Article: LAD 6, MIN 5: Uff Da

[Tom Froemming]

The Twins held a 5-0 lead after three and a half innings, and were still up three runs heading into the bottom of the seventh, but the Dodgers stormed back to win on a Justin Turner walkoff single.

 

Ouch. This loss puts the Twins a staggering 5.5 games back of first place in the AL Central. That happened fast. While the Twins have lost nine of their last 13 games, Cleveland has won six striaght and Kansas City has won eight in a row.Win Expectancy (via Fangraphs)

Download attachment: WinEx726.png

Ervin Santana pitched into the seventh inning, but there he gave up a huge two-out, two-run double to Chase Utley that put the Dodgers within a run. In the eighth, Zack Granite made a bizarre play on which LA scored the game-tying run.

 

WIth runners on the corners and one out, Granite came in to catch a fly ball and instead of trying to throw out the man tagging from third base, he fired it back into first base to attempt to double off the runner. Well, nobody there. Joe Mauer was in position as the cutoff man on a potential throw to the plate, exactly where you’d expect him to be.

 

Maybe that throw was symbolic of the Minnesota Twins 2017 season.

 

With the game tied up in the top of the ninth and Kenley Jansen on the hill for the Dodgers, Max Kepler led off with a double. Ehire Adrianza (career .232 hitter, .626 OPS) grounded out, but Kepler advanced to third. Jensen then struck out Jason Castro (career .232 hitter, .697 OPS) and Jorge Polanco (career .247 hitter, .666 OPS) to end the threat.

 

Brandon Kintzler, who pitched to three batters in the eighth, retired the leadoff man in the bottom of the ninth. After back-to-back singles, he got Corey Seager to ground out to second base for out No. 2. Kintzler got ahead of Justin Turner 0-2, but just when it looked like this thing was headed into extras, Turner battled back, worked the count full and delivered the game-winning hit.

As with most close baseball games, there were plenty of spots to nit pick Paul Molitor’s management. He could have lifted Santana after six strong innings instead of letting him hit lead off in the seventh. He probably went to Kintzler far too early; expecting a five-out save is a lot, especially against the best team in baseball. Yes, Ervin and Kintzler have been they guys who have helped carry the Twins this far, but they can’t do everything.

 

Having no Miguel Sano, who was hit in the wrist by a pitch Monday night, and a short bench did not help things, either. It’s not like you can expect success against the Dodger bullpen, none of the three guys they rolled out there for the final innings had an ERA over 1.75, but having a bunch of the team’s worst hitters bat in key situations late is not ideal. Eduardo Escobar was the cleanup man once again tonight. Not having Sano or the DH dramatically changes this lineup.

 

It was another tough loss to swallow that resulted in a series sweep. It hurts, but it’s important to keep in mind the Dodgers are 71-31 now, we were playing in their place and the Twins held a lead in every game of the series. If the front office thought this team was going to compete when they completed the Jaime Garcia trade on Monday, it would seem pretty ridiculous to throw in the towel on Thursday.

 

Postgame With Molitor

 

Bullpen Usage

Here’s a quick look at the number of pitches thrown by the bullpen over the past five days:

Download attachment: Pen726.png

Thursday

Off

 

The Twins get to spend an off day in California Thursday while Oakland will be playing an afternoon game in Toronto before heading home. Jaime Garcia is set to make his Twins debut Friday.

 

Click here to view the article

[IaFan1]

I hope Molitor gives Rogers and Kintzler the day off Friday along with the scheduled day off Thursday. They are burning out and need a couple days rest to regroup.

[drock2190]

Twins missed Buxton last night. Dodgers were running wild with pea shooter Granite out there in center. I can think of a couple instances where they got an extra base.

[mikelink45]

Look to the minor leagues.  Maybe they should have had Sano on the 10 day and Vargas up.  They need more than Escobar hitting 4th against the Dodgers.  This was a mismatch again and I keep looking at the Bench.  I know we want 25 men in the bullpen, but your use chart says that we are not using all those relievers anyway.

 

Polanco has really hurt the team with his performance and he now occupies one of those rare bench spots along with Giminez - It would have been nice to have Garver to PH instead.  

[Tom Froemming]

 

Look to the minor leagues.  Maybe they should have had Sano on the 10 day and Vargas up.  They need more than Escobar hitting 4th against the Dodgers.  This was a mismatch again and I keep looking at the Bench.  I know we want 25 men in the bullpen, but your use chart says that we are not using all those relievers anyway.

 

Polanco has really hurt the team with his performance and he now occupies one of those rare bench spots along with Giminez - It would have been nice to have Garver to PH instead.  

Yup, great analysis. Going with an eight-man bullpen can make sense during certain parts of your schedule, but the Twins were just off last Thursday, are off today and off yet again this coming Monday. Plenty of opportunities for guys to rest.

 

Plus, if you're carrying the extra arm, use him for crying out loud. Why ask your closer to get five outs?

[bighat]

I went to bed with the Twins up 5-1 last night and didn't feel very good about their chances.  I'm sure many of you felt the same. What a gut punch for a team that seems to not be able to pull themselves off the mat right now.

 

Another strikeout with a man on third and less than 2 outs in an important spot in the game.  The theme of the series, happened in all 3 games.  

 

Nothing less than a sweep of the Padres and winning 2-out-of-3 in Oakland can save any hope of a wildcard berth at this point. 

 

The bungled Garcia trade is looking worse and worse every day. 

 

Can't wait for a win.  Been way too long.

[Willihammer]

This team just can't hang with the big boys.

 

Didn't even face Kershaw!

[bighat]

 

 It would have been nice to have Garver to PH instead.  

 

Garver seems like a good player, but I think it's too early to assume we're sitting on Barry Bonds down there in AAA.  Byron Buxton was supposed to be Andrew McCutcheon, and it took him 2 years to start hitting MLB pitches.  A guy like Garver isn't going to save this team nor do I think he'd have even a minor impact. Just my opinion....in your scenario, who does he replace and what role does he have on the team?

[Mike Sixel]

Garver should have been up, instead of 419 RPs. I said this before the series started, and feel it still now. You need PH with positional flexibility in NL games.

 

I fail to see how the occasional 5 out save is too much to ask.

[Otto von Ballpark]

Garver seems like a good player, but I think it's too early to assume we're sitting on Barry Bonds down there in AAA.

How do you get "assume he's Barry Bonds" from "it would be nice to have him PH"?

 

Garver would be the part-time DH, 1B vs LHP, backup catcher.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

 

Garver seems like a good player, but I think it's too early to assume we're sitting on Barry Bonds down there in AAA.  Byron Buxton was supposed to be Andrew McCutcheon, and it took him 2 years to start hitting MLB pitches.  A guy like Garver isn't going to save this team nor do I think he'd have even a minor impact. Just my opinion....in your scenario, who does he replace and what role does he have on the team?

"Barry Bonds"? How about "better hitter than Polanco or Giminez"?

[bighat]

 

How do you get "assume he's Barry Bonds" from "it would be nice to have him PH"?
 

 

I do not think we should assume Garver is going to provide a spark for this team. He has not proven himself and I do not think his presence on the Minnesota Twins Baseball Club will affect the team's place in the standings as much as you think it will. That is what I meant, and I think you probably knew that.

 

 

[gman]

Neither Cleveland nor Kansas City will win the rest of their games nor will the Twins lose the rest of theirs. What this series really did was expose the overall weakness in the Twins roster. If you look at the lineup this series, can you imagine playing 30 or 40 games with Sano on the DL. Nine months in, I don't fault current managment for the roster construction, you build with what you have. 

[laloesch]

 

Byron Buxton was supposed to be Andrew McCutcheon, and it took him 2 years to start hitting MLB pitches.  

 

ehhh he still really isn't hitting major league pitching effectively, unfortunately.

[PDX Twin]

 

The bungled Garcia trade is looking worse and worse every day. 

 

Well, I'd say more like "insignificant." We very likely gave up almost nothing, and got something that's not as useful as it seemed last week.

[deanlambrecht]

I like the deadline approach Levine stated, with the caveat that I think they should lean much more towards sellers than anything else.  This roster is simply not built to compete against the teams that we know are stocked, nor is it just a matter of more service time for the roster to improve.

[Otto von Ballpark]

I do not think we should assume Garver is going to provide a spark for this team. He has not proven himself and I do not think his presence on the Minnesota Twins Baseball Club will affect the team's place in the standings as much as you think it will. That is what I meant, and I think you probably knew that.

Still too much to read into "it would have been nice to have Garver PH there". I don't think anyone is claiming Garver is a savior that is going to catapult us up the standings, but he is doing quite well in AAA and is worth a look, and we have some roster openings where we could give him those opportunities without much trouble. Even conservative Seth says it is time.

[Seth Stohs]

 

This team just can't hang with the big boys.

Didn't even face Kershaw!

 

But see, that's just not true. The Twins could or even should have won two of the three games. And then other one was a 2-run game until after the weird delay.And that was without Miguel Sano for two of them.

[Seth Stohs]

 

Garver seems like a good player, but I think it's too early to assume we're sitting on Barry Bonds down there in AAA.  Byron Buxton was supposed to be Andrew McCutcheon, and it took him 2 years to start hitting MLB pitches.  A guy like Garver isn't going to save this team nor do I think he'd have even a minor impact. Just my opinion....in your scenario, who does he replace and what role does he have on the team?

 

 

I don't think anyone is saying he's Barry Bonds or even a future All Star. We are saying that we think that he can be an improvement over Chris Gimenez, or a nice option as a 3rd catcher, backup 1B, part-time DH and also a bench bat. To me, he replaces Gimenez, and if they're not willing to deal Gimenez, he could take a spot of one of the relievers.

[Mike Sixel]

 

But see, that's just not true. The Twins could or even should have won two of the three games. And then other one was a 2-run game until after the weird delay.And that was without Miguel Sano for two of them.

 

This seems like an odd argument to make. When people point out that the Twins w-l record is over achieving, and isn't sustainable, they are told that the Twins w-l are what they are. Now, when they lose, we are told that they could or should have won, so we shouldn't believe the w-l record.

[Seth Stohs]

 

This seems like an odd argument to make. When people point out that the Twins w-l record is over achieving, and isn't sustainable, they are told that the Twins w-l are what they are. Now, when they lose, we are told that they could or should have won, so we shouldn't believe the w-l record.

 

Obviously winning and losing is what matters... but we're talking about a team that is 71-31, and the Twins should have won two of the three games. Maybe it's too simplistic, but the idea that if they had two more relievers they could rely upon, they could be much better. 

 

At the end of the day, they are now 49-51 or whatever they are and instead of being Buyers, they probably should be at least partial sellers. But it shouldn't be lost upon people that this team isn't terrible and they may not be all that far off. 

 

I don't think that's jumping too far.

[Otto von Ballpark]

But see, that's just not true. The Twins could or even should have won two of the three games. And then other one was a 2-run game until after the weird delay.And that was without Miguel Sano for two of them.

Do you also think the Twins could hang with the Yankees from 2003-2010?

[Willihammer]

For the record, I don't think they're terrible. They're way better than I expected them to be, but still a long ways off from doing anything in the playoffs. Every time we play a playoff team (Red Sox, Astros, Rockies, Dodgers) this becomes more clear.

[Mike Sixel]

I certainly agree that if they had two more RPs that were good, the team would be better. They don't have those players, though. And I agree they aren't terrible. 

[Otto von Ballpark]

How do you get "should have won"? Because they once led?

Edited July 27, 2017 by spycake

[drjim]

Garver, eh?

[Taildragger8791]

 

Obviously winning and losing is what matters... but we're talking about a team that is 71-31, and the Twins should have won two of the three games. Maybe it's too simplistic, but the idea that if they had two more relievers they could rely upon, they could be much better. 

 

At the end of the day, they are now 49-51 or whatever they are and instead of being Buyers, they probably should be at least partial sellers. But it shouldn't be lost upon people that this team isn't terrible and they may not be all that far off. 

 

I don't think that's jumping too far.

 

Saying they "should have won" kind of hand waves away the reasons they didn't win though. They lost because their starting pitching is wobbly and the bullpen is overworked and lacks both depth and high-end talent. Those are real flaws that they haven't been able to fix for too long now. Even the offense has been streaky and too dependant on performance from a few core hitters, lacking the depth to compensate when those guys occassionally can't come through. Over several games these things starkly separate us from the upper echelon teams and make it difficult to beat them consistently. I think that's all people are expressing here, not that they're outright terrible.

Edited July 27, 2017 by Taildragger8791

[Seth Stohs]

 

Saying they "should have won" kind of hand waves away the reasons they didn't win though. They lost because their starting pitching is wobbly and the bullpen is overworked and lacks both depth and high-end talent. Those are real flaws that they haven't been able to fix for too long now. Even the offense has been streaky and too dependant on performance from a few core hitters, lacking the depth to compensate when those guys occassionally can't come through. Over several games these things starkly separate us from the upper echelon teams and make it difficult to beat them consistently. I think that's all people are expressing here, not that they're outright terrible.

 

OK... maybe I should have worded it as "had an opportunity to win."

[Seth Stohs]

 

How do you get "should have won"? Because they once led?

 

Game 1... led until a 3-run homer allowed in the 8th inning.

Game 3... had a 5-0 lead, a 5-2 lead into the 7th... Had a lead until it was tied in the 8th and lost on a walkoff in the 9th. 

[Seth Stohs]

 

Do you also think the Twins could hang with the Yankees from 2003-2010?

 

Fully healthy, I'd take my chances, particularly 2005 and 2006. Sure.