Ryan: Sano to the OF

[HitInAPinch]

 

Many, including me, might say, that there is no time left to embrace Terry Ryan, and the ship for that sailed years ago. I too, am a Plouffe fan and don't want him traded, unless it is at the trade deadline and Sano has shown promise at third.

 

How is the pen looking these days?

 

I did not post "embrace Terry Ryan".  For many, that would be a waste of my time.  I was addressing those who keep posting things like "He's gotta trade Plouffe now" or "Ryan is just lying".  The man has done exactly what he said he was going to do:  Add offense to the team, but not at the cost of subtracting others.  Embrace the change and embrace the fact the Ryan did what he said he would.

 

The pen?  Still a lot of time before Spring Training and a fair amount of options.

[HitInAPinch]

Pioneer Press article by John Shipley, Nov. 9

 

http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_29092466/twins-win-negotiating-bid-korean-1b-byung-ho

 

 

[ashbury]

Plouffe should not block a stud like Sano.

What's blocking Sano at third is Sano's current defense at the position. By my own eye, and apparently by the on-field staff as well if they would consider moving the guy to the outfield.

[Mike Sixel]

I fail to see how potentially using in Sano means Plouffe is blocking him. There is an opening in RF. The FO thinks Sano can play RF. They would not be the first FO to do this with a player like Sano. No one is doing anything here other than trying to ADD to the team's ability to win games. No one is "blocking" Sano over ability or personality. The FO thinks that Sano fits in RF better than Plouffe or Mauer or Park or whomever else.....and the FO thinks having those 4 together is better than having three of them and someone else. Nothing more or less is being done here.

[ashbury]

Raise your hand if you've ever seen Sano track down an outfield fly ball?  

I have seen Sano have difficulty tracking down a foul popup at third. The two skills aren't identical but I would think there's some overlap.

 

I don't expect him to be better at it in the outfield than at third. The working theory the team's apparently going with is that it will hurt the team less in the outfield than at third, while not relegating him to DH at such a young age and with first base still occupado.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

I have seen Sano have difficulty tracking down a foul popup at third. The two skills aren't identical but I would think there's some overlap.

 

I don't expect him to be better at it in the outfield than at third. The working theory the team's apparently going with is that it will hurt the team less in the outfield than at third, while not relegating him to DH at such a young age and with first base still occupado.

You're getting warmer. For some people, it's not just that Sano is going to the outfield, it's the bigger picture. Like that the young guys in this situation (Sano, Arcia) continue to get the short end of the stick in favor of veterans. Or that we are having selective memory about how terrible Plouffe was in the field for so long and maybe Sano can learn 3B quickly. Or that maybe Park turns out to be a better option at 1B than Mauer---I already think Vargas might be. Maybe Mauer should be the DH going forward. I'm not dead set against moving Sano to RF by any stretch, but I am SMH a little.

[gmarais66]

How many other 270-pound outfielders are there in MLB?

[sane09]

On the Twins' website roster, the infielders' section lists Santana and Sano; and the outfielders' section lists Escobar.

WHY?

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

On the Twins' website roster, the infielders' section lists Santana and Sano; and the outfielders' section lists Escobar.

WHY?

That looks like an 0-3

[Rosterman]

Who would be betetr at third, Plouffe or Sano? Hich of the two would have the better arm from either side of the outfield? I don't see arcia as being just a fourth outfielder/bench bat, but unless the Twins can showcase him in some ways, he ahs no value as tradebait unless packaged with someone (even Nolasco?). Rosario could be Santana in his second year. But, that is what spring training is for, right?

[sane09]

How many other 270-pound outfielders are there in MLB?

Not many right now, but Dmitri Young was 6'-2" 295# and Walter Young was 6'-5" 320#.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

On the Twins' website roster, the infielders' section lists Santana and Sano; and the outfielders' section lists Escobar.

WHY?

At some point earlier this season, Escobar had played more outfield than infield. That's when I first noticed him in the OF section. They probably just haven't bothered to correct it since. I remember Chris Herrmann was usually listed as an OF too, until 2015.

[tobi0040]

 

The Twins could also trade Plouffe midyear, or next year. For more or less return depending on how he does. By then we may know if Sano can be a outfielder, or if Park can hit in the MLB, or if Mauer rebounds, or if Murphy is a MLB average catcher. If one of those things is still a question make, you still can trade Plouffe  to solve it. Right now he's not bring in an ace starter and relievers seem low. 

 

The mid-year thing makes sense.  Kepler may have emerged, we can see Sano in the OF, Park vs. MLB pitchers, etc.  I

 

I don't see how Mauer or Ryan play into it though.  Mauer is the 1B and not moving to catcher and Ryan will take time from Kurt if he performs. 

[DJL44]

There aren't many 270 pound third basemen either. 270 pound guys are rare in baseball. A quick baseball reference PI search turned up 8 people and I'm guessing most are pitchers (Broxton, Colon, Sabathia).

 

Babe Ruth was a pretty big guy and he didn't have much trouble in RF.

[big dog]

During spring training of 2014, there had been only 34 hitters weighing more than 250 pounds in the major leagues since 1920 (Wall St Journal article).   How many of them were 3rd basemen?  It's not a useful comparison to look at this by position.

[sane09]

Size alone can't keep Sano out of the outfield. If it slows him down, THAT could be the determining factor.

I saw Anthony Munoz (NFL HOF Offensive Tackle) play baseball at Chaffey HS (CA) and USC (on a National Championship team) at 6'6" 285# and he was incredibly quick for a behemoth. In those days, even O-lineman were seldom that big. He pitched, played a slew of positions and ran better than anyone else on his HS baseball team. He might have been a catcher, but the plate umpire wouldn't be able to see the strike zone. If Sano is that quick (questionable?), he could be a very good outfielder

[gmarais66]

Anyone who thinks a 270-pound outfielder, who has never played outfield before, is anything but a significant defensive liability, really needs to set down the glass of kool aid, remove their rose-colored glasses and take a good hard look at reality. Last winter, people were complaining about how Torii Hunter was going to be a defensive liability, and he was a former gold-glover, who at age 40 was still faster than Sano... People also complain all the time about how terrible Arcia is in the outfield and he's been playing out there his whole career. It would be a heck of a foot race between Sano and Arcia... And do I even have to bring up Josh Willingham? The Twins made exceptional improvement to their outfield defense last season and it was fun to watch. I for one can't see how putting Sano in the outfield is going to do anything but significantly hurt the outfield defense and remind us how miserable it was to watch the 2014 and 2013 Twins' outfielders.

[Mike Sixel]

That explains why every report I'm looking at looks behind now....rose colored glasses!

[zchrz]

You need to maximize a talent like Sano, that bat at 3rd is a major advantage over most (eventually all?) other teams in the league.  TR seems set that to maximize the offense Plouffe needs to be involved but his bat is league average for 3rd and slightly below average for a corner outfield spot.  To really maximize the offense Sano should be at 3rd and an above average bat should be acquired for the corner outfield spot.  That leaves Plouffe out in the cold but there are some spots in the pitching staff that could definitely use some warming. 

 

Pure nonsense dream but how good would Alex Gordon look on this team?  Who is a more Twins-able player that could be had for left or right (Aoiki might be a nice cheap end fix?. 

[Kwak]

My how perceptions have changed--not long ago most were posting what a great all-around athlete Sano is (and that surely he will be fine at 3B) and now he is reduced to a lumbering ox and can't play the OF (but will still excel at 3B).   That hamstring problem he had last season suggests to me that Sano will battle injuries often.

[sane09]

Anyone who thinks a 270-pound outfielder, who has never played outfield before, is anything but a significant defensive liability, really needs to set down the glass of kool aid, remove their rose-colored glasses and take a good hard look at reality

If he "has never played outfield before", he will be the first baseball player to claim that. And how can you decide in advance, with no evidence, that he would be "a significant defensive liability", when baseball men, who have actually seen him play countless games and practices disagree? You don't know that!

[Physics Guy]

Anyone who thinks a 270-pound outfielder, who has never played outfield before, is anything but a significant defensive liability, really needs to set down the glass of kool aid, remove their rose-colored glasses and take a good hard look at reality.

I'll take rose-colored any day over your black and white view. Things aren't nearly as cut and dried as you are making them out to be. You are certainly entitled to believe he can't play out there. I'll wait until he's actually tried it before I form an opinion.

[Major League Ready]

I just don’t think it is wise to form the staunch opinions found here with less than complete information.

At first I thought Sano to the OF was just a ploy.  However, we have not seen much of Sano at 3B.  It is quite possible that the Twins talent evaluators are convinced he will be a defensively liability at 3B.  If this is the case, experimenting with him in the OF does not seem likely nearly as bad idea of an idea.  It also makes a big difference for me in terms of retaining Plouffe or trading him.

 

In most cases I would look at his size and say no way but he looks quite a bit faster than faster than Mauer and Arcia, and waaaaay faster than Plouffe or Willingham.   Is he really 270.  Even 250 is quite a bit different than 270.  LeBron is 250 and I am pretty sure he has the athleticism to play a corner OF position.  No doubt his physique should not facilitate great athleticism but the eye test suggests he is an anomaly.  I would love to see stop watch comparisons between him and some of the others we have mentioned.

 

[DocBauer]

I am, at this point, not saying anything "yea" or "nay" to the prospect of Sano moving to the OF. But, just for the sake of argument, (since it's been mentioned a time or two here and there), those of us a bit older may remember the likes of Danny Tartabull and Gary Sheffield. Tartabull was a HS SS I do believe, who moved to 2B fairly quickly, and then the OF, while Sheffield was also a SS who moved to 3B and then the OF. Both moved very successfully overall, offensively and defensively. More recently, Alex Gordon was drafted and initially developed as a 3B before  being moved to the OF.

 

Just a few examples to toss out there of top picks, top prospects, top bats who transitioned from the infield to the OF.

[h2oface]

 

Harmon Killebrew was able to play 3B and outfield.  Sano seems at least as athletic as Harmon.

 

Wellllll....... just because you play someone in the outfield, it doesn't necessarily mean they were able to play outfield, at least well. Delmon Young played the outfield. Chris Colabello played first and outfield. Escobar played in the outfield. It truly is an unknown at this point, and just chatter. I don't remember Harmon to be a monster outfielder 1962-64 in his 26-28 year old seasons. But at the plate he had three great years - some of the best of his career, but I was only 7-9 years old, and he could do nothing wrong in my eyes. I would hate to see Sano never have the chance to see how well he would do and how fast he might improve at third base.

[sane09]

I just don’t think it is wise to form the staunch opinions found here with less than complete information.

In most cases I would look at his size and say no way but he looks quite a bit faster than Mauer and Arcia, and waaaaay faster than Plouffe or Willingham.   Is he really 270.  Even 250 is quite a bit different than 270.  LeBron is 250 and I am pretty sure he has the athleticism to play a corner OF position.   I would love to see stop watch comparisons between him and some of the others we have mentioned.

Twins Website roster lists Sano at 6-4 260 and Arcia at 6-0 225. If you add 4" to your height and 35# to your weight, are you then too heavy to play LF/RF? I don't think so.

[h2oface]

I wonder how far Buxton would bounce if Sano and he collided as they both are running full speed to get a fly ball?

[nytwinsfan]

Speaking of the devil:  http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/instagraphs/this-is-grainy-footage-of-miguel-sano-homering-minutes-ago/

 

Love the outstretched left arm and bat, but he should have held it out there for a few moments longer. Next time.

 

BTW, my intuition just tells me that Sano and Park are going to get along great. I can feel it.

[sane09]

Speaking of the devil:  [url=http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/instagraphs/this-is-grainy-footage-of-miguel-sano-homering-minutes-ago/]http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/instagraphs/

 

BTW, my intuition just tells me that Sano and Park are going to get along great. I can feel it.

If you take them out to dinner, bring your check-book.

[ashbury]

 Is he really 270.  Even 250 is quite a bit different than 270. 

I have no idea what the exact number. But the guy is fit.