Santana trade rumors

[Mike Sixel]

 

#1, I was replying to someone talking about how the Twins turned things around in the past.  I didn't set that time constraint.

 

got it, 

[King]

Jon Heyman ‏@JonHeyman  59s59 seconds ago Manhattan, NY
twins would need to be overwhelmed to trade ervin santana. some relievers will go tho. kintzler, abad among better ones.

 

Why though? We should just be looking to shed the salary at this point.

[King]

I mean Andrew Cashner and junk just fetched Josh Naylor, Capps and Luis Castillo. If we could get something similiar or even slightly lesser than that for Santana you take it and run.

[laloesch]

 

Jon Heyman ‏@JonHeyman  59s59 seconds ago Manhattan, NY
twins would need to be overwhelmed to trade ervin santana. some relievers will go tho. kintzler, abad among better ones.

 

Why though? We should just be looking to shed the salary at this point.

 

Let's just hope its posturing.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Jon Heyman ‏@JonHeyman  59s59 seconds ago Manhattan, NY
twins would need to be overwhelmed to trade ervin santana. some relievers will go tho. kintzler, abad among better ones.

 

Why though? We should just be looking to shed the salary at this point.

 

 

I mean Andrew Cashner and junk just fetched Josh Naylor, Capps and Luis Castillo. If we could get something similiar or even slightly lesser than that for Santana you take it and run.

I think you partially answered your own post there.  The Marlins probably didn't want to take on ~$33 mil in future obligations right now, plus surrendering prospects.  I suspect a few other contenders with SP needs (i.e. Baltimore) will be in the same boat.

[laloesch]

Seems to be A LOT of traffic about Santana on mlbtraderumors.com.

 

I think the Twins are more open to dealing him than they are letting on and are trying to maximize the potential return.

 

 

[jorgenswest]

Will the Twins make the same mistake with Santana as they did with Willingham in 2012?

 

Both 33 years old. Both with two years left. Both a good value for their current production. Both sought in the trade market. Both Twin teams going nowhere.

 

It must have been easy to look at Willingham in the midst of his 7th consecutive season with an OPS over 800 and think even if he drops off a little he still is a valuable player the next two years.

 

He didn't drop off a little. As often happens in mid 30s, the bottom fell out. He went from 890 OPS to an August waiver claim the next year with no player offered in return. The Twins should have taken that deal from the Orioles. It was no better in 2014 when he didn't bounce back and the Twins received a player they wouldn't keep on the 40.

 

Santana is never going to have more value. They need to trade him for the best the market has to offer.

[Winston Smith]

What Antony is saying is better than what Terry was say, "we'll take a lesser prospect if we don't need to add money". That plan was giving him away just to save money.

 

Start high you can always go down but if you start low then go lower isn't a great plan.

[Dr. Evil]

Will the Twins make the same mistake with Santana as they did with Willingham in 2012?

 

Both 33 years old. Both with two years left. Both a good value for their current production. Both sought in the trade market. Both Twin teams going nowhere.

 

It must have been easy to look at Willingham in the midst of his 7th consecutive season with an OPS over 800 and think even if he drops off a little he still is a valuable player the next two years.

 

He didn't drop off a little. As often happens in mid 30s, the bottom fell out. He went from 890 OPS to an August waiver claim the next year with no player offered in return. The Twins should have taken that deal from the Orioles. It was no better in 2014 when he didn't bounce back and the Twins received a player they wouldn't keep on the 40.

 

Santana is never going to have more value. They need to trade him for the best the market has to offer.

I like Santana I initially wanted to keep him. But, this post makes good sense. I hope they trade him.

[Deebers]

 

Will the Twins make the same mistake with Santana as they did with Willingham in 2012?

 

In a word, yes. It certainly appears so. 

[laloesch]

 

In a word, yes. It certainly appears so. 

 

Unless they are bluffing and attempting to drive up the trade offers.

[troyhobbs]

 

Unless they are bluffing and attempting to drive up the trade offers.

Everything I've heard Antony say leads me to believe this in NOT a bluff...unfortunately.  So stupid....

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Will the Twins make the same mistake with Santana as they did with Willingham in 2012?

Good post.  To be fair to the Twins, while Willingham's value was at an all-time high in July 2012, I don't know if it was very high in absolute terms.

 

Do SP hold their value better than LF/DH sluggers?

[Rosterman]

 

Bernadino tweets that the Orioles, Blue Jays, Mets, Marlins and A's have all had scouts at Target Field.

 

https://twitter.com/MikeBerardino

I thought they were just passing thru and fund cheapseats on StubHub!

 

[Vanimal46]

Another potential landing place for Santana is closed. The Marlins acquired Andrew Cashner, Colin Rea, and Tayron Guerrero from the Padres for Jarred Cosart. Carter Capps, and 2 minor leaguers. One prize addition for the Padres is Marlins 2015 1st round draft pick 1B Josh Naylor. 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/17170357/andrew-cashner-traded-miami-marlins-san-diego-padres

[laloesch]

 

I thought they were just passing thru and fund cheapseats on StubHub!

 

Those are old tweets are they not? early July?

[clone52]

 

Good post.  To be fair to the Twins, while Willingham's value was at an all-time high in July 2012, I don't know if it was very high in absolute terms.

 

Do SP hold their value better than LF/DH sluggers?

 

Unless we have knowledge of what was actually offered for Willingham, do we really know if it was wrong not to trade him?

[clone52]

 

Another potential landing place for Santana is closed. The Marlins acquired Andrew Cashner, Colin Rea, and Tayron Guerrero from the Padres for Jarred Cosart. Carter Capps, and 2 minor leaguers. One prize addition for the Padres is Marlins 2015 1st round draft pick 1B Josh Naylor. 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/17170357/andrew-cashner-traded-miami-marlins-san-diego-padres

 

On the other hand, now that Cashner is no longer available, do the Rangers, Orioles, Astros, Blue Jays and Giants have new interest in Santana now they they lost out on acquiring Cashner?  It seems to me like if any of those teams thought they had a shot at Cashner, they wouldn't have even listened to offers for Santana.  They might listen now.

[nicksaviking]

 

Seems to be A LOT of traffic about Santana on mlbtraderumors.com.

 

I think the Twins are more open to dealing him than they are letting on and are trying to maximize the potential return.

 

I'd be disappointed if they didn't. As far as I'm concerned, the fans don't need to know this stuff until hopefully after the matter is resolved.

[Vanimal46]

 

On the other hand, now that Cashner is no longer available, do the Rangers, Orioles, Astros, Blue Jays and Giants have new interest in Santana now they they lost out on acquiring Cashner?  It seems to me like if any of those teams thought they had a shot at Cashner, they wouldn't have even listened to offers for Santana.  They might listen now.

I hope that's the case. I'm on board the trade Santana now bandwagon. 

[nicksaviking]

 

Everything I've heard Antony say leads me to believe this in NOT a bluff...unfortunately.  So stupid....

 

Well if you think Anthony is capable of making stupid decisions, do you really want him trading Santana? What if he does and everyone universally hates the trade? Barring injury, any trade the Twins can do for Santana now likely can be done come this off season by the permanent GM.

[nicksaviking]

 

 

I hope that's the case. I'm on board the trade Santana now bandwagon. 

 

I am too, but only because Anthony's statement about being blown away doesn't sound impossible seeing as what the Marlins got to rent Cashner.

 

Still not a fan of Anthony making the trade, but the if the starter market is this hot, it might be hard to screw up too terribly.

[magiklair]

Looks like most people will be disappointed..

[jorgenswest]

Unless we have knowledge of what was actually offered for Willingham, do we really know if it was wrong not to trade him?

Fair point. Is it reasonable that they would have had offers for a guy with a .913 OPS in the first half and they could have chosen to take the best offer?

 

We also won't truly know what was offered for Santana if he is not dealt. I am only suggesting that they should take the best offer for Santana just as they should have for Willingham 4 years ago.

[nicksaviking]

Also, if the Twins do end up trading Santana, I hope Cashner flops in Miami. I don't want to give non-elite free agent pitchers four+ year deals anymore but I'd roll the dice on a Cashner reclamation project this off season for a one year make-good deal with or without an option. If the next GM goes for league average starting pitchers like our old one did, I hope he gets the kind that bite on one or two year deals, those guys are almost always a good movable asset.

[Loosey]

 

Another potential landing place for Santana is closed. The Marlins acquired Andrew Cashner, Colin Rea, and Tayron Guerrero from the Padres for Jarred Cosart. Carter Capps, and 2 minor leaguers. One prize addition for the Padres is Marlins 2015 1st round draft pick 1B Josh Naylor. 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/17170357/andrew-cashner-traded-miami-marlins-san-diego-padres

It's kind of funny if you think about it for a second, but how in the world are the Padres so bad?  They have traded away 60% of their starting rotation to playoff teams that wanted them, their starting Left Fielder and a their closer. 

 

You would think if playoff teams wanted those guys, the Padres would have at least been in the playoff hunt themselves. 

 

 

 

 

[Kwak]

Saving payroll? What for?--unless some of it winds up in your pocket. I know none will be going my way.

 

Trade now? What's the offer?

 

The comparison to Willingham is apples to oranges. Santana is having a "normal-ish" season, but Willingham was having a well above normal season for him. SP are more difficult to replace than DH-only guys. SPs can be even more valuable in the off-season when many teams are casting the eyes around.

 

A final point, there is no need to strip the Twins of all SPs for next year in order to provide an opportunity for every "prospect" on the team to "get a shot" next year. So far there are THREE spots up for grab in the rotation. It is pointless to strip all experience from the rotation. The Twins will lose plenty as it is--and still give everybody who is close to ready an opportunity to prove himself.

 

A sound offer--that would work. An example an innings eater and a good prospect at AA. I know that sounds like Worley and May. But it doesn't have end as badly as that trade.

 

[diehardtwinsfan]

So here's the question.  Do you take another prospect similar to Mejia for Santana or do you ask for more?  I tend to want to keep Ervin myself, so no borderline top 100 guy or (100-150 depending on your preference).  Then again, I'd just DFA Nolasco at this point to make room for Berrios or send Duffey to AAA and DFA Nolasco this offseason.

[nicksaviking]

So here's the question.  Do you take another prospect similar to Mejia for Santana or do you ask for more?  I tend to want to keep Ervin myself, so no borderline top 100 guy or (100-150 depending on your preference).  Then again, I'd just DFA Nolasco at this point to make room for Berrios or send Duffey to AAA and DFA Nolasco this offseason.

After seeing what Miami paid for Cashner, I'd want way more than Mejia. If a team tells me that Santana's remaining contract is less appealing than Cashner's expiring contract, I tell that GM that we clearly do not see eye to eye and good day to you sir.

[Vanimal46]

It's kind of funny if you think about it for a second, but how in the world are the Padres so bad? They have traded away 60% of their starting rotation to playoff teams that wanted them, their starting Left Fielder and a their closer.

 

You would think if playoff teams wanted those guys, the Padres would have at least been in the playoff hunt themselves.

Great point. It's baffling. All of the publications out there say the Padres are years away from being competitive, yet they hado several players with legitimate trade value.