Twins Add Familiar Face, Top Prospect, and One Surprising Name as Rosters Expand

[jmlease1]

18 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

There are periodic prospects that seem so obvious but are not seen the same way by the FO.  I want Keirsey to go somewhere that he will be respected and used like Rooker and Raley and Gil and Cano.  

Compare this with what KC just did!  Why not Varland?  

Lee is the only one I am happy with. 

What are you talking about? Rooker got an extended look in MLB with the Twins and wasn't very good, and then couldn't make a dent with 2 other franchises before finding success in Oakland. Let's not pretend he was disrespected by the Twins. I'm happy for him, but he clearly needed to make adjustments and not play in the field.

Raley is kind of the same way, but also didn't spend all that much time with the Twins (and was hurt). But he needed multiple bites at the apple in MLB with a couple of franchises before finding success, and just like Rooker, didn't find success until he was nearly 30.

Not sure what Gil is doing in here, other than being lumped in as a player who the Twins had that found success somewhere else, but we dealt him from rookie ball 7 years ago. He's having a fine season now, but he's also (unsurprisingly) gotten hurt and it's taken him forever to get to success in MLB.

I mean, if the point is we should be giving chances to older prospects, then you should be thrilled to see Helman come up.

[Jeff K]

19 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

There are periodic prospects that seem so obvious but are not seen the same way by the FO.  I want Keirsey to go somewhere that he will be respected and used like Rooker and Raley and Gil and Cano.  

Compare this with what KC just did!  Why not Varland?  

Lee is the only one I am happy with. 

I think we are going to see Varland start this week against Tampa Bay.  After that, I hope he moves to reliever.

[Jeff K]

21 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

Lee is surely needed, With Lee back, Helman isn't needed, we don't need another RH bat (once something gets in their head, it sticks no matter) & I can't imagine why they had to put him on the 40-man. Keirsey is more needed as a LH bat & CF & has produced all season-long & deserves to be on the 40-man & available for the playoffs.

I agree with you.  I am concerned that one reason could be the Twins are not bullish on Correa returning this season.  They haven't exactly been up front on the injuries.

[Fatbat]

11 hours ago, Fred said:

Next season they won't want to pay Kepler, they won't re-sign Margot, I don't think they will re-sign Santana, and I'm not sure of Farmer's  staus.

I thought Farmer had a mutual option for ‘25 with a buyout but now I can’t find that info.  He needs to go away tho.

[joefish]

21 hours ago, karcherd said:

Helmen is up here because the Twins analytics nerds think this is Strat-o-matic.  Just because a player can go to different positions doesn't mean he can play them well.  How many utility guys do you need.  Play your best players at their best position.  Having one utility guy is not a bad thing but you don't need a roster full of them.  Helmen may do ok up there but I just wish for once they would bring up the best player regardless of where they play.

I believe the Twins over-rate utility

 

[ashbury]

4 hours ago, Karbo said:

Farmer will be gone unless he's willing to take a HUGE pay cut.

 

1 hour ago, Fatbat said:

I thought Farmer had a mutual option for ‘25 with a buyout but now I can’t find that info.  He needs to go away tho.

There's no commitment beyond this year.  In an interview earlier this season, Farmer expressed surprise that they tendered him a contract and which he accepted in lieu of arbitration, making me believe he'd be open to a much lower figure in free agency.

[KBJ1]

Nice to see Hellman finally get a callup

But pitching is the dire need. Smyly would have been a nice addition for a doable price.

[karcherd]

1 hour ago, joefish said:

I believe the Twins over-rate utility

 

Exactly, just because a player can play a position doesn't mean he can play it well.  There is a reason we see some of the sloppy play that happens, players are not playing in familiar positions.  

[LA Vikes Fan]

5 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

Helman’s wRC+ in AAA is 126 to Keirsey’s 117. In 2023 it was 122 to Keirsey’s 93. Maybe Helman is the better hitter.

The offense is sputtering right now. We need the better bat. Helman may be up simply because he’s a better hitter. With Castro now available to play CF, his positional flexibility also helps.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

15 hours ago, Fred said:

Next season they won't want to pay Kepler, they won't re-sign Margot, I don't think they will re-sign Santana, and I'm not sure of Farmer's  staus.

Not a lot of org depth at 1B right now.  Santana is at the point in his career where he will probably be looking at the same contract (1/$5m) next year.  Probably the one guy they will take a hard look at resigning.

I am a fan of the new September call-up rules.  September always seemed like a totally different game due to the roster expansion.  I get the "rewarding organizational guys" thing, but it shouldn't be a thing at this level.  Professional sports is mainly outcome based.

[mikelink45]

8 hours ago, jmlease1 said:

What are you talking about? Rooker got an extended look in MLB with the Twins and wasn't very good, and then couldn't make a dent with 2 other franchises before finding success in Oakland. Let's not pretend he was disrespected by the Twins. I'm happy for him, but he clearly needed to make adjustments and not play in the field.

Raley is kind of the same way, but also didn't spend all that much time with the Twins (and was hurt). But he needed multiple bites at the apple in MLB with a couple of franchises before finding success, and just like Rooker, didn't find success until he was nearly 30.

Not sure what Gil is doing in here, other than being lumped in as a player who the Twins had that found success somewhere else, but we dealt him from rookie ball 7 years ago. He's having a fine season now, but he's also (unsurprisingly) gotten hurt and it's taken him forever to get to success in MLB.

I mean, if the point is we should be giving chances to older prospects, then you should be thrilled to see Helman come up.

That's not the point at all. I think you're reading in an awful lot. I just think that sometimes players need to find the right team to succeed. That doesn't mean the previous team messed up

[Fire Dan Gladden]

14 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

That's not the point at all. I think you're reading in an awful lot. I just think that sometimes players need to find the right team to succeed. That doesn't mean the previous team messed up

There are dozens and dozens of examples of players failing in one organization and succeeding elsewhere.  Check out Jose Bautista, Randy Johnson, and Sammy Sosa...

Sometimes a change of scenery is necessary.

[Fred]

On 9/2/2024 at 8:36 AM, Karbo said:

Farmer will be gone unless he's willing to take a HUGE pay cut.

That's what I was thinking, but, all I hear about Farmer is that he's a terrific, wonderful, excellent clubhouse guy. Not sure how much that is worth.

[DJL44]

10 minutes ago, Fred said:

That's what I was thinking, but, all I hear about Farmer is that he's a terrific, wonderful, excellent clubhouse guy. Not sure how much that is worth.

MLB coaches make roughly $200,000 with quite a bit of variation. I'm pretty sure you can hire someone to be a great clubhouse guy for $50,000 if you just want him to hang out in the clubhouse and be friendly.

[Fred]

22 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Not a lot of org depth at 1B right now.  Santana is at the point in his career where he will probably be looking at the same contract (1/$5m) next year.  Probably the one guy they will take a hard look at resigning.

I am a fan of the new September call-up rules.  September always seemed like a totally different game due to the roster expansion.  I get the "rewarding organizational guys" thing, but it shouldn't be a thing at this level.  Professional sports is mainly outcome based.

I will be a fan of Santana's if he goes or stays, but first base is a position where clubs try to hide a mediocre fielder with a big bat. Santana plays first like he has had ballet lessons, and there is value to that, but, as a hitter he is middle-of-the-road. I do get the impression that he gets timely hits (don't know what the numbers say). The switch hitting is nice, but I think they signed him as a bridge to Severino (also a swith hitter). Severino is a masher, and I think he will have to lose the job rather than win it.

[Fred]

18 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

MLB coaches make roughly $200,000 with quite a bit of variation. I'm pretty sure you can hire someone to be a great clubhouse guy for $50,000 if you just want him to hang out in the clubhouse and be friendly.

I fully expect him to be gone, and he is way overpaid. When they re-signed him, he was the primary backup at shortstop, I understood that. Now what they have to think about is how many good friends are going to be upset and complaining about loyalty, etc. Yes, I know they are professionals, but they are people first. It's not simply a matter of hiring a coach.

[DJL44]

4 minutes ago, Fred said:

I fully expect him to be gone, and he is way overpaid. When they re-signed him, he was the primary backup at shortstop, I understood that. Now what they have to think about is how many good friends are going to be upset and complaining about loyalty, etc. Yes, I know they are professionals, but they are people first. It's not simply a matter of hiring a coach.

Professional baseball players know it's awfully hard to keep a job hitting .189 no matter how nice you are. They also are more interested in winning than playing with their friends.

[Fred]

3 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

Professional baseball players know it's awfully hard to keep a job hitting .189 no matter how nice you are. They also are more interested in winning than playing with their friends.

He has hit at a .250 clip over his career. They wouldn't be much as friends if they walked away because he's having a down year. I'm not a Farmer fan (I expect him to be gone); I just question the effect on the clubhouse.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

38 minutes ago, Fred said:

I will be a fan of Santana's if he goes or stays, but first base is a position where clubs try to hide a mediocre fielder with a big bat. Santana plays first like he has had ballet lessons, and there is value to that, but, as a hitter he is middle-of-the-road. I do get the impression that he gets timely hits (don't know what the numbers say). The switch hitting is nice, but I think they signed him as a bridge to Severino (also a swith hitter). Severino is a masher, and I think he will have to lose the job rather than win it.

Elite fielding with a .735 OPS / 106 OPS+ for $5m per year is an absolute steal at basically any position.  It looked like he was done a few years ago, but has improved his offensive numbers over the last few years.  Lewis, Miranda, Kiriloff are not locks (injury and unsure offense), resigning Santana at another 1/$5 mil contract makes too much sense and fits the current "we are cheap" attitude of ownership.

You sound higher on Severino than ownership.  He has positional flexibility, including 2B.  Why hasn't he been called up already?

[Fred]

9 minutes ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Elite fielding with a .735 OPS / 106 OPS+ for $5m per year is an absolute steal at basically any position.  It looked like he was done a few years ago, but has improved his offensive numbers over the last few years.  Lewis, Miranda, Kiriloff are not locks (injury and unsure offense), resigning Santana at another 1/$5 mil contract makes too much sense and fits the current "we are cheap" attitude of ownership.

You sound higher on Severino than ownership.  He has positional flexibility, including 2B.  Why hasn't he been called up already?

Watching Severino at first base would give you the impression that he's a (benefit of the doubt) slightly below average fielder. Second base, not so much, (I'm smiling real big). Guys like Spencer Steer come to mind. Severino is strictly a hitter. 2 seasons ago he lead the entire minor leagues in HRs, this season, at AAA, he started slow, but he came around. I've noticed him playing some right field at St. Paul lately. Maybe they have a plan for Santana. OK with me. Just as with Correa I am a fan for life.

[DJL44]

3 hours ago, Fred said:

He has hit at a .250 clip over his career. They wouldn't be much as friends if they walked away because he's having a down year. I'm not a Farmer fan (I expect him to be gone); I just question the effect on the clubhouse.

When you're 33 (turning 34) the career numbers matter a lot less than what you did in the previous season. Kyle Farmer will have a hard time getting more than a minor league deal from anyone. The Twins could give him a minor league contract. With Brooks Lee in the majors they won't really have anyone for SS in St. Paul.