Assessing the Donaldson and Kiner-Falefa Trade With the Yankees

[whosafraidofluigirussolo]

Great synopsis from Fangraphs:
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-yankees-and-twins-exchange-big-names-but-to-what-end/

"I just gave a ton of reasons why both sides might like this trade, but I still don’t quite understand it. For Minnesota, it feels like a sentence fragment; until the thought is completed, I’m baffled as to what this accomplishes. The Twins downgraded offensively at third, and when you add in the Mitch Garver trade that netted them Kiner-Falefa, they’re meaningfully less steady at catcher, particularly on the defensive side. All of that to save $15 million dollars this year? If that money isn’t doing anything other than enriching ownership, I don’t like this sequence of moves for them at all."

[Monticore]

What the hell are they doing? Circular firing squad?

[LastOnePicked]

2 hours ago, ashbury said:

Would you trade Ben Rortvedt for Gary Sanchez?  I would not.

Would you trade Isiah Kiner-Falefa for Gio Urshela?  I would not.

Exactly this. It's sickening to realize that the Twins would have done better for the roster by outright releasing Donaldson than to make this terrible trade. The only difference is the money saved, which should make very little difference to an owner with deep pockets. 

 

[curt1965]

I can just see the next team the Twins are supposedly dealing with:” now that you idiots backed yourself in a corner, we need for you to add, say Buxton??”

[tarheeltwinsfan]

3 hours ago, se7799 said:

So, what did we lose by signing him?  Nothing like waiting 3 years for an I told you so.

We will never know what we lost by signing him, but it was still a mistake, and not just because of his calf problems. I was not a fan of Donaldson before the Twins signed him. I don't like his style of play. 

 

[DocBauer]

To me, the plan, based on moves and reports is obvious. And I'm sorry I haven't had time to read everything or like or comment.

The Twins cleared the books for Story. They would LOVE 4yrs, but they are smart enough to know it's not going to happen. So they are looking at him playing SS...reports had Story turning down an offer to change positions...and sign him for 5yrs at $20-22ish per and front load the contract to absorb cost while they can afford to do so. And they CAN afford to do so, even if the cost is "slightly" higher.

Next, they are talking to the A's about a trade for Montas or Manaea. (You might substitute the Marlins in here for one of their pitchers). Such a trade will hurt, at least a little, but what they want/need is TBD. I could easily see Arraez, maybe Urshela as a short term option, and Larnach or Wallner, and at least one of the Twins best young arms. Considering the Bassit trade, Duran is clearly in play here. As might be a number of our top pitching prospects. But they also might be wanting to dump a contract as they have a few guys they may want to move on from. And the good news is the Twins have the finances to do so in 2022 and 2023, potentially. 

So an A's trade might hurt, but the hurt may be mitigated a bit by prospects vs taking on salary for the A's. So it could end up being a 1 for 3 or 2 for 3 vs a 1 for 4. That works in the Twins favor. The point is, despite "hurt", said hurt might not decimate the system while bringing in another top arm.

Still worried about a better option besides Sanchez at catcher, and want to use $ for a quality BP arm to make this staff really work, but I absolutely see what the FO is doing.

Hope like hell they make it work.

[Einheri]

3 minutes ago, DocBauer said:

To me, the plan, based on moves and reports is obvious. And I'm sorry I haven't had time to read everything or like or comment.

The Twins cleared the books for Story. They would LOVE 4yrs, but they are smart enough to know it's not going to happen. So they are looking at him playing SS...reports had Story turning down an offer to change positions...and sign him for 5yrs at $20-22ish per and front load the contract to absorb cost while they can afford to do so. And they CAN afford to do so, even if the cost is "slightly" higher.

Next, they are talking to the A's about a trade for Montas or Manaea. (You might substitute the Marlins in here for one of their pitchers). Such a trade will hurt, at least a little, but what they want/need is TBD. I could easily see Arraez, maybe Urshela as a short term option, and Larnach or Wallner, and at least one of the Twins best young arms. Considering the Bassit trade, Duran is clearly in play here. As might be a number of our top pitching prospects. But they also might be wanting to dump a contract as they have a few guys they may want to move on from. And the good news is the Twins have the finances to do so in 2022 and 2023, potentially. 

So an A's trade might hurt, but the hurt may be mitigated a bit by prospects vs taking on salary for the A's. So it could end up being a 1 for 3 or 2 for 3 vs a 1 for 4. That works in the Twins favor. The point is, despite "hurt", said hurt might not decimate the system while bringing in another top arm.

Still worried about a better option besides Sanchez at catcher, and want to use $ for a quality BP arm to make this staff really work, but I absolutely see what the FO is doing.

Hope like hell they make it work.

If you think you can get Story for $22MM a year for 5 years, just offer him something like $35MM for one year.  He can get a longer contract next year when things have settled down.  Twins can use him at SS, even trade him in July if need be for prospects.  Gives us three months to assess Lewis and Martin, and gives the illusion that the front office really wanted to compete this year.

[h2oface]

13 hours ago, miracleb said:

H2O...your link says the Twin got Sonny Gray as well!
 

Hopefully the Twins will use the savings on a free agent shortstop.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/minnesota-twins

that was a quote...... not my link. it was glunn's. But they did get Gray, who is not a stud in my opinion, just a fading filler that costs too much. But he is something. 

[h2oface]

13 hours ago, JDubs said:

It's almost as if there's a difference between the most physically demanding position in the game and a spot where you can park people who aren't that athletic

Everyone wants an excuse, for sure. Except Yadi.

[tony&rodney]

3 hours ago, tarheeltwinsfan said:

I don't like his style of play. 

What does this mean? I don't understand. Others have made some references to Donaldson's attitude, etc. There have been responses that called JD "cocky", which apply to virtually all decent performers.

Do you know him personally? I don't but have watched him play so many times for Oakland, Toronto, Atlanta, and for the Twins. He is intense, plays great defense, is a good baserunner despite leg issues, rarely has a bad at bat, and was always one of the three best players on his team. It was also reported how much young players enjoyed learning from him. Josh Donaldson is a winner and if one wants to see their team win, then that is the style of player needed to do so.

[USAFChief]

4 hours ago, tarheeltwinsfan said:

We will never know what we lost by signing him, but it was still a mistake, and not just because of his calf problems. I was not a fan of Donaldson before the Twins signed him. I don't like his style of play. 

 

We lost nothing by signing him. It was the opposite of a mistake and should be repeated often.

 

Personally, I wish they had about 10 Josh Donaldsons. They'd be world champions.

[tony&rodney]

8 hours ago, USAFChief said:

We lost nothing by signing him. It was the opposite of a mistake and should be repeated often.

 

Personally, I wish they had about 10 Josh Donaldsons. They'd be world champions.

Yes, your comments are all true. Which begs the question - do fans who oppose JD also oppose excellence and winning? Inconceivable.