Hunter needling Hicks

[diehardtwinsfan]

Except we don't know if he actually will be gone after this year.  They've said they will go year to year.

Which is perfectly fine. Next year at this time, they will have a better idea if someone is ready. Given Hunter's age, I'm not sure he's going to play another year. I think this is it for him.

[jimmer]

'Well, there's nothing concrete that we fans can see.  We can go by the fact that guys in baseball have said great things about him, how he seemed to be in charge of those Angels teams (esp after Aidenhart's death) and how the Twins FO, who has some knowledge about him, thought he was a good teammate and brought him back.'

 

And I ask 'what is a young guy going to say about a veteran when a reporter is asking info about the veteran for a story?'  

 

And as far as why the Twins brought him back, yeah, seems PR stuff is likely the main reason.  I like how Anthony even said that first in the interview, linked here in a thread, he pointed out how much Twins fans love him and then backtracked and said it wasn't for that.

 

And, of course, people buy into that Hollywood stuff, so when trying to justify way overspending on a player, it's as good of reason as any.

[gunnarthor]

Compared to others at his position, he was average offensively and the worst defender of the bunch.

Not really, he was top 5-7 in oWAR, wRC+ and wOBA among RFers (and above Arcia) and was better than the other RFers on the market.  And even if you want to call his production average, it was better than what the Twins got out of their RFers.  I don't think there's much argument that his bat shouldn't be a plus for us this year - unless he falls off a cliff, which could certainly happen.  

 

We've discussed the defensive issues elsewhere.  No need to do so again.

[nicksaviking]

On a side note, day 1 and Hunter was seen talking to Hicks. Walking with Hicks.  Grabbing bats together and Hunter (for the camera) making a joke.

 

This story is going to become overdone very, very quickly.  

 

Yes, but we might feel differently if instead it looked like this:

 

On a side note, day 1 and Hunter was seen talking to Buxton. Walking with Buxton.  Grabbing bats together and Hunter (for the camera) making a joke.

[toosweet64]

Sano, if he no longer can play 3B.  Rosario, Walker, maybe Kepler.  Depending on spring training for the most part.

Sano will be given every chance to stay at 3B this year.  Walker and Kepler are still years away and Rosario barely played last year.  Hunter is not blocking any of these guys on his 1 year deal.

[bird]

I think it's fair to wonder if Hunter will force unwanted or unneeded advice on some guys, but these things have a way of working themselves out. Players will push back or coaches will step in IF he oversteps.

 

The question got asked, how would one know if he's a good teammate. Turn the question around and ask, is there any evidence of him being anything else? Why the skepticism?

[nicksaviking]

Compared to others at his position, he was average offensively and the worst defender of the bunch.

 

We've all done the defensive discussion to death, but any metric that says Hunter was worse in the field than Arcia and Willingham combined probably needs to be taken with a grain of salt.  He's probably below average out there now, but he's not going to be the worst defender in the league.

[gunnarthor]

And I ask 'what is a young guy going to say about a veteran when a reporter is asking info about the veteran for a story?'  

 

And as far as why the Twins brought him back, yeah, seems PR stuff is likely the main reason.  I like how Anthony even said that first in the interview linked here in a thread, and then backtracked and said it wasn't for that.

 

And, of course, people buy into that Hollywood stuff, so when trying to justify way overspending on a player, it's as good of reason as any.

 

I really find this to be pretty improbable.  This really requires someone to think that Hunter has sucked up to a bunch of different reporters while no teammates have even anonymously called him out on it (or a belief that  all reporters would bury that) and would require several ML managers - Leyland, Gardy, Sciosia - to specifically praise him for something that he doesn't do without then losing the clubhouse for it.  Seems to me that it's much more likely that Hunter's outgoing personality and charisma has made him a very liked and respected player in the clubhouse.   

[gunnarthor]

Which is perfectly fine. Next year at this time, they will have a better idea if someone is ready. Given Hunter's age, I'm not sure he's going to play another year. I think this is it for him.

Yeah, that's my thought too.  I wonder if he really wants into coaching?  I could see the Twins giving him either a position or an informal instructor role after he retires.  Frankly, I'd be stunned if they didn't offer him something like that.

[jimmer]

I think it's fair to wonder if Hunter will force unwanted or unneeded advice on some guys, but these things have a way of working themselves out. Players will push back or coaches will step in IF he oversteps.

 

The question got asked, how would one know if he's a good teammate. Turn the question around and ask, is there any evidence of him being anything else? Why the skepticism?

I'm not sure it's skepticism so much as it's being taken as if it's fact and, therefore, factored into his value as a justification for signing him. We know he gets in fights with players when things go bad, we know he takes confrontations with teammates to the press. Those aren't good.

[bird]

Which is perfectly fine. Next year at this time, they will have a better idea if someone is ready. Given Hunter's age, I'm not sure he's going to play another year. I think this is it for him.

Complete conjecture on my part, but I'm guessing the conversations have already taken place about Hunter's future path within the organization. Hunter is no fool. I think he's grooming his own replacements and preparing himself for a future permanent role on the field staff. No commitments yet, but they're taking things a year at a time....

[Shane Wahl]

thanks for the straightening out.  I thought I read Ryan say they had zero problem with the work he was putting in.

 

I think he did say that, though maybe it was specific to something. Anyway, keep in mind that Gardenhire is gone and some of this nonsense and crap may be gone with him. I don't see Molitor as one to whine to the media about players.

[nicksaviking]

Yeah, that's my thought too.  I wonder if he really wants into coaching?  I could see the Twins giving him either a position or an informal instructor role after he retires.  Frankly, I'd be stunned if they didn't offer him something like that.

 

It could happen, but the way he likes to talk, I think he's destined for the media.  I'd guess MLB network would be interested in him if he can keep his political views to himself.

[bird]

I'm not sure it's skepticism so much as it's being taken as if it's fact and, therefore, factored into his value as a justification for signing him. We know he gets in fights, we know he takes confrontations with teammates to the press. Those aren't good.

No, I don't think his "good teammate" reputation is simply "taken as if it's a fact." It may be exaggerated by some in the media and elsewhere, but It's supported by a great deal of anecdotal evidence.

 

Unlike your own assertion that the Twins signed him mainly as a PR stunt. Now THAT statement should not be taken as a fact, right?

 

It's fair to cite a couple of instances, like you have, that bring into question his good guy reputation. I actually share your skepticism about what an all-around great guy he is, and what a selfless, inspirational leader he is. And I'm happy to see that our friends here on TD are less than effusive about it for the most part.

[jimmer]

 

Unlike your own assertion that the Twins signed him mainly as a PR stunt. Now THAT statement should not be taken as a fact, right?

 

 

You're right, that is my assertion (as well as other's assertions) but they did talk about projected ticket sales being down before they got him. Anthony, when asked about the signing in the interview posted on this site, right away pointed out how much the Twins fans love him, but then backtracked and said the signing wasn't a PR move. And the fact that he's a former Twins great being signed in his twilight sure does make it seem it's about PR.  I almost hope it was a PR move, that would make more sense than thinking his play was worth 10M or his mentoring was the reason we spent 10M.

[Halsey Hall]

Nice little bit from Reusse -

 

 

I was told by a civilian who is at those fields every day that within 15 minutes, Torii was off to the side, showing Kennys Vargas what he might doing wrong with his right-handed swing, and then he was with this minor leaguer and that minor leaguer.

On Wednesday, Aaron Hicks joined the early arrivers in Fort Myers. Hunter and Hicks took batting practice, shagged fly balls and walked off the field together, stopping in the dugout to grab their bats.

Hicks looked larger in the shoulders last season and he looks larger still now. I pointed toward Hicks and made a gesture to Hunter taking note of Hicks’ muscular upper body.

“Steroids!’’ Hunter hollered. “I’m turning him in.’’

So now I'm called a civilian, lol.  Actually I told Ruesse that Hunter was here and Hicks.  He wanted to know where and I pointed out Hunter in right, in the white, and Hicks in center, in the red.  Then I told him it took Torii all of 3 minutes to start giving tips, the first to Fryer, and then Vargas, which continued into the outfield and then in the dugout, the day before.  Ruesse doesn't take notes from civilians though. 

 

I was still standing with Ruesse when they came in, and had earlier told Ruesse that Hicks had bulked up, upper body.  So Ruesse says something and Torii spontaneously responded with the "steriods" and that he was going to call the CDC or something, laughing.  It was just that quick, Torii being Torii. 

 

My thinking is he'll lighten up the clubhouse and put some life back into this team.  It's about time someone did, and who better at it than Torii.  They been sleepwalking for a few year. 

 

I don't understand three pages of comments already, and some of the comments against it.

[nicksaviking]

So now I'm called a civilian, lol.  Actually I told Ruesse that Hunter was here and Hicks.  He wanted to know where and I pointed out Hunter in right, in the white, and Hicks in center, in the red.  Then I told him it took Torii all of 3 minutes to start giving tips, the first to Fryer, and then Vargas, which continued into the outfield and then in the dugout, the day before.  Ruesse doesn't take notes from civilians though. 

 

 

How could Ruesse not report on the impact Hunter was/would have on Fryer?!?

[Squirrel]

You're right, that is my assertion (as well as other's assertions) but they did talk about projected ticket sales being down before they got him. Anthony, when asked about the signing in the interview posted on this site, right away pointed out how much the Twins fans love him, but then backtracked and said the signing wasn't a PR move. And the fact that he's a former Twins great being signed in his twilight sure does make it seem it's about PR.  I almost hope it was a PR move, that would make more sense than thinking his play was worth 10M or his mentoring was the reason we spent 10M.

I think there were several reasons why they signed Torii, and PR very well could be one of them.  I'd hesitate to call it a 'stunt,' though.  And I think 'mentoring' Hicks is another.  It's of my opinion that the Twins are reaching their end with Hicks and need him to finally step up.  If Hunter can help him get to where we need Hicks to be, it's money well spent.  Now I'm not saying this is fact ... it's my speculation.  

[James]

I think there were several reasons why they signed Torii, and PR very well could be one of them.  I'd hesitate to call it a 'stunt,' though.  And I think 'mentoring' Hicks is another.  It's of my opinion that the Twins are reaching their end with Hicks and need him to finally step up.  If Hunter can help him get to where we need Hicks to be, it's money well spent.  Now I'm not saying this is fact ... it's my speculation.  

Right.  There's a lot of back and forth about whether signing Hunter was done because of his on the field play, mentoring abilities, how he is as teammate or PR.  But why can't all of those things be reasons for signing him?  

 

As long as the advice Torii is giving to guys like Hicks isn't contradicting the work that the coaching staff is doing, I'm all for him giving all the advice he wants.  I'm hoping it Hicks takes this advice and lives up to the potential that he has.  

[bird]

The Twins would not have signed Hunter if they didn't think he was an upgrade in the lineup for the first half of 2015 at least. My opinion here. And of course they weighed the other likely benefits, like clubhouse atmosphere, Hicks, a future non-playing role, etc.. We'll never know how much weight they assigned to each though. And in the end, we'll never know how much of what goes on is attributable to all his "mentoring".

[Squirrel]

Right.  There's a lot of back and forth about whether signing Hunter was done because of his on the field play, mentoring abilities, how he is as teammate or PR.  But why can't all of those things be reasons for signing him?  

 

As long as the advice Torii is giving to guys like Hicks isn't contradicting the work that the coaching staff is doing, I'm all for him giving all the advice he wants.  I'm hoping it Hicks takes this advice and lives up to the potential that he has.  

Yeah, you said this better, but yeah.  That's what was in my head.

[big dog]

 

I don't understand three pages of comments already, and some of the comments against it.

 

Slow news day.  We need spring training to start, fast.

[nater79a]

The Twins would not have signed Hunter if they didn't think he was an upgrade in the lineup for the first half of 2015 at least. My opinion here. And of course they weighed the other likely benefits, like clubhouse atmosphere, Hicks, a future non-playing role, etc.. We'll never know how much weight they assigned to each though. And in the end, we'll never know how much of what goes on is attributable to all his "mentoring".

 

Hunter's declining physical attributes aside, have to believe he still has better instincts in the OF than Hammer or Kubel.  That in itself is an upgrade over last year.

[nicksaviking]

Hunter's declining physical attributes aside, have to believe he still has better instincts in the OF than Hammer or Kubel.  That in itself is an upgrade over last year.

 

 

 

Yes, that has been my point.  RF in Target Field is small, instincts and craftiness are going to be more useful in that small space most noted for strange wall angles and no foul territory.  It's much different than cavernous Comerica Park. 

 

That's assuming Hunter plays in RF and not LF.  Even if they do stick him in LF (and the shouldn't) his declining range isn't worse than Willingham or Kubel.

 

Of course no one is going to be able find any silver lining when they stick him in CF.

[diehardtwinsfan]

I'm not sure it's skepticism so much as it's being taken as if it's fact and, therefore, factored into his value as a justification for signing him. We know he gets in fights with players when things go bad, we know he takes confrontations with teammates to the press. Those aren't good.

All of which happened when exactly? 2005? Is it possible that perhaps he's grown up a bit in the last 10 years? Look, I know Torii is far from the perfect guy, and we all know he tends to run a bit loose with the media and not really think about what he's saying, but right now, I don't really see the concern. For all the talk about swagger and wanting to see more of it, Hunter is THAT GUY. He might rub some people wrong with his personality, but he's going to push them too. Those two things tend to go hand in hand.

[Thrylos]

Short memory is a wonderful thing.

Two i Torii who punched a teammate before and was fairly disliked in the clubhouse is called a "good teammate"...

 

Let's see how long this is going to last.  Torii cares about Torii, per past experience.

[ashbury]

Frankly, I'd be stunned if they didn't offer him something like that.

Molitor's just keeping the seat on the bench warm for Torii.

[bird]

Short memory is a wonderful thing.

Two i Torii who punched a teammate before and was fairly disliked in the clubhouse is called a "good teammate"...

 

Let's see how long this is going to last.  Torii cares about Torii, per past experience.

Geez, thrylos, I thought it was Cuddyer you liked to pick on.

[TheLeviathan]

I'm an advocate of a good clubhouse dynamic mattering, but I'm going to need to actually see results before any back-patting happens.

[USAFChief]

He might be physically past the age where he can help a team win. That's a fair question.

 

But for me, It will be a refreshing change of pace to see someone on the Twins with a pulse. Someone who cares about winning...a lot.

 

Sports aren't just about talent.