be too much but maybe I under value Plouffe. Crick + Susac would be a home run IMO

[jokin]

I feel like Crick and Susac would be too much but maybe I under value Plouffe. Crick + Susac would be a home run IMO

 

I fear you're correct. The Giants also need a LFer.  Torii would go over big in San Francisco, right?

Pinto? Is anyone in the rest of the league intrigued with Arcia and willing to overlook his lack of defensive acumen? Neither seem like the right fit for a team looking to repeat.

Suzuki?  This might work, the Giants are already looking to get Buster out from behind home plate for even more reps (he played 35 games at 1st in 2014). Throw in a couple B prospects, maybe Ryan would listen. 

 

 

This is all likely idle speculation, of course, Shea doesn't name names, but I have the feeling that at the most, he envisions Crick and one other prospect arm being offered for Plouffe, in which case, I don't think Ryan will bite.

[gunnarthor]

I think Crick's status has taken a bit of a hit.  He wasn't able to stay healthy last year and his control is pretty rough.  I think he ends up in the bullpen.  I don't think the Twins would trade a cost controlled asset like Plouffe - who is a pretty solid third baseman - for a deal centered around Crick.  But Crick and Susac together makes some sense to the Twins.  But I don't think it happens.  If Plouffe were on the block, I think other teams could come up with better offers than SF.

[Otto von Ballpark]

The main difference I see is major league readiness at the time of the trade, and Crick has less control than Meyer.

Meyer was a year older as a college draftee, but he also had yet to appear in AA. Crick definitely appears wilder. As of last winter, he seemed to be ranked equally or slightly better than Meyer at the time of trade too.

[stringer bell]

I have liked Plouffe since I started reading his Twitter feed.  The play on the field has improved each year and last year he made big steps as a third baseman.  That said, he is not a guy the team is going to build around.  If the Twins can acquire a player or two for him that have the potential to be cornerstones, they should go for it.

[Halsey Hall]

Chief, you know my take.  I hope TR gets that tap on the shoulder!

[Mike Sixel]

Keep Plouffe, quit only playing for the future*

 

*unless you are overwhelmed, and get MLB or near MLB talent.

[zenser]

I am wanting to keep Plouffe but it doesn't hurt to listen to offers on him. If you are blown away by an offer, you take it, if not, we keep a solid 3B.

[Major League Ready]

Part A is It just comes down to the organizations confidence in Sano sticking at 3rd.  Part B is how attractive is the offer.  The less convinced of A, the better B has to be.  It sure sucks Sano was hurt last year because his ability to play 3rd would be clearer.  My recollection of interviews with Molitor and Ryan were that they were becoming confident in him sticking at 3rd.

 

I am in very hopeful of him sticking at 3rd.  We have lots of 1B options so they should give Sano a chance at 3B unless they are convinced he won't make it.  If that's the case, move him to the OF now.

 

If they believe Sano has a 50% chance or better of staying at 3rd and the offer is Susac + Crick or Beede or perhaps even Mejia, I make the deal.  If Sano pans out at 3rd you just gave the team a significantly better chance of being a contender soon. 

[Jeremy Nygaard]

I actually heard someone on MLB Network Radio talking about Plouffe being a nice, potential replacement for Sandoval (if he left) probably about a month ago. My initial thoughts were 1) The Giants would have to give up Crick, and wouldn't. 2) Who would play 3B until Sano is ready? It would have to be Escobar...

 

I don't anticipate TR going to San Diego shopping Plouffe, but if he received an offer similar to the Meyer return (or even the Worley/May package), he would absolutely have to think long and hard about it. Escobar plays 3B this season until Sano is ready. If Sano proves he can't do it, then maybe the Twins would need to consider moving Mauer over in 2016.

 

I'd bet on Sano sticking... and I'm pushing all-in by moving Plouffe next week, but that's just me.

[maxisagod]

...1) The Giants would have to give up Crick, and wouldn't. 2) Who would play 3B until Sano is ready? It would have to be Escobar...

 

 

1) Why do you think the Twins would be interested in Crick? I mean, it not like they like 2011 1st round draft picks or anything? Susac is the Giants trade bait, a 24 AAA catcher blocked by Posey and would only need to be one of two piece the Twins would get back. 2) both Escobar and Santana deserve to start, this would allow that to happen until one falters and Sano takes over 3rd. Not a bad plan if it nets top talent. 

[jokin]

Keep Plouffe, quit only playing for the future*

 

*unless you are overwhelmed, and get MLB or near MLB talent.

 

Uhh, Mike, it suspiciously looks like there was something*** that caused you to "revise and extend" your remarks

[jcphitman]

Quite the interesting article and possibility. Two schools of thought here:

 

1.  The Twins want to try and compete this year as there is no ASG or attraction to bring the fans to TF. We are at four 90 plus loss seasons. They'll try and sell the fans on the new coaching staff and Torii Hunter, but how far will it go? TR recently said anything else in addition would be pitching (of course he could just be saying that, but...). Keeping Plouffe does help them be competitive and keeps third warm if/when they want to try Sano down the road. It also gives the Twins someone established to market.

 

2.  If deep down, Ryan understands the team won't contend, dealing Plouffe at what his top value is (which is something this team rarely does) needs to be considered. The Giants have great assets to deal back as already discussed in this thread. Escobar can easily take third for the time being. I doubt Sano is going to be the long term answer at third, but he could be tried there without displacing Plouffe should the team decide to keep him.

 

I'd say trade Plouffe even though there is no long term answer with Sano, Escobar, Mauer, etc. as possible replacements. He brings great possibilities back. Maybe even force the Giants to take Pelf? Someone mentioned Suzuki being dealt. That won't happen. You don't sign someone to an extension and then trade them in the offseason right after.

 

Just my two limey quid...