La Velle: Sano Lost 5 Pounds This Offseason

[Willihammer]

Pretty sure I head TR tell Reusse this weekend that Sano was at 15% body fat. An additional 15 pounds, which he was asked to cut, would have him at 9.9%.

[old nurse]

 

Dmitri Young did not play 500 games in the OF and both he and Lee had a career dWAR over 10. 

 

It is not can he do it, it is can he do it and be a league average defender there.  And how does his bat's value play at 3B relative to OF/DH, etc.

Young played mostly OF for a 5 year stretch when he was Sano's age.  League average OF by metrics is relying on the unproven.  In terms of offense, if his woba stays the same Sano would be a top bat for a RF or any other position they would put him at. His bat, if it remains at the level of his rookie year, should overcome any defensive woes at any position except catcher.

[tobi0040]

 

Young played mostly OF for a 5 year stretch when he was Sano's age.  League average OF by metrics is relying on the unproven.  In terms of offense, if his woba stays the same Sano would be a top bat for a RF or any other position they would put him at. His bat, if it remains at the level of his rookie year, should overcome any defensive woes at any position except catcher.

 

Right, but a guy like Lee gave back 1/3 of his WAR because he was not a good outfielder.  Young gave back 2/3 of his WAR because of defense.

 

The question is what position yields the highest WAR?  I don't think LF, RF, DH, or 1B is the answer.  I think it is 3B.

[terrydactyls]

How big of a splat will it make when Sano runs into Dozier or Joe going for a pop up?

Running into Maurer might solve the Plouffe/Sano quandry.

[terrydactyls]

Harmon was 6 feet tall and weighed about 200 lbs.

I've also seen him listed as 5'10" and 215, which is probably closer to reality.

[Platoon]

His btat, if it remains at the level of his rookie year, should overcome any defensive woes at any position except catcher.

That's an interesting visual! I umpired behind a catcher that big a few times, needless to say the bottom of the strike zone was strictly a guess!

[HitInAPinch]

Did anyone besides me read the whole article?  Last paragraph:

 

“I’m really happy about the chance Paul Molitor and Terry Ryan give me to be in the lineup,” Sano said. “If I need to play catcher, first base, whatever, I’ll play it because I want to be in the lineup.’’

 

Good enough for me!

 

 

[glunn]

I would note that for all we know, Sano has converted some of his fat into muscle.  Maybe he lost 5 pounds of fat and converted another 5 pounds into muscle.

[h2oface]

 

The Twins had a big power hitter in the past who was moved from 1st base to left field, then 3rd base, and finally back to first. He was not known for his defense but did fine at all three positions. In fact, he started the all star game at all 3 positions. His name was Harmon Killebrew

..... and Killebrew would hardly be considered big at all now.

 

[h2oface]

 

I would note that for all we know, Sano has converted some of his fat into muscle.  Maybe he lost 5 pounds of fat and converted another 5 pounds into muscle.

 

I bet that is the case. Dense muscle weight/tissue is added and some much looser fat tissue lost, with a net loss. We like to think of it as converted, but the tissues do not convert into each other. Depending on how much tissue is lost and replaced, it could look quite significant to the eye, and several overall inches lost, even if no net weight was lost.

 

Still, 5 lbs is like one large dinner with the boys. A glutenous Thanksgiving dinner for you and me. It would seem, for someone with that much weight, that 20 lbs should have been a pretty easy proposition if he really stayed focused.  

 

All I can think about is the same thing Buxton is thinking about..... “Man,” Buxton said, “I’m just going to try to not get run over.”

 

Addressing the question asked by the poster, I am totally ambivalent and have the confidence of calling the roll of the dice that I know are going to be thrown.

[h2oface]

 

That's an interesting visual! I umpired behind a catcher that big a few times, needless to say the bottom of the strike zone was strictly a guess!

 But then, no matter what, the bottom of the strike zone is strictly a guess from the umpires point of view always and on every pitch, regardless of the size of the catcher. Certainly the large catcher can't help the guess, though, eh?

[twinsnorth49]

Man, all this just so we could keep Trevor Plouffe and not sign an actual outfielder?

 

Someone better be hitting a whole lot of balls where people can't catch them.

 

 

One positive at least is it looks as if Buxton can cover half of RF as well as patrolling CF.

[DocBauer]

Oh heck, let's just hit as many points as quickly as possible:

 

1] Sano is a good athlete overall. He's not fat, he's just a large, strong, quite athletic man. I think we should stop comparing him to Killebrew, or anyone else if we can help it. Athletes have changed over the past 10-20-30-+ years. (In all sports)

 

2] I think know I know where Sano's 5 LB's went, and I'm not happy about it. But besides that, he wears his weight well. As Gunn said, what about body fat%? That's a pretty major deal. And despite workouts and training, if you've ever played an organized or semi-organized sport of any sort, you know there is a difference between being "in shape" and "game shape". I will lay money he drops another 10LB's before April is over, if not sooner.

 

3] I'm not a scout. I haven't scouted Sano. But I have read tons of reports and watched a few games. The guy can play 3B. He's not a butcher. He has the ability to get better still. But right now, Plouffe is better and more proven. He also brings a pretty good bat. I think TR is being truthful about keeping talent and talented bats around. I don't think it's an indictment against Sano at all.

 

4] I see absolutely no reason why the large, muscular, athletic man with the cannon for an arm named Sano can't be at least a "decent" defensive OF. And with that arm, he might just be able to cheat an extra step or two back to keep things in front of him, (important and helpful). And with Rosario and Buxton covering 3/4 of the OF territory, he may be able to cheat a step or two closer to the line, (also important and helpful). But by the time he actually gets really comfortable, my next point comes up:

 

5] My only problem is...and this is not a negative in acquiring Park...but with Kepler ready soon, Sano is probably going to be moving again by 2017, if not before. There is some great anticipation there, but also frustration with how things are set up right now.

[Oxtung]

To answer the OP's question:  IMO the first half of the season will be pretty close to a disaster out in the field.  The question I have is will the second half be a disaster too or merely below average (assuming Sano remains in the OF)?

[Bob Sacamento]

 

People - Athletes go intotheir respective training camps with weight on because they know they are going to lose quite a bit throughout camp.  The fact that he has only lost 5 pounds is not a bad thing.  He will easily lose 15 more pounds with the running he is going to do in his OF drills.  Thus mission accomplished.  

 

 

All I know is Sano reported to camp last year out of shape, to the point they were holding him out of game action while he was doing running sand drills.  , baserunning drills, and lifting  albeit after he "sprained" his wrist sliding.  Still he was doing the Mastercleanse Diet at the end of spring as well to shed off some extra pounds.  My guess is Sano didn't do as much work this offseason as some of his peers but that's pure speculation.  Anyone see Kennys Vargas? He's shed some serious lbs this winter.

 

Little birdie told me Sano doesn't want to play the outfield, hell he doesn't even want to play the field; the man just wants to hit.  I'll be on the backfields this Friday and Saturday and Miggy is suppose to be shagging flyballs so this should be interesting...

[alhweiner]

Little birdie told me Sano doesn't want to play the outfield, hell he doesn't even want to play the field; the man just wants to hit.

My common sense tells me that your "little birdie" is full of bird bleep.

I've never met anyone Sano's age, size, speed, arm-strength and agility who doesn't want to show the world his athleticism. Do you think Anthony Barr (6'5", 255 lbs)wants to play Nose-Tackle for the Vikings?

[Bob Sacamento]

 

My common sense tells me that your "little birdie" is full of bird bleep.
I've never met anyone Sano's age, size, speed, arm-strength and agility who doesn't want to show the world his athleticism. Do you think Anthony Barr (6'5", 255 lbs)wants to play Nose-Tackle for the Vikings?

I have absolutely no idea who the hell Anthony Barr is nor do I care why it's any issue of him playing Nose-Tackle for the Vikings.  All I know is that from being on the backfields of Fort Myers for the past three going on four years, I've seen and interacted with Miggy enough to know when someone with first hand knowledge says he doesn't want to play out there I believe him.

[alhweiner]

I have absolutely no idea who the hell Anthony Barr is nor do I care why it's any issue of him playing Nose-Tackle for the Vikings.  All I know is that from being on the backfields of Fort Myers for the past three going on four years, I've seen and interacted with Miggy enough to know when someone with first hand knowledge says he doesn't want to play out there I believe him.

Sano may prefer infield to outfield, but I'll bet he doesn't prefer DH to outfield.

[David HK]

5, eh?  I was kind of thinking he maybe needed to lose about a 3rd-grader or so, if he's going to the outfield...

[tobi0040]

 

Sano may prefer infield to outfield, but I'll bet he doesn't prefer DH to outfield.

 

I bet none of us have a clue what he wants to play or doens't want to play.  It is possible that he just says OK to whatever the Twins ask of him at this point.  They might not even know his preference.

[Dantes929]

He has never looked fat to me and he has always looked pretty fast so I am not worried about his size except for any possible collisions.   As far as other injury goes he pulled a hamstring last year running the bases which lead me to a couple questions.  1.  Out of fear of injury running the bases should we keep him out of the lineup?  2.  If we keep him in the lineup should we instruct him not to run?  3.  If he is running out to the outfield or from the outfield twice an inning along with chasing fly balls is he more or less likely to pull a hamstring than sitting in the dugout or being stationary at 3rd base and then running the base paths?

My only concern about the outfield is can he get a decent jump and can he catch fly balls on the run.   I am not concerned about his size or speed.

[gmarais66]

There was a very revealing interview on this topic yesterday, on ESPN 1500, with Twins' VP Mike Radcliff. He all but admitted it is going to be a rough transition and that there are going to be balls dropping in and glaring mistakes made by Sano, even in the regular season. He said he's never played outfield before and they have no idea what is going to happen. There is, however, a lot of hope and optimism, and we all know what that's worth. He said the dream is that he could eventually get some where near the level of an average outfielder. I don't know about anyone else, but this sounds like a train wreck, waiting to happen.

[Pardon My Dinger]

 

I have absolutely no idea who the hell Anthony Barr is nor do I care why it's any issue of him playing Nose-Tackle for the Vikings.  All I know is that from being on the backfields of Fort Myers for the past three going on four years, I've seen and interacted with Miggy enough to know when someone with first hand knowledge says he doesn't want to play out there I believe him.

Here's what probably happened. Somebody got the impression that he doesn't want to play the field because his english is not perfect. He probably said something like "I just want to hit." i.e, it doesn't matter to me, as long as I'm in the lineup. This sort of thing happens all the time.

[Vanimal46]

 

There was a very revealing interview on this topic yesterday, on ESPN 1500, with Twins' VP Mike Radcliff. He all but admitted it is going to be a rough transition and that there are going to be balls dropping in and glaring mistakes made by Sano, even in the regular season. He said he's never played outfield before and they have no idea what is going to happen. There is, however, a lot of hope and optimism, and we all know what that's worth. He said the dream is that he could eventually get some where near the level of an average outfielder. I don't know about anyone else, but this sounds like a train wreck, waiting to happen.

Sounds about right. Hopefully the frustration doesn't build up and confidence begins to wane with our fly ball pitchers like Hughes and Santana. There's certainly going to be cases where fly balls that were caught last season are going to drop for hits this season. 

[Platoon]

Man, all this just so we could keep Trevor Plouffe and not sign an actual outfielder?

 

Someone better be hitting a whole lot of balls where people can't catch them.

 

 

One positive at least is it looks as if Buxton can cover half of RF as well as patrolling CF.

The other side of this coin is that when we are on defence someone had better be hitting a lot of balls where our new OF can easily coast under them!

[Platoon]

One reason I tend to agree with Bob S on this is Sano did not want to move from SS to third. He wasn't shy about it either. There is no reason he would want to move to the OF. This better go "well", or I am concerned we will find that our new superstar is not going to be quietly unhappy.

[tobi0040]

 

There was a very revealing interview on this topic yesterday, on ESPN 1500, with Twins' VP Mike Radcliff. He all but admitted it is going to be a rough transition and that there are going to be balls dropping in and glaring mistakes made by Sano, even in the regular season. He said he's never played outfield before and they have no idea what is going to happen. There is, however, a lot of hope and optimism, and we all know what that's worth. He said the dream is that he could eventually get some where near the level of an average outfielder. I don't know about anyone else, but this sounds like a train wreck, waiting to happen.

 

The Twins made at least three assumptions:

 

-Sano could stick at 3B

 

-They wanted to trade Plouffe

 

-They could get a return that was satisfactory for Plouffe

 

Somewhere along the line, they were wrong about one or more of these.  I am not sure which one it is and we may never know. 

 

But I just hope this is a lesson about hedging bets.  If the Twins thought it was even a 10% chance of any of these, Sano should have had different gloves and in the minors he should have played at least 20 games a year in the OF.  You don't have a guy playing a brand new position for the first time in the majors.

 

 

[spinowner]

 

 Sano should have had different gloves and in the minors he should have played at least 20 games a year in the OF.  You don't have a guy playing a brand new position for the first time in the majors.

I agree and I'll take it a step further. It's good for Sano and for the Twins if he can play outfield if needed, and they probably should have had him play there some in the minors. However, he's going to be an infielder/DH in the long term and the Twins need to see that he gets enough time at 3B to at least prevent his skills at that position from regressing. In the coming years he should also start learning to play 1B.

[Winston Smith]

IMO the season starts with Arcia in right, Sano the DH and Park in AAA.

[tobi0040]

 

IMO the season starts with Arcia in right, Sano the DH and Park in AAA.

 

My ideal situation would be in June, Plouffe has found a new home.  Sano at 3B, Rosario/Buxton/Kepler in the OF.  Mauer at 1B and Arcia and Park rotating between DH and bench bat.  Arcia could see some time in the OF as well.