Tonkin DFA'd

[Mike Sixel]

 

While I agree it is too early to make any conclusive judgments on the new front office's performance, I think they are getting a bit too much credit here for making "quick cuts".

.....

 

It's still early, but I am concerned that the new regime hasn't taken a decidedly different roster approach than the old regime -- moving Duffey semi-permanently to short relief in the pen, Belisle, Breslow, Haley, Tepesch, Rucinski -- these are all very "old front office" style moves to assemble a pitching staff.  I understand some prospects aren't quite ready, and Tepesch/Rucinski are pretty standard AAA depth types around the league, but I am disappointed that a greater effort wasn't made to add better MLB pieces this offseason to address/avoid this scenario.

 

Trimmed to save space......

 

Agreed. This FO has done nothing much the old one didn't. They signed terrible, old, RPs. They um, did nothing else other than Castro really. I'm not sure why they are getting so much credit for not really making the team any better. 

 

I'm not going to judge them yet, but I don't see much evidence they are into actively rebuilding any more than the old FO was.

[drjim]

I won't ding them for their AAA depth signings, but the poor mlb relief pieces they added this offseason is easily their biggest mistake. Really no reason not to aim higher, both for more wins now and potentially better value added if flipped.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I won't ding them for their AAA depth signings, but the poor mlb relief pieces they added this offseason is easily their biggest mistake. Really no reason not to aim higher, both for more wins now and potentially better value added if flipped.

 

Right, that's the area where, IMO, it is obvious they could have gone a different / better route.

 

We can disagree on the speed of AA promotions of RPs, but the information asymmetry is much greater there.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I won't ding them for their AAA depth signings, but the poor mlb relief pieces they added this offseason is easily their biggest mistake. Really no reason not to aim higher, both for more wins now and potentially better value added if flipped.

Yup.  I have no problem with signing Tepesch and Rucinski for AAA depth.

 

Problem is, they aimed so low at the MLB level, they "needed" to call on Tepesch and Rucinski so early, for completely predictable reasons.

 

Individually, rostering Haley, keeping Tonkin, signing Belisle, and signing Breslow could have each been defensible moves.  But the combination of all of them, to pair with already modest pen holdovers in Kintzler, Pressly, etc. -- that was clearly poor planning.

[drjim]

 

Yup.  I have no problem with signing Tepesch and Rucinski for AAA depth.

 

Problem is, they aimed so low at the MLB level, they "needed" to call on Tepesch and Rucinski so early, for completely predictable reasons.

 

Individually, rostering Haley, keeping Tonkin, signing Belisle, and signing Breslow could have each been defensible moves.  But the combination of all of them, to pair with already modest pen holdovers in Kintzler, Pressly, etc. -- that was clearly poor planning.

 

If they had signed legitimate relievers from the outset, the flux of the 5th-7(8)th guys in the pen would have been much less of a deal. Heck, they might even be more willing to rush a guy from AA and hide him for a month or two.

[TheLeviathan]

The worst part is all these relievers we're talking about signed for relatively modest contracts.  If they had been wildly overpaid that would be one thing, but Holland/Storen/Feliz made relatively little and they could've had a large impact on this team. 

[lukeduke1980]

 

Right, that's the area where, IMO, it is obvious they could have gone a different / better route.

 

We can disagree on the speed of AA promotions of RPs, but the information asymmetry is much greater there.

Is there any hope that the inaction in the offseason might mean there's optimism from the front office in regards to the quality of the relievers in AA?  Just letting them gain a couple month's confidence before bringing them up?

 

[Mike Sixel]

 

Is there any hope that the inaction in the offseason might mean there's optimism from the front office in regards to the quality of the relievers in AA?  Just letting them gain a couple month's confidence before bringing them up?

 

Sure, if that's the plan. Like I said, we don't know.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Is there any hope that the inaction in the offseason might mean there's optimism from the front office in regards to the quality of the relievers in AA?  Just letting them gain a couple month's confidence before bringing them up?

Not really.  The same theory was used to justify inaction by the previous regime.  And the big thing we've heard about the new leadership is that they're going to take some time to assess the organization -- I doubt they had collected enough info about our various scuffling/injured AA relievers in their first months on the job to cause them to hold back on the MLB FA market.  Especially when signing a better reliever simply would have bumped the last guy like Haley or Breslow off the totem pole, and wouldn't have done much of anything to hold back or block the AA guys.  (And the modest contracts awarded to Holland, Storen, Feliz, etc. weren't really an obstacle either.)

 

And frankly, the new front office wasn't completely inactive -- they added ~4 guys to the current pen. Just a disappointing combination of guys.

[Brandon]

 

While I agree it is too early to make any conclusive judgments on the new front office's performance, I think they are getting a bit too much credit here for making "quick cuts".

 

Sure, we all remember the embarrassing Kubel/Bartlett reunion tour, but otherwise in recent years, I think the old regime regularly made similarly timed cuts as the new regime has been doing.  Almost exactly a year ago, Milone, Fien, Graham, and O'Rourke were all dropped.  A year before that, Milone was optioned ahead of Trevor May.  Tim Stauffer went on the DL on May 1st that year, later came off the DL for 3 weeks and was cut.  Oswaldo Arcia survived until June 17 last year, but it was only his first year out of options, and the team was basically out of the race 2 weeks into the season so it didn't really hurt to give him extra rope as compared to Danny Santana this season.  The old front office didn't cut Tonkin, but Tonkin was actually pretty effective (albeit in low-leverage work) up through TR's firing last year, so there was no real reason to cut him.

 

It's still early, but I am concerned that the new regime hasn't taken a decidedly different roster approach than the old regime -- moving Duffey semi-permanently to short relief in the pen, Belisle, Breslow, Haley, Tepesch, Rucinski -- these are all very "old front office" style moves to assemble a pitching staff.  I understand some prospects aren't quite ready, and Tepesch/Rucinski are pretty standard AAA depth types around the league, but I am disappointed that a greater effort wasn't made to add better MLB pieces this offseason to address/avoid this scenario.

 

keep in mind the old regime pretty much put the pieces in place for our current run minus 2 relievers and 2 catchers.  We are on pace to win over 90 games this season.  Right now our questions are who will be our 5th starter?  can we get some bullpen reinforcements either from the minors or by trade?  and one more hitter to protect Sano would be nice.  but I'm not sure where that hitter would go unless its either Joe Mauer heating up or a new first basemen with Mauer going to the bench.

[DaveW]

And going forward, I don't want to see this strategy employed... but they're taking over a bad team that they didn't build. I don't fault them for taking some time to get to know some of the players more thoroughly and get a better idea of what the team will look like going forward.

 

If they do the same thing next offseason, groan. I can't and won't support that idea.

I fault them for doing zero to fix the bullpen. Nobody asked them to go out and overpay for Chapman or someone. But they easily could have gotten a Holland type guy or two.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I fault them for doing zero to fix the bullpen. Nobody asked them to go out and overpay for Chapman or someone. But they easily could have gotten a Holland type guy or two.

And I agree with that. The lack of established bullpen arms was my biggest gripe with the offseason.

[DaveW]

And I agree with that. The lack of established bullpen arms was my biggest gripe with the offseason.

IMO it's a pretty large gripe.

 

The good news is that it's not super hard to et solid 7th inning type guys at the deadline, hopefully they can hold together until July for now.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

IMO it's a pretty large gripe.

The good news is that it's not super hard to et solid 7th inning type guys at the deadline, hopefully they can hold together until July for now.

It's a somewhat large gripe simply in the context that I didn't expect (or even really want) the front office to pursue anyone else in free agency. The rotation pickings were absurdly thin and the Twins lineup needed space to let the young guys play.

 

Which is why I'm happy the team didn't get Napoli.

[ashbury]

If it was reported elsewhere on the site, I missed it, but Tonkin cleared waivers and is reporting to Rochester. Looking forward to seeing some shutdown innings in AAA.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/05/minor-mlb-transactions-51317.html

[Richie the Rally Goat]

keep in mind the old regime pretty much put the pieces in place for our current run minus 2 relievers and 2 catchers. We are on pace to win over 90 games this season. Right now our questions are who will be our 5th starter? can we get some bullpen reinforcements either from the minors or by trade? and one more hitter to protect Sano would be nice. but I'm not sure where that hitter would go unless its either Joe Mauer heating up or a new first basemen with Mauer going to the bench.

or they are 4 games over .500 and on pace to win 86.

 

If you think the only needs are a 5th starter, a couple of bullpen pieces and a bench bat, then why have they lost 90 games per season for 5 of the last 6 years?

 

The pitching is aweful, 2/5 of the rotation and 3/8 of the relievers have no business on any big league club. 5/13 are terrible and they're carrying 13 pitchers because of that.

 

I can't see this pace keep up, not with this pitching staff.

[Linus]

Alright. So now we know what the rest of the league thinks of Tonkin. Wish him the best.

[old nurse]

 

or they are 4 games over .500 and on pace to win 86.

If you think the only needs are a 5th starter, a couple of bullpen pieces and a bench bat, then why have they lost 90 games per season for 5 of the last 6 years?

The pitching is aweful, 2/5 of the rotation and 3/8 of the relievers have no business on any big league club. 5/13 are terrible and they're carrying 13 pitchers because of that.

I can't see this pace keep up, not with this pitching staff.

The state of pitching is such that Tommy Milone is starting games for the Mets, Pelrfey for the White Sox,  Relief pitching, Duensing is still on a roster, Matt Capps is finally not on a roster.

[Brandon]

Neshek could likely be had for a prospect. He could help our pen.

[Brandon]

or they are 4 games over .500 and on pace to win 86.

 

If you think the only needs are a 5th starter, a couple of bullpen pieces and a bench bat, then why have they lost 90 games per season for 5 of the last 6 years?

 

The pitching is aweful, 2/5 of the rotation and 3/8 of the relievers have no business on any big league club. 5/13 are terrible and they're carrying 13 pitchers because of that.

 

I can't see this pace keep up, not with this pitching staff.

We were 5 when i wrote that. Also why are we better now then last year. Answer maturing young players and Santana. Young players can get better with experience. I am assuming Berrios is up for good and solid.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

The state of pitching is such that Tommy Milone is starting games for the Mets, Pelrfey for the White Sox, Relief pitching, Duensing is still on a roster, Matt Capps is finally not on a roster.

good point, but there's a big difference between the mets utilizing scrap heap in a get-me-by until Harvey comes back and the Twins who started the season that way