Article: Twins New Front Office Off To Strong Start

[ThejacKmp]

 

I'm definitely intrigued by Garver, good points.

 

Yeah, actually the thing that I like least about the Castro signing (and I like it obviously) is that it does put a bit of a roadblock up for Garver.

 

That's not the worst thing - he won't be rushed to the majors (he went from "you're up in June because JRM can't hit!" to "Hey, outside of injury we're going to get you up in September unless you force our hand").  So it might be the best thing for his defensive development but as a fan, I was hoping he'd be up in June just to see what he could do. He really had a great 2016.

 

In a best-reasonable-case scenario, the Twins start 2018 with Garver as the clear starter providing .800 OPS upside and Castro providing a solid veteran backup who can hit tough righties. And maybe JRM is a third catcher/bench bat option as rosters move to 26 players. All for under $10 million.

[ThejacKmp]

 

I think lots of people would argue that Castro is better than Wieters. I've heard a lot of reports that he hasn't been the same after TJ surgery, both at the plate and behind it.

 

Yeah, I can see that argument - I was dreading the Twins would go after Wieters as a big splash move.

 

Wieters is the top of the free agent class though - he's going to get at least 4 years and more money per year/overall than anyone else.

[markos]

 

dude, nothing else has happened this offseason, hardly, and there aren't any FAs out there.

 

What, exactly, do people expect at this point?

 

They cut Plouffe, and they signed the top player at a position of need......

I think it is legitimate to question how "strong" this start has been for the new regime, or at least withhold judgement until we have more insight for the direction they are taking the franchise. Dumping Plouffe and signing Castro both (should) move the needle in the right direction, but the Castro signing kind of is a win-now move. He is solid, but given his age and strikeout rates it is certainly possible that he falls off a cliff in the next couple of years. If they end up moving Dozier and/or Santana for prospects next week, what was the point of the Castro signing? I'm not sure what their longterm plan is yet, but for me the Castro signing signals a willingness to keep Dozier and Santana and try to win now. And I'm not sure that is the right move.

[TheLeviathan]

I would like to see these guys fired.  They've failed to extract a DNA sample from Mike Trout and clone him 9 times and they've had, like, a whole month on the job already!

 

Losers.

 

Seriously, no one is arguing they deserve statues.  They're off to a strong start.  They're shopping the right people.  Cutting ties with the right people.  Added the best available player at a high position of need for a reasonable contract.  And they continue to say the right things about what they intend to do here.

 

If you're going to find a way to complain about that I'm not sure why anyone should take your opinion seriously.  At that point you're just trolling or overly obstinate.

[jimmer]

dude, nothing else has happened this offseason, hardly, and there aren't any FAs out there.

 

What, exactly, do people expect at this point?

 

They cut Plouffe, and they signed the top player at a position of need......

the fact that little else has happened in the FA market doesnt make the Castro signing bold or strong. might make it quick.

 

And you bring up the Plouffe non-tendering which wasnt mentioned in the article at all when describing the start as strong and bold. Additionally, non-tendering Plouffe is also not bold or strong. Teams dont tender contracts all the time.

 

Again, Twins fans have had the bar set horribly low they get excited over minor moves.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I think it is legitimate to question how "strong" this start has been for the new regime, or at least withhold judgement until we have more insight for the direction they are taking the franchise. Dumping Plouffe and signing Castro both (should) move the needle in the right direction, but the Castro signing kind of is a win-now move. He is solid, but given his age and strikeout rates it is certainly possible that he falls off a cliff in the next couple of years. If they end up moving Dozier and/or Santana for prospects next week, what was the point of the Castro signing? I'm not sure what their longterm plan is yet, but for me the Castro signing signals a willingness to keep Dozier and Santana and try to win now. And I'm not sure that is the right move.

 

Well, you need 2 catchers for one thing. Also, a strong (if he is) defensive catcher helps your young pitchers out a lot. I don't see this as WIN NOW, but as....we need a catcher, we want a defensive catcher to help our young pitchers....here is one that isn't $100MM. I don't see this as indicating anything about Dozier or Santana at all. That's just a guess, and I don't do guesses much anymore about other people's motivations.

[Mike Sixel]

 

the fact that little else has happened in the FA market doesnt make the Castro signing bold or strong. might make it quick.

And you bring up the Plouffe non-tendering which wasnt mentioned in the article at all when describing the start as strong and bold. Additionally, non-tendering Plouffe is not bold or strong. Teams dont tender contracts all the time.

Again, Twins fans have had the bar set horribly low they get excited over minor moves.

 

Must feel this pretty strongly to post it twice

 

well, had they kept Plouffe and not signed a catcher, how would you feel about the start? Me? I rather like these two moves. Given that, I guess I feel COMPELLED to say, strong start. YMMV, of course.

[Doomtints]

Strong start?  The pitching staff is still completely unaddressed and that's where the problem is.  They don't even have a coach yet.

 

The Twins *had* to get a catcher as Suzuki is leaving.  Do these guys really believe that the whole problem the Twins have with pitching was the catcher?  That seems naive.  

 

Also, releasing Plouffe rather than trading him is not what I call a strong move.  Sure, they'd have to eat some salary to trade him.  A trade is still better.

Edited November 30, 2016 by Doomtints

[Han Joelo]

Some might define "strong" as like when King Kong smashes half of New York city.  Other's might think it of it in a more nuanced way, like the way JFK responded during the Cuban Missile Crisis.

 

Likewise, some might define a strong start to the offseason by comparing it to A.J. Preller's tenure in San Diego, while other's might say the Cub's sober, calculated move to replace Fowler with John Jay was a strong move--sometimes letting go requires more strength than holding on.

 

Some people care more about defining words like "strong" then they do actually talking about baseball.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Strong start?  The pitching staff is still completely unaddressed and that's where the problem is.  They don't even have a coach yet.

 

The Twins *had* to get a catcher as Suzuki is leaving.  Do these guys really believe that the whole problem the Twins have with pitching was the catcher?  That seems naive.  

 

is this a real post?

[Squirrel]

I think we need to get past the semantics debate on what is meant by 'strong.' It seems to me that article meant strong as not sitting on their hands waiting but getting started by doing what needs to get done, and doing exactly what Levi just said in his post above. I don't think 'strong' in the context of this article means we're heading for a ticker tape parade nor means we've done more or better than anyone else in the league. Let's try framing the discussion on if you like or don't like the moves made so far and what you hope to see coming yet instead of debating the qualifier 'strong.'

[Dave The Dastardly]

 

the fact that little else has happened in the FA market doesnt make the Castro signing bold or strong. might make it quick.

And you bring up the Plouffe non-tendering which wasnt mentioned in the article at all when describing the start as strong and bold. Additionally, non-tendering Plouffe is not bold or strong. Teams dont tender contracts all the time.

Again, Twins fans have had the bar set horribly low they get excited over minor moves.

I agree with the low bar setting. Twins' fans have become so desperate for any signs of improvement they'd go ga-ga if the current management ordered a new case of bats.

 

I guess we'd have to better define "bold and strong" before passing judgement. I don't know how bold it is to realize you don't have a catcher, then go out and sign one. I mean what were the Twinkies going to do next year, just let the pitch roll to the backstop?

 

For me "bold and strong" would be convincing ownership to let Molitor go and replacing him with a manager that's proven he can work with young players, has a temperament that doesn't allow players to continually screw up and knows how to win.

 

Dougie for Molli. Now that's bold and strong in my book.

[HitInAPinch]

Well, again, 1st year of the new regime. 

 

There are a lot of things that need to be done and I take the signing of Castro as a plus.  No confidence in Murphy and I just don't know about Garver.  I see the Castro signing as a need.  I'll leave it to history do determine how good Castro is to the pitching staff.  I'll just say this about his offense:  Only 22% of MLB pitchers are left-handed.  While Castro's splits against right-handed pitchers is nothing to call home about, his splits against LHP is WAY below that.  Full-time 78% of the time and let's see if either of the other catchers develop.  

 

Strong start?  Umm, IDK.  Needed first steps?  Yeah.  Call it "good / strong" start.

[Nick Nelson]

 

Go get Chris Sale and we can talk about "strong"....

Well. At least we're being realistic and reasonable in our expectations!
 

Bold. Signing a declining catcher whose hitting is plummeting for $24 million is certainly bold and hopeful.

1) They didn't sign him for his bat. 2) He posted his highest OPS in 3 years this season.

 

 

[Nick Nelson]

 

the fact that little else has happened in the FA market doesnt make the Castro signing bold or strong. might make it quick.

Castro was the most heavily sought free agent catcher in the early going, with multiple offers on the table. The Twins competed and won the bidding, while other free agents continue to wait and let the market play out. You don't have to call it strong if you don't want but it is bold.

[jimmer]

Castro was the most heavily sought free agent catcher in the early going, with multiple offers on the table. The Twins competed and won the bidding, while other free agents continue to wait and let the market play out. You don't have to call it strong if you don't want but it is bold.

you are definitely entitled to believe its both if you want. I am going to heed Chi's warning and move on from the descriptions of the Twins Front Office moves. Edited November 30, 2016 by jimmer

[nytwinsfan]

 

Bold. Signing a declining catcher whose hitting is plummeting for $24 million is certainly bold and hopeful.

 

Jason Castro OPS:

2014: .651

2015: .648

2016: .684

 

"plummeting."

 

Jason Castro WAR per 600 PA (based on fangraphs, which DOES NOT account for pitch framing):

2014: 1.875

2015: 2.4

2016: 1.755

 

Jason Castro, Runs above average saved due to PItch Framing

2014: 9.0

2015: 12.9

2016: 12.8

 

"declining."

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

And yes I am aware he had a career year in 2013 when his BABIP was .351, which is .049 above his career average of .302. That was a blip, not some plateau from which he has been declining.

[TheLeviathan]

Have they cured cancer yet?  That'd be a strong start.   Otherwise....what are they wasting their time on?  Baseball?

 

As long as this thread is going to be preposterous let's dive in with both feet!

Edited November 30, 2016 by TheLeviathan

[Thrylos]

 

Imo it's absurd ownership forced them to keep molitor around after the worst season in franchise history.

Patsy Donovan was fired as a manager after the 38-113 1904 season

[Squirrel]

Have they cured cancer yet?  That'd be a strong start.   Otherwise....what are they wasting their time on?  Baseball?

 

As long as this thread is going to be preposterous let's dive in with both feet!

From my perspective, I just want a cure to pancreatitis.

[Mike Sixel]

 

From my perspective, I just want a cure to pancreatitis.

 

any idea what it is yet?

[Craig Arko]

 

any idea what it is yet?

A lack of moderation.  

[Dave The Dastardly]

 

Have they cured cancer yet?  That'd be a strong start.   Otherwise....what are they wasting their time on?  Baseball?

 

As long as this thread is going to be preposterous let's dive in with both feet!

Lighten up dude! The Twins aren't playing (although that might be construed as a blessing), the Vikings have forgotten how to win, the T-Wolves suck (as usual) and I heard the hockey team (what are they called again?) is doing their usual inconsistent thing and winter is slowly tightening its grip around our throats and pretty soon will have us by the balls (don't be alarmed - that's a little play on sports there). What else do Minnesota sports fans have to do right now but be preposterous?

 

A fan's gotta survive any way he can. Even if he has to invent fecal matter. (Will that slip past the censors?)

[jimmer]

I would like to see these guys fired. They've failed to extract a DNA sample from Mike Trout and clone him 9 times and they've had, like, a whole month on the job already!

 

Losers.

 

Seriously, no one is arguing they deserve statues. They're off to a strong start. They're shopping the right people. Cutting ties with the right people. Added the best available player at a high position of need for a reasonable contract. And they continue to say the right things about what they intend to do here.

 

If you're going to find a way to complain about that I'm not sure why anyone should take your opinion seriously. At that point you're just trolling or overly obstinate.

you are wildly stretching to make a point.

 

Who is complaining about what the FO has done so far? While some are saying that the move mentioned in the article, signing Castro, isnt bold or deserving to be described as a strong start, few are actually saying it was a bad signing. You mention things The FO has done that arent mentioned in the article that you like, and thats fine, but that doesnt mean people who may like the moves, but arent as enamored with them, have to be labeled the way you labeled them.

Edited November 30, 2016 by jimmer

[Vanimal46]

Let's hope they continue this "strong start" throughout the off-season. TR was working pretty quickly himself the last couple of off-seasons then went radio silent from December through March. Let's try to get some trades done, then everyone will jump on the love train patting these guys on the back. 

[jimmer]

Let's hope they continue this "strong start" throughout the off-season. TR was working pretty quickly himself the last couple of off-seasons then went radio silent from December through March. Let's try to get some trades done, then everyone will jump on the love train patting these guys on the back.

you mean like that highly praised catcher Murphy we traded for? :-) Edited November 30, 2016 by jimmer

[Vanimal46]

 

you mean like that highly praised catcher Murphy we traded for? :-)

You got it! TR found his target and made the deal in mid-November. Followed up by Park signing in early December. After that, 2-3 minor league signings the rest of the way. 

[jimmer]

You got it! TR found his target and made the deal in mid-November. Followed up by Park signing in early December. After that, 2-3 minor league signings the rest of the way.

yeah, i am fine with the Castro signing. Its an attempt for sure and they are valuing framing, which is nice. The thing I warned about is expecting Castros framing numbers to be the same here as with Houston. A day or two later Dave Cameron warned the same thing. He wrote in his chat, 'if the team that employs Mike Fast isnt interested in bringing you back, maybe your framing value isnt as likely to continue as the Twins are hoping'

[Doomtints]

 

I think we need to get past the semantics debate on what is meant by 'strong.' It seems to me that article meant strong as not sitting on their hands waiting but getting started by doing what needs to get done, and doing exactly what Levi just said in his post above. I don't think 'strong' in the context of this article means we're heading for a ticker tape parade nor means we've done more or better than anyone else in the league. Let's try framing the discussion on if you like or don't like the moves made so far and what you hope to see coming yet instead of debating the qualifier 'strong.'

 

Meh.  Ryan would have picked up a catcher too.  It's a necessity at the moment since they don't have one.  Ryan may have even picked up the same catcher. 

 

We need to keep it real.  As of yet, the Twins haven't done anything that will make a major difference.

[markos]

 

yeah, i am fine with the Castro signing. Its an attempt for sure and they are valuing framing, which is nice. The thing I warned about is expecting Castros framing numbers to be the same here as with Houston. A day or two later Dave Cameron warned the same thing. He wrote in his chat, 'if the team that employs Mike Fast isnt interested in bringing you back, maybe your framing value isnt as likely to continue as the Twins are hoping'

Definitely a concern, though they replaced Castro with Brian McCann, who has almost as good framing numbers and a much better bat. Hard not to see the swap as a net positive for the Astros, regardless of how much one values Castro's framing.