3 Roster Moves the Twins Need to Make Right Now

[HarmonK03]

1 minute ago, bean5302 said:

Tell that to MiLB/MLB

The later transaction is the rehab assignment, so do they consider him on the active roster when he is on a rehab assignment.

[Mike Sixel]

3 minutes ago, ashbury said:

Angel Genao has 2000 plate appearances in the minors.  Walker Jenkins has 1104.

There is a lot that goes into these decisions.

The point people are making is that you shouldn't call up a rookie right now because of the lockout and service time. Sure, there are other things....but clearly at least 4 teams don't care about those things as much as people here seem to think they should. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

2 minutes ago, ashbury said:

Angel Genao has 2000 plate appearances in the minors.  Walker Jenkins has 1104.

There is a lot that goes into these decisions.

He was also already on their 40 man roster because he was an international prospect. So he will be locked out from coaches no matter what next year if a lockout occurs. 

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

He was also already on their 40 man roster because he was an international prospect. So he will be locked out from coaches no matter what next year if a lockout occurs. 

As I pointed out. But he's still now not a rookie next year now. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

Just now, Mike Sixel said:

The point people are making is that you shouldn't call up a rookie right now because of the lockout and service time. Sure, there are other things....but clearly at least 4 teams don't care about those things as much as people here seem to think they should. 

3 teams - 2 with high odds at World Series. Cleveland doesn’t count because he’s already locked out. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 minute ago, Mike Sixel said:

As I pointed out. But he's still now not a rookie next year now. 

Less than 60 games I believe he will still be a rookie. 

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

Less than 60 games I believe he will still be a rookie. 

You don't think he'll get enough ABs?

[Linus]

The offense will likely need a jolt as the first half production was based on a really high batting avg with RISP. As far as who to bring up?  It’s a safe bet KC would produce more than Kreidler with the bat. Ironically the guy who could give us potentially the biggest jolt is Wallner. I know that opinion is unpopular but he has the potential to hit a dozen home runs in the next 7 weeks. He also has the potential to fall flat on his face and I would mostly DH him. 
One of the consequences of “going for it” is a whole bunch of roster moves just got a lot trickier. This org is going to prioritize the veterans as long as they think we have a chance. So lots of guys that we need to find out about are not likely to get much of a chance barring injury. If Jeffers, Bell and Larnach had been traded we would be sliding guys in easily and finding out who is going to be valuable to us going forward. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

Just now, Mike Sixel said:

You don't think he'll get enough ABs?

It’s 45 games. So yes you were right. Still not the primary point. 

[DJL44]

18 minutes ago, clone52 said:

"probably as good as Roden"?  Seriously.  I'm 44, overweight but was a bench player on a small HS baseball team.  I could probably match his OPS+

Roden had a 909 OPS in St Paul this season in 151 PA. Jenkins has an 831 OPS in 233 PA at the same level. 
 

I will bet Jenkins has the better career, but right now they’re basically the same player. Good control of the strike zone, good contact and not enough power. Jenkins has a little more speed but they’re not calling him up to sit on the bench and pinch run.

[chpettit19]

43 minutes ago, clone52 said:

I have tickets to the Field of Dreams game on 8/13.  Please call them up before then.

I thought about going to that game but decided against it. It should be a blast, though. Hope you enjoy!

[ashbury]

54 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

The point people are making is that you shouldn't call up a rookie right now because of the lockout and service time. 

That just means I disagree with different people for different reasons.  😄  At least, if they consider any single factor the only one that matters.

Analogy time: Kirby Puckett was brought up in May 1984 and batted .296 the rest of the season.  That was great, but aside from that it was an empty .296 because he hit literally 0 homers, and he scored runs at a rate of 80 per year for his first two seasons (which is pretty pedestrian, nothing that leads a team into contention).  It was only in 1986 that he hit 31 homers, scored 119, and became the KIR-BEEE PUCKETT!!! we all remember and love.

The economics of the game were different then than now.  The Twins were able to sign Puckett to extensions keeping him a Twin for life.  What are the odds we'll be able to do that with Jenkins?  He's projected to have good major league power, but it hasn't come in yet, and at age 21 no one is fretting about that.  If it turns out that we get 6 seasons and then he moves on, do we want those seasons to include two of the type that Kirby launched his career with?  If it's just a matter of waiting for his man-muscles to finish developing, what's the smart move?

Lockout, 6-year window, RoY considerations, current need versus future, where he's at in his development cycle after 1100 PA - all these factors play a role in deciding what to do.  

I am reasonably analytic but consider myself nowhere near qualified to second-guess what this (or any) FO must routinely decide about such matters.  And I can't help pushing back a bit when people indicate that they think they are.

[darin617]

2 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

As much as I want to see Jenkins, I'm promoting EMMA as soon as he plays three games in a row w/o being hurt. ASAP, and putting him in C or L, with Larnach at DH. 

I agree 100% with you. Emmanuel Rodriguez is already on the 40 man roster and will be out of options after this season. So they have nothing to lose getting a look at him.

I'm not sure if most people understand Jenkins and Culpepper are both hanging around .270. That's not exactly very impressive against minor league pitching. Give them some more time.

[darin617]

7 hours ago, Twins GFP said:

No to the Jackson move... I think the Twins see him as the backup next year. I can't see him passing through waivers with the way he has played this year.

While there is no guarantee that players will accrue service time during the lockout, I can't see the Twins risking that on those two at this point.

When Jenkins is called up, he needs to play every day. I don't think the Twins will do that for him right now. 

Jenkins also struggles against lefties so he will still be platooning.

[Mike Sixel]

3 minutes ago, darin617 said:

Jenkins also struggles against lefties so he will still be platooning.

Any team that platoons a top 10 propsect should be folded and their players sent to other teams.

[HarmonK03]

45 minutes ago, darin617 said:

I agree 100% with you. Emmanuel Rodriguez is already on the 40 man roster and will be out of options after this season. So they have nothing to lose getting a look at him.

I'm not sure if most people understand Jenkins and Culpepper are both hanging around .270. That's not exactly very impressive against minor league pitching. Give them some more time.

So what is the magic number they need to be at to be called up.

[TJSweens]

5 hours ago, HarmonK03 said:

Kriedler is not a CF and can not hit enough.  You would hold back Jenkins for Kriedler that makes no sense.

I'm not saying hold back Jenkins for Kriedler. I'm saying I would like to see more consistency out of Jenkins before he is called up.

[DJL44]

53 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

So what is the magic number they need to be at to be called up.

10 HR in AAA

[HarmonK03]

Just now, DJL44 said:

10 HR in AAA

That is just an arbitrary number that means little.  By that definition Kirby would never have made it to Minnesota in time for the World Series.

[DJL44]

1 minute ago, HarmonK03 said:

That is just an arbitrary number that means little.  By that definition Kirby would never have made it to Minnesota in time for the World Series.

You asked for an arbitrary number 

[HarmonK03]

Just now, DJL44 said:

You asked for an arbitrary number 

That was in a response to someone giving an arbitrary number, context matters.

[clone52]

3 hours ago, DJL44 said:

Roden had a 909 OPS in St Paul this season in 151 PA. Jenkins has an 831 OPS in 233 PA at the same level. 
 

I will bet Jenkins has the better career, but right now they’re basically the same player. Good control of the strike zone, good contact and not enough power. Jenkins has a little more speed but they’re not calling him up to sit on the bench and pinch run.

What is Roden's career OPS.  Look it up.

[Dave Lemke]

3 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

As I pointed out. But he's still now not a rookie next year now. 

Could be! Depends on how long he stays on 26 man roster and number of plate appearances. As long as he doesn't cross the threshold he would still be a rookie next year.

 

[Mike Sixel]

2 minutes ago, Dave Lemke said:

Could be! Depends on how long he stays on 26 man roster and number of plate appearances. As long as he doesn't cross the threshold he would still be a rookie next year.

 

Why would they call him up, if not to play him? Sure, stuff could happen, but do we really think that's the plan?

[darin617]

2 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

Any team that platoons a top 10 propsect should be folded and their players sent to other teams.

So you would put him out there and let him struggle?  Jenkins is hitting like .275 or so in the minors. That's not exactly crushing it. I would rather wait until he is ripping up AAA pitchers. You bring him up now and he struggles how does that help his development.

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, darin617 said:

So you would put him out there and let him struggle?  Jenkins is hitting like .275 or so in the minors. That's not exactly crushing it. I would rather wait until he is ripping up AAA pitchers. You bring him up now and he struggles how does that help his development.

I'm not sure I said call him up in that post? 

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, Mike Sixel said:

I'm not sure I said call him up in that post? 

But yes, if you call him up, he plays every day. You do not platoon guys you want to be stars. Ever. 

[darin617]

1 hour ago, HarmonK03 said:

So what is the magic number they need to be at to be called up.

So what would .270 in the minors equal to in the majors? .200 or so. 

I would like to see them hitting at least .300 and playing every day.

[Dave Lemke]

20 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Why would they call him up, if not to play him? Sure, stuff could happen, but do we really think that's the plan?

Maybe he comes up and struggles and they send him back down. Maybe he gets hurt. Lots of things can happen. Biggest thing is he was already on 40 man. Jenkins and Culpepper are not.

 

 

[Riverbrian]

3 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

The point people are making is that you shouldn't call up a rookie right now because of the lockout and service time. Sure, there are other things....but clearly at least 4 teams don't care about those things as much as people here seem to think they should. 

It's a consideration. None of us know if it's a legitimate consideration... a large one or a small one. It's a consideration. How much weight do you place on CBA outcomes. It's a consideration.. This decision isn't a singular consideration. There are a bunch of considerations. 

A decision to purchase his contract 16 Months before R5 Status in December 27 is a big decision. To potentially have him free agent eligible at age 27 is a big decision. How to time his 6 years of control for the majority of his BEST YEARS. Should you do that if you could? Does that matter? Is he ready to rock right now!!!. Will he burn a couple of years getting ready? Does Scott Harris have the job security for 3 or 4 years to make a 3 or 4 years down the road decision on Clark or is it the length of his contract time table? Can the Yankees afford to not worry about such things? Nuance all over the place with the weight of sledgehammers.

With a Fedko... Oh Well... With a Jenkins... It's a big deal.