Eight Twins Players Reassigned to Minor League Camp

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, CCHOF5yearstoolate said:

Always been a little odd to me that people continue to pick at this contract. Less than 2 million a year for a guy who looked like he could be a decent #5 starter before injuries derailed his career. It's really not worth getting upset over at all. 

It's weird that until Pablo Lopez the ONLY starting pitcher to get a long-term deal from this front office was Randy Dobnak.

Dobnak's best value for the Twins would be to offset a trade for a team paying the luxury tax. Dobnak's contract is off the books for luxury tax purposes so a team like the Mets could save millions if they trade a player with a similar salary back to the Twins.

[old nurse]

16 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

It's weird that until Pablo Lopez the ONLY starting pitcher to get a long-term deal from this front office was Randy Dobnak.

Dobnak's best value for the Twins would be to offset a trade for a team paying the luxury tax. Dobnak's contract is off the books for luxury tax purposes so a team like the Mets could save millions if they trade a player with a similar salary back to the Twins.

Other than Berrios what pitcher would have been worth signing ? It is not the least bit weird 

[CCHOF5yearstoolate]

33 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

It's weird that until Pablo Lopez the ONLY starting pitcher to get a long-term deal from this front office was Randy Dobnak.

Dobnak's best value for the Twins would be to offset a trade for a team paying the luxury tax. Dobnak's contract is off the books for luxury tax purposes so a team like the Mets could save millions if they trade a player with a similar salary back to the Twins.

Dobnak's contract is such a clear outlier when it comes to MLB starting pitching contracts that, to me, it seems like it only gets brought up to push some narrative about the Front Office.

The length of the contract is not what the FO is avoiding. They are avoiding committing the annual salary that comes with those contracts because ownership is unwilling to spend to the level required to support a full team with multiple such contracts.

There are currently 43 starting pitchers signed to 4+ year contracts. 28 of those were signed when the pitcher was either a free agent or in the last year of team control - the average AAV of those 28 contracts is $22.95M. 22 of those 28 are on the following 9 teams - Toronto (3), Dodgers (3), Phillies (3), Cubs (3), Mariners (2), Yankees (2), Nationals (2), Padres (2), Rangers (2). 

Very few teams, particularly outside large markets, sign these kinds of contracts.

5 years, $9.25 million is not some onerous commitment. 

[Major League Ready]

46 minutes ago, CCHOF5yearstoolate said:

Dobnak's contract is such a clear outlier when it comes to MLB starting pitching contracts that, to me, it seems like it only gets brought up to push some narrative about the Front Office.

The length of the contract is not what the FO is avoiding. They are avoiding committing the annual salary that comes with those contracts because ownership is unwilling to spend to the level required to support a full team with multiple such contracts.

There are currently 43 starting pitchers signed to 4+ year contracts. 28 of those were signed when the pitcher was either a free agent or in the last year of team control - the average AAV of those 28 contracts is $22.95M. 22 of those 28 are on the following 9 teams - Toronto (3), Dodgers (3), Phillies (3), Cubs (3), Mariners (2), Yankees (2), Nationals (2), Padres (2), Rangers (2). 

Very few teams, particularly outside large markets, sign these kinds of contracts.

5 years, $9.25 million is not some onerous commitment. 

Thanks for making the effort to summarize this information in a way that puts this in context.  Of course, we all know this conceptually, but the summary really puts it in perspective.

[Jeff K]

16 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

Would not surprise me at all if they don’t try to package Larnach & Miranda in trades sooner than later…. other guys are coming in ‘25…….honestly, not much value there so probably depth guys with options at AAA balance of this year.

Even if the depth Veterans go away after this season, Rodriguez - Keirsey - Hellman - Severino are all going to be pushing to get Miranda & Larnach out of the way.

I think Larnach and Miranda are definite trade candidates as is Farmer, assuming health with our existing guys.

[DJL44]

5 hours ago, old nurse said:

Other than Berrios what pitcher would have been worth signing ? It is not the least bit weird 

A Sonny Gray extension would have been nice

[gil4]

12 hours ago, old nurse said:

What is charmed about rupturing a tendon and basically losing your career at this point? 

Doing it after getting paid. 

The attrition rate for pitchers is worse than it is for NFL running backs.  Plenty of guys better than him get hurt and lose their careers before making the money he made.  Plus he's still just one step away from the show if he discovers some magic and dominates AAA.  That pecking order can change in a hurry.  

[old nurse]

20 minutes ago, gil4 said:

Doing it after getting paid. 

The attrition rate for pitchers is worse than it is for NFL running backs.  Plenty of guys better than him get hurt and lose their careers before making the money he made.  Plus he's still just one step away from the show if he discovers some magic and dominates AAA.  That pecking order can change in a hurry.  

You have never dealt with something like pain for 2 years have you?

[old nurse]

4 hours ago, DJL44 said:

A Sonny Gray extension would have been nice

Maybe they approached him after the first season here and he said no.  Can’t make them sign 

[dxpavelka]

20 hours ago, DJL44 said:

Plenty of them before there was a draft.

Ok.  In the last 60 years.  To be honest, how many undrafted US born players even make it to the bigs?

[gman]

I have no problem with Dobnaks contract, I just wish he had been able to regain his pre-injury form and hope he still can.

[gman]

Anybody know how Camargo ranks among Triple A catchers on the defensive side?

[gman]

If DaShawn Keirsey and Austin Martin bust out of the gate this year, I hope they don't spend all year with an ineffective outfielder taking their possible big league development time this year.

[Rosterman]

You do want to send 40-man guys out sooner rather than later. If they get disabled in spring training, If they get disabled in a spring game before being optioned out, they remain in major league land and gain service time. 

[bean5302]

On 3/7/2024 at 7:17 AM, jmlease1 said:

I hope Sabato saved his signing bonus and invested it carefully.

Sabato's signing bonus at age 21 ($2.75MM) is more than a working lifetime of the median per capita income in the United States, and it's 15 years of median household income in Rye Brook Village, NY where he's from. He's nearing junior status in communications studies at UNC as well. I expect he'll be fine, even if he wasn't like my dad turning coal into diamonds using only his backside assets, haha

[bean5302]

On 3/8/2024 at 10:57 AM, gman said:

Anybody know how Camargo ranks among Triple A catchers on the defensive side?

Supposedly, he's improved a lot. He was considered pretty rough when the Twins acquired him. Average to a little above average controlling the run game compared to other legit prospects.

[gil4]

On 3/7/2024 at 9:07 PM, old nurse said:

You have never dealt with something like pain for 2 years have you?

I'm not sure it's relevant, but I went about 4 years on a knee that the doc said "The next step is replacement. You'll tell me when you're ready."  I finally was about 4 years ago.  I'm at that spot with the other one now after having it scoped for the 3rd time, although it's not as bad as the other one was and I hope it has more than 4 years left.  My knees hurt at least a little bit almost all the time.   I assume it's a normal part of getting old.

I also assume most pro athletes deal with pain during and after their careers.  Dobnak is back to pitching at the AAA level.  In the big picture, that's a very high level.  Realistically, the odds of him getting back to the MLB level are not great, but he's still just one step away.  He has made a lot of money, he gets to play baseball for a living, and he still has a chance to get his dream back.  If he doesn't make it back, he still should be able to do a lot of things and not have to worry about money.  

And how bad is his finger pain?  If it hurt all the time to the point is affected non-baseball activities, would he be back to throwing a baseball?  Maybe, but probably not.  I know Dobnak had surgery on his hand, but I'm not sure if it was because the pain was so intense or because he just couldn't do the things that his livelihood depended on.  My guess is when he's sixty his daily pain will be from his shoulder and elbow, not his finger.  

 

[old nurse]

8 hours ago, gil4 said:

I'm not sure it's relevant, but I went about 4 years on a knee that the doc said "The next step is replacement. You'll tell me when you're ready."  I finally was about 4 years ago.  I'm at that spot with the other one now after having it scoped for the 3rd time, although it's not as bad as the other one was and I hope it has more than 4 years left.  My knees hurt at least a little bit almost all the time.   I assume it's a normal part of getting old.

I also assume most pro athletes deal with pain during and after their careers.  Dobnak is back to pitching at the AAA level.  In the big picture, that's a very high level.  Realistically, the odds of him getting back to the MLB level are not great, but he's still just one step away.  He has made a lot of money, he gets to play baseball for a living, and he still has a chance to get his dream back.  If he doesn't make it back, he still should be able to do a lot of things and not have to worry about money.  

And how bad is his finger pain?  If it hurt all the time to the point is affected non-baseball activities, would he be back to throwing a baseball?  Maybe, but probably not.  I know Dobnak had surgery on his hand, but I'm not sure if it was because the pain was so intense or because he just couldn't do the things that his livelihood depended on.  My guess is when he's sixty his daily pain will be from his shoulder and elbow, not his finger.  

 

My, have you lived a charmed life. You are so lucky

[old nurse]

On 3/9/2024 at 1:42 PM, bean5302 said:

Sabato's signing bonus at age 21 ($2.75MM) is more than a working lifetime of the median per capita income in the United States, and it's 15 years of median household income in Rye Brook Village, NY where he's from. He's nearing junior status in communications studies at UNC as well. I expect he'll be fine, even if he wasn't like my dad turning coal into diamonds using only his backside assets, haha

So you want the Pohlads to have more money. 

It is be an  _________________ about money for athletes week because somebodies good fortune wasn’t yours

[gil4]

On 3/11/2024 at 5:11 AM, old nurse said:

My, have you lived a charmed life. You are so lucky

To quote the great philosopher Joe Walsh, "I can't complain but sometimes I still do. Life's been good to me so far."