Concerns That Starting Pitcher Trade Market Has Stalled

[Heiny]

I think if things don't start heating up we are going to start seeing a bunch of 1 year deals at pretty decent dollars.  I don't see the Twins going this path though.  I do believe there is a good chance that the Twins will end up trading for Manoah.  And as a long term goal I think we need to start drafting early and heavy on SP.  We need to be looking at bringing  a good starting pitcher up from our minor league system every year.  We have a good offensive crew developing already.  Concentrate on drafting and developing starting pitchers.

[ashbury]

2 hours ago, Heiny said:

And as a long term goal I think we need to start drafting early and heavy on SP. 

Then you are asking the FO to change their organizational philosophy.  The majority of the time they reserve first round picks for sure-thing bats like Aaron Sabato.  And if by chance they do draft a valuable pitcher, they immediately trade him away for 2 years of a good established major leaguer rather than gamble on getting 6 years of something possibly better.

Wonder how long Charlee Soto lasts in this farm system?

For trivia buffs: who was the last pitcher before Chase Petty taken by the Twins in the first round?  The immortal Tyler Jay, by the prior regime, 2015.

[JD-TWINS]

16 hours ago, Heiny said:

I think if things don't start heating up we are going to start seeing a bunch of 1 year deals at pretty decent dollars.  I don't see the Twins going this path though.  I do believe there is a good chance that the Twins will end up trading for Manoah.  And as a long term goal I think we need to start drafting early and heavy on SP.  We need to be looking at bringing  a good starting pitcher up from our minor league system every year.  We have a good offensive crew developing already.  Concentrate on drafting and developing starting pitchers.

General comment for all trade talks for an arm………I know this may be really “Old School” but I don’t like the thought of trading with Mariners (almost played in ‘23 playoffs & on the rise) or Toronto, the team we had to beat in the first round of ‘23 playoffs……and are very likely to face again at some point. To directly improve foes by filling their needs doesn’t seem wise. There are 15 teams in the NL to start with - Free Agency - again, maybe Old School but seems like a much safer path.

[Heiny]

18 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

General comment for all trade talks for an arm………I know this may be really “Old School” but I don’t like the thought of trading with Mariners (almost played in ‘23 playoffs & on the rise) or Toronto, the team we had to beat in the first round of ‘23 playoffs……and are very likely to face again at some point. To directly improve foes by filling their needs doesn’t seem wise. There are 15 teams in the NL to start with - Free Agency - again, maybe Old School but seems like a much safer path.

Generally,  I agree.  But sometimes it may be the best that we can do.  A trade that helps usually hurts also.  But if we can trade a piece like Polanco I don't feel the pain so badly due to the plethora of capable 2b candidates.  I think this one helps more than it hurts, and at least it's not in our division.

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, JD-TWINS said:

General comment for all trade talks for an arm………I know this may be really “Old School” but I don’t like the thought of trading with Mariners (almost played in ‘23 playoffs & on the rise) or Toronto, the team we had to beat in the first round of ‘23 playoffs……and are very likely to face again at some point. To directly improve foes by filling their needs doesn’t seem wise. There are 15 teams in the NL to start with - Free Agency - again, maybe Old School but seems like a much safer path.

Always trade with the team that offers the best players in return.

[Doctor Wu]

20 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

General comment for all trade talks for an arm………I know this may be really “Old School” but I don’t like the thought of trading with Mariners (almost played in ‘23 playoffs & on the rise) or Toronto, the team we had to beat in the first round of ‘23 playoffs……and are very likely to face again at some point. To directly improve foes by filling their needs doesn’t seem wise. There are 15 teams in the NL to start with - Free Agency - again, maybe Old School but seems like a much safer path.

I'm Old School too, but when it comes to trades, I'd have no qualms about trading with any team in any division or league. 

[LonelyseatinMOA]

On 1/18/2024 at 5:48 PM, cmoss84 said:

Would anyone give Woodruff something like 5/75? 

I'd give him anything, ain't my money

 

but seriously yeah I would, if he cant come back from the injury it'll hurt. But if he does come back (even at like 80%) then its a steal

[Cris E]

On 1/21/2024 at 9:12 AM, JD-TWINS said:

General comment for all trade talks for an arm………I know this may be really “Old School” but I don’t like the thought of trading with Mariners (almost played in ‘23 playoffs & on the rise) or Toronto, the team we had to beat in the first round of ‘23 playoffs……and are very likely to face again at some point. To directly improve foes by filling their needs doesn’t seem wise. There are 15 teams in the NL to start with - Free Agency - again, maybe Old School but seems like a much safer path.

Yeah, but no.  For every time some guy comes out of nowhere to stomp you in the playoffs you have another case of Berrios getting pulled in the fifth. It all averages out in the end, and even if it doesn't you kind of don't care what the other guy does as long as the guy you get does what he's supposed to.

[KirbyDome89]

On 1/20/2024 at 9:58 AM, JD-TWINS said:

At the time it was known across the Country in the media, & to anyone paying attention, that Ryan’s record at home was much better than his road record, hence the Ober start in Houston

Or the Twins watched Ryan struggle for 6 weeks in June/July and then look wholly unimpressive when he returned for the remaining 5-6 weeks of the season. He threw 2 innings in his lone playoff appearance. Two! It was an elimination game, so an already short leash was likely even shorter, but it was clear there wasn't a ton of trust there and FWIW that was the right call.  

[Woof Bronzer]

On 1/20/2024 at 9:58 AM, JD-TWINS said:

At the time it was known across the Country in the media, & to anyone paying attention, that Ryan’s record at home was much better than his road record, hence the Ober start in Houston……..

Literally no one brought up the road vs home thing at the time and no front office cares about small sample size pitcher wins as a meaningful metric. (I'm guessing Ober was better at home too, as are most Twins pitchers given the friendly confines of Target Field.)  If a pitcher can only be trusted at home then he can't be trusted period. You don't get to pick where you play the games.  

[nicksaviking]

Still waiting. The Twins traded for Kenta Maeda on February 10th, Jake Odorizzi on February 17th, Sonny Gray on March 13th and Chris Paddock not until April 7th.

Any rotation trade in the next two weeks would be a record for this front office. Anything after would be standard operating procedure. 

[harmony55]

Seattle has a combined 25 years of team control over its current starting rotation of Luis Castillo, George Kirby, Logan Gilbert, Bryce Miller and Bryan Woo at an estimated aggregate salary of $186.7 million, or an average annual salary less than $7.5 million per starter. Attrition always looms but in today's pitching market, the Mariners are in an envious position.

[tony&rodney]

22 hours ago, harmony55 said:

Seattle has a combined 25 years of team control over its current starting rotation of Luis Castillo, George Kirby, Logan Gilbert, Bryce Miller and Bryan Woo at an estimated aggregate salary of $186.7 million, or an average annual salary less than $7.5 million per starter. Attrition always looms but in today's pitching market, the Mariners are in an envious position.

You are correct - the Mariners are looking good right now with their top five starting pitchers. You have been a strong defender for the Mariners team on Twins Daily. Dipoto (despite his usual positive comments) is likely real uncomfortable going into the season with his current position players. The Cease rumors that were floated on the internet recently seemed pointless but it sure seems like Jerry is looking to shore up his team and several moves may still be ahead for the Seattle squad. Perhaps DeSclafani is moved and Snell added as a precursor to another trade. Much like the Twins, the Mariners could just hold the line. The AL Central is not as tough to win as the AL West however and shooting for a Wild Card position is not a plan in the offseason.