Twins 2019 Position Analysis: Designated Hitter

DocBauer · March 15, 2019

I will admit Cruz wasn't my ideal signing. I have always believed you put together the best player roster you can for production, depth and versatility. TK was pretty successful largely, not having a fixture at DH. In today's game, with expanded pitching staffs, it becomes even harder to carry a "bat" no matter how productive. But I love Cruz on board for his bat as well as his professional influence on the lineup and the young players on hand. (Something Falvey spoke of weeks before he was signed).

I have always been a proponent for the DH, as well as a lover of the NL game. And that is not a dicotemy. Never been a fan of asking pitchers to hit. It's like asking a kicker or QB to block and tackle. I never thought the NL game was interesting via strategy of PH. You're down and the pitcher is up? Oh my, what do I do? No. It was about the concepts of hit and run and speed, especially considering that, for a time at least, it seemed the AL parks and NL parks were not only different sized, but there were turf vs grass issues.

Sometimes what was old suddenly becomes new again. What's wrong with a roster where you can play to power...the IN thing...but also "surprise" the opposition with speed and some situational ball?

I think Cruz will pay big dividends the next year or two. But your best roster/lineup is 12/13 guys who can play and hit and you roll through the DH spot for days and half days off. I like Cruz and think we will benefit. But I think we are on the precipice of not needing a "designated bat" on the roster.

diehardtwinsfan · March 15, 2019

I think the why is pretty straight forward. He's not going to the NL, and there weren't many teams with a gaping hole at DH in the AL.

This is a good fit... now let's hope that father time is kind enough to let him play at a high level for 2 more years.

rdehring · March 15, 2019

Wasn't a fan of the Cruz signing at the time everyone was gushing over his possible signing. My fear was that last year's decline in production would continue. If that does occur, his performance is going to be very average.

Since the signing, however, I have warmed to it mostly because of what I have learned about what he contributes on the bench and off the field.

jmlease1 · March 15, 2019

I think there are also increasing numbers of teams who don't want to fill their DH slot with a guy who can't play in the field if they don't have to, so that probably reduced his market a little as well, along with the fears of aging, price tag, etc. But production still speaks, and there's no reason to think Cruz can't be an excellent DH for this team this year and possibly next year as well. And with his clubhouse reputation, he should be a benefit to a relatively young team in other ways as well.

There's plenty of franchise depth for this spot: Sano could move in there easily, Austin is a good fit if the team finds a way to keep him around, Cron could shift in if they decide they don't like his defense but he keeps on hitting, Rooker might be ready for extended MLB time soon...lots of options.

I think if Cruz hits over 30 hrs and puts up another OPS of .850 or so, he'll be back for another run. It'd be hard to complain about that.

Mr. Brooks · March 15, 2019

I will admit Cruz wasn't my ideal signing. I have always believed you put together the best player roster you can for production, depth and versatility. TK was pretty successful largely, not having a fixture at DH. In today's game, with expanded pitching staffs, it becomes even harder to carry a "bat" no matter how productive. But I love Cruz on board for his bat as well as his professional influence on the lineup and the young players on hand. (Something Falvey spoke of weeks before he was signed).

I have always been a proponent for the DH, as well as a lover of the NL game. And that is not a dicotemy. Never been a fan of asking pitchers to hit. It's like asking a kicker or QB to block and tackle. I never thought the NL game was interesting via strategy of PH. You're down and the pitcher is up? Oh my, what do I do? No. It was about the concepts of hit and run and speed, especially considering that, for a time at least, it seemed the AL parks and NL parks were not only different sized, but there were turf vs grass issues.

Sometimes what was old suddenly becomes new again. What's wrong with a roster where you can play to power...the IN thing...but also "surprise" the opposition with speed and some situational ball?

I think Cruz will pay big dividends the next year or two. But your best roster/lineup is 12/13 guys who can play and hit and you roll through the DH spot for days and half days off. I like Cruz and think we will benefit. But I think we are on the precipice of not needing a "designated bat" on the roster.

I couldn't disagree more.

DH is a position. It's a position that doesn't require any defensive abilities or versatility.

You wouldn't pass up adding a great centerfielder because he can't pitch an inning in a blowout. That would be absurd, because that's not the job of a centerfielder.

To steal another posters analogy, if you are hiring a CEO, you don't pass on the best one, just because he doesn't know how to work the assembly line.

USAFChief · March 15, 2019

I couldn't disagree more.
DH is a position. It's a position that doesn't require any defensive abilities or versatility.
You wouldn't pass up adding a great centerfielder because he can't pitch an inning in a blowout. That would be absurd, because that's not the job of a centerfielder.

To steal another posters analogy, if you are hiring a CEO, you don't pass on the best one, just because he doesn't know how to work the assembly line.

Concur.

And not only is it a position, having a better one than the team you're playing gives you an advantage, just like having the better starting pitcher, or better right fielder. The advantage is limited to the offensive side, but nonetheless, it's an advantage.

Mike Sixel · March 15, 2019

I couldn't disagree more.
DH is a position. It's a position that doesn't require any defensive abilities or versatility.
You wouldn't pass up adding a great centerfielder because he can't pitch an inning in a blowout. That would be absurd, because that's not the job of a centerfielder.

To steal another posters analogy, if you are hiring a CEO, you don't pass on the best one, just because he doesn't know how to work the assembly line.

Terrible analogy, because there isn't a 25 person limit outside sports.

That said, it's their best move of an otherwise underwhelming off-season.

puckstopper1 · March 15, 2019

Not seeing the Twins trot out Robbie Grossman as their DH this season is a big win in my book!

howieramone2 · March 15, 2019

Terrible analogy, because there isn't a 25 person limit outside sports.

That said, it's their best move of an otherwise underwhelming off-season.

A very solid off-season! Did you know for the first time in the history of TD, the board has embraced not one, but two signings? Cruz and Gonzalez. Big step forward for the board. The I'm smarter than the FO clique can not be happy at all.

Edited March 15, 2019 by howieramone2

chpettit19 · March 15, 2019

I think Cruz has earned the benefit of the doubt by leading all of major league baseball in HRs over the last 5 years while hitting in one of the worst HR hitting parks in the game. I don't think 40 HRs is an unreasonable expectation of him this year. That being said, unless you're really convinced he's fallen off a cliff and we're looking at LoMo 2.0 I don't get why anyone would be against this signing, or how him not being able to play any defense is really a negative thing. How is the "flexibility" to rotate lesser hitters through the lineup to give them "half days off" a better option than plugging an elite bat into the heart of your order every day? You can only play 8 defensive guys each day. You're not subbing your DH into the game to play a position ever. If someone is too tired to play the field give them the day off and let them just relax while we put the best hitter we have in at DH and watch him launch balls into the second deck in left or over the batters eye in center.

Now if the plan was for Cron, or Austin, or someone like that to be your everyday DH then I can understand frustration. But as of now Cruz is the best hitter on this team. Being able to plug him in everyday without question should be an unquestioned good thing. I don't get why anyone would prefer Buxton's bat in the lineup while he's not playing center, or Kepler's, or literally anyone else on this team. If the goal is to put your 8 best fielders and 9 best hitters out there as often as possible, having a DH only who is your best hitter isn't a bad thing since you get an "extra" hitter. I think the bigger reason you see fewer "DH only" types is because there are fewer guys who can hit and can't field. We're seeing the elite bats be guys who field well, and even be up the middle guys. Boston seemed to do alright with Ortiz as a DH only, and now with JD as a DH only.

Dantes929 · March 15, 2019

"Only once in my lifetime have the Twins signed a more accomplished hitter as a free agent, and it worked out supremely well. Can Cruz follow in the footsteps of Jim Thome with a legendary late-career pitstop?"

Are you really that young? Paul Molitor in 1996 and I would be thrilled if Cruz follows in his footsteps and has the kind of year Molitor had then.

mickeymental · March 15, 2019

chili davis.

mickeymental · March 15, 2019

Concur.

And not only is it a position, having a better one than the team you're playing gives you an advantage, just like having the better starting pitcher, or better right fielder. The advantage is limited to the offensive side, but nonetheless, it's an advantage.

and in the nl, having a better-hitting pitcher than the team you're playing gives you an advantage, just like having the better dh.

DocBauer · March 16, 2019

I couldn't disagree more.
DH is a position. It's a position that doesn't require any defensive abilities or versatility.
You wouldn't pass up adding a great centerfielder because he can't pitch an inning in a blowout. That would be absurd, because that's not the job of a centerfielder.
To steal another posters analogy, if you are hiring a CEO, you don't pass on the best one, just because he doesn't know how to work the assembly line.

I respect your comment, but we are going to have to agree to disagree to some extent. To re-iterate, I like the Cruz signing a TON. My preference was Brantley or McCutchen because they are good, dangerous, productive hitters who can actually play a position, thus increasing roster depth and flexibility. In said scenario, you roll different guys in to the DH slot for half days off.

There is nothing wrong with having a difference making hitter like Cruz, or an Ortiz, on your team, filling their role.

And it's OK if you disagree with me, but let me better explain myself. And considering the recent rule changes that begin in 2020, we will use the upcoming 26 man roster. Regardless of who, we will go with a 13 man pitching staff. That leaves 13 position players. We will also say there is a given 8 man "starting" lineup. Next, we will add a backup catcher, a traditional utility player, and a 4th outfielder. We are now at 11 position players and 2 spots left. Could that be a special bat who can realistically only DH? Yes, of course.

But let us consider a very easy to predict roster "crunch" over the next season or so at OF and 1B with Rosario, Buxton, Kepler, Cave, Wade, Kiriloff and Rooker. (Note, I'm not including the real possibility of Larnach fast tracking, or anyone else taking a step forward). A nice problem to have, yes?

Now, let's plug Lewis in at SS and move Polanco to 2B. As talented as Javier is, as highly regarded a talent as he is, he could be knocking at the door as early as 2021. (A small stretch, I grant you). For purpose of discussion, the newly dedicated and fit Sano is your 3B, who can also play 1B. (Just like the OF/1B situation, I am not including Miranda, Arraez or any other surprise or fast riser).

I would rather have this kind of positional player logjam and roll different guys, who are legitimate players in the field, in to the DH spot rather than reserve a spot for a DH only bat. I create competition, matchup situations and depth for guys hurt or struggling.

Even with the possibilities of trades, 1 or 2 guys not reaching their potential, there is still a fascinating and tantalizing depth "problem" here that is good to have. And even then, there are guys not even taken in to "consideration" as I've broken down the options listed here.

Again, just my opinion on how I'd like to address the roster construction and DH spot.

Shaitan · March 16, 2019

"Only once in my lifetime have the Twins signed a more accomplished hitter as a free agent, and it worked out supremely well. Can Cruz follow in the footsteps of Jim Thome with a legendary late-career pitstop?"
Are you really that young? Paul Molitor in 1996 and I would be thrilled if Cruz follows in his footsteps and has the kind of year Molitor had then.

And Thome wasn't much of a DH. He could still hit with the best of them, but he was a serious roster liability. He couldn't run, at all. He played about 6 innings per game before the pinchrunner took over, and he couldn't play 3 days in a row. imo, he was more of a bench piece than a DH.

But you're right. It's been rare.

cardsfan · March 16, 2019

He is always dear to my heart since he couldn’t catch the 9th inning triple in Game 6 of the World Series in 2011. He has tested positive for Peds. He hits 35 HRs with a decent OBP then you will be happy.

Mr. Brooks · March 16, 2019

I respect your comment, but we are going to have to agree to disagree to some extent. To re-iterate, I like the Cruz signing a TON. My preference was Brantley or McCutchen because they are good, dangerous, productive hitters who can actually play a position, thus increasing roster depth and flexibility. In said scenario, you roll different guys in to the DH slot for half days off.

There is nothing wrong with having a difference making hitter like Cruz, or an Ortiz, on your team, filling their role.

And it's OK if you disagree with me, but let me better explain myself. And considering the recent rule changes that begin in 2020, we will use the upcoming 26 man roster. Regardless of who, we will go with a 13 man pitching staff. That leaves 13 position players. We will also say there is a given 8 man "starting" lineup. Next, we will add a backup catcher, a traditional utility player, and a 4th outfielder. We are now at 11 position players and 2 spots left. Could that be a special bat who can realistically only DH? Yes, of course.

But let us consider a very easy to predict roster "crunch" over the next season or so at OF and 1B with Rosario, Buxton, Kepler, Cave, Wade, Kiriloff and Rooker. (Note, I'm not including the real possibility of Larnach fast tracking, or anyone else taking a step forward). A nice problem to have, yes?

Now, let's plug Lewis in at SS and move Polanco to 2B. As talented as Javier is, as highly regarded a talent as he is, he could be knocking at the door as early as 2021. (A small stretch, I grant you). For purpose of discussion, the newly dedicated and fit Sano is your 3B, who can also play 1B. (Just like the OF/1B situation, I am not including Miranda, Arraez or any other surprise or fast riser).

I would rather have this kind of positional player logjam and roll different guys, who are legitimate players in the field, in to the DH spot rather than reserve a spot for a DH only bat. I create competition, matchup situations and depth for guys hurt or struggling.

Even with the possibilities of trades, 1 or 2 guys not reaching their potential, there is still a fascinating and tantalizing depth "problem" here that is good to have. And even then, there are guys not even taken in to "consideration" as I've broken down the options listed here.

Again, just my opinion on how I'd like to address the roster construction and DH spot.

You are right, we don't agree.

Most players don't have max tools across the board.

Once you remove the handful of true superstars that have elite bats and gloves, most players have a scale of tools. Every game that someone who gets a legitimate chunk of their value from defensive tools starts at DH, is a game that you completely waste a portion of someone's value.

Roster spots are tight in the NFL too, think of the extra flexibility a team could have on game day if, instead of rostering a punter, they just used that position to rotate in other position players?

If guys need a day off, just give them a day off. How are you making your lineup better by removing Cruz from the roster so that a guy like Kepler or Polanco can DH? Are their bats better than Cruz's? Isn't your lineup better with Kepler on the bench, Cave in RF and Cruz at DH than it is with Cave in RF, Kepler at DH, and Cruz on another team?

Obviously this only applies if you can find a bat only guy whose bat is superior to most of the position players. If Robbie Grossman is your DH, then sure, you are better off just gaining flexibility and rotating guys.

ashbury · March 16, 2019

You are right, we don't agree.
Most players don't have max tools across the board.
Once you remove the handful of true superstars that have elite bats and gloves, most players have a scale of tools. Every game that someone who gets a legitimate chunk of their value from defensive tools starts at DH, is a game that you completely waste a portion of someone's value.

Roster spots are tight in the NFL too, think of the extra flexibility a team could have on game day if, instead of rostering a punter, they just used that position to rotate in other position players?

If guys need a day off, just give them a day off. How are you making your lineup better by removing Cruz from the roster so that a guy like Kepler or Polanco can DH? Are their bats better than Cruz's? Isn't your lineup better with Kepler on the bench, Cave in RF and Cruz at DH than it is with Cave in RF, Kepler at DH, and Cruz on another team?

Obviously this only applies if you can find a bat only guy whose bat is superior to most of the position players. If Robbie Grossman is your DH, then sure, you are better off just gaining flexibility and rotating guys.

Couldn't agree more. For me, the payoff from a relentless emphasis on positional flexibility is the freedom to assign one roster spot to someone with a bat this good. (We hope that Cruz is still that guy.)

A corollary that I mention now and then is that I never again want to invest scarce resources in a stud-hitting catcher. If one develops, great, but don't trade for one, don't pay big FA bucks for one, probably don't sign one you developed to an extension. Catchers need days off defensively, and to have one good enough to DH is a big roster challenge. If, say, Ryan Jeffers's bat develops, don't refrain from having a good DH - you want a DH so good that Jeffers sits on his days off anyway.

But I've digressed...

gunnarthor · March 16, 2019

Cruz should be great for us. He was #2 on my list of guys I wanted the Twins to sign (after Machado who would have been f-ing perfect). He'll also add some leadership and mentorship to some of our younger players.

He'll be an all-star.

Nick Nelson · March 16, 2019

"Only once in my lifetime have the Twins signed a more accomplished hitter as a free agent, and it worked out supremely well. Can Cruz follow in the footsteps of Jim Thome with a legendary late-career pitstop?"
Are you really that young? Paul Molitor in 1996 and I would be thrilled if Cruz follows in his footsteps and has the kind of year Molitor had then.

Ahhh yes! Molitor totally slipped my mind. Maybe I should've said they've only once signed a more accomplished slugger.

chili davis.

I think Cruz is more accomplished than he was.

yarnivek1972 · March 16, 2019

Ahhh yes! Molitor totally slipped my mind. Maybe I should've said they've only once signed a more accomplished slugger.

I think Cruz is more accomplished than he was.

If you’re going to count Molitor who was WAY past his prime when he came to Minnesota, you should count Dave Winfield in 1993 as well.

DocBauer · March 17, 2019

You are right, we don't agree.
Most players don't have max tools across the board.
Once you remove the handful of true superstars that have elite bats and gloves, most players have a scale of tools. Every game that someone who gets a legitimate chunk of their value from defensive tools starts at DH, is a game that you completely waste a portion of someone's value.
Roster spots are tight in the NFL too, think of the extra flexibility a team could have on game day if, instead of rostering a punter, they just used that position to rotate in other position players?
If guys need a day off, just give them a day off. How are you making your lineup better by removing Cruz from the roster so that a guy like Kepler or Polanco can DH? Are their bats better than Cruz's? Isn't your lineup better with Kepler on the bench, Cave in RF and Cruz at DH than it is with Cave in RF, Kepler at DH, and Cruz on another team?
Obviously this only applies if you can find a bat only guy whose bat is superior to most of the position players. If Robbie Grossman is your DH, then sure, you are better off just gaining flexibility and rotating guys.

Nice to know we can disagree...but not by much. (Including Ash in this as well).

Especially with the pending 26 man roster, I can see room for a Cruz or similar bat to be just that, a bat. No arguement there.

And I think we can all agree that a Grossman as our DH is just an immediate stopping point! Lol (No insult meant to Robbie).

The sticking point to our two opinions is; "most players don't have max tools across the board". Agree with you 100%! My contention is simply that over the next couple of seasons, with what is on hand, and what is coming up, some of them very quickly, the depth at OF/1B/3B could be such that instead of having a "bat only" DH, you could be rotating Sano, Khirilloff, Rooker and others between the field and DH. Simply means your roster is deep enough and talented enough that you wouldn't have to carry a bat only player because your roster was deep enough and talented enough you spread around the playing time.

Is that a pipedream? Meh...maybe. But the potential is there, IMO, to have this "problem" of too many good bats on hand.

A fun debate! Let's hope I'm right and the Twins have too many guys to work in to the lineup!

Nebtwinsfan · March 18, 2019

Cruz should be great for us. He was #2 on my list of guys I wanted the Twins to sign (after Machado who would have been f-ing perfect). He'll also add some leadership and mentorship to some of our younger players.

He'll be an all-star.

I was fortunate to watch Nelson Cruz doing some batting practice on Friday morning. First of all, he is impressive in person. Second, he was also having so much much fun with his teammates and Tony Oliva and Rod Carew. It was entertaining but you could also see him being a leader and mentor.

caninatl04 · March 18, 2019

Thanks for writing this JLease:

"There's plenty of franchise depth for this spot: Sano could move in there easily, Austin is a good fit if the team finds a way to keep him around, Cron could shift in if they decide they don't like his defense but he keeps on hitting, Rooker might be ready for extended MLB time soon...lots of options."

The '19 Twins may have more hitters than spots. And, as pointed out, by July, there will be more knocking on the door.

railmarshalljon · March 18, 2019

The only problem I see with this signing Cruz is how are we gonna get him in our lineup come WS time? For away games are we sticking him in the outfield or do we give him a first basemans glove and hope for he best?

DocBauer · March 19, 2019

I was fortunate to watch Nelson Cruz doing some batting practice on Friday morning. First of all, he is impressive in person. Second, he was also having so much much fun with his teammates and Tony Oliva and Rod Carew. It was entertaining but you could also see him being a leader and mentor.

Jealous of you being there. My dad was there a week ago and had a great time. He's been there a couple of times, Ft Myers once and Orlando back in the day.

Where in Nebraska do you hail from? (Omaha here)

Mike Sixel · March 19, 2019

Jealous of you being there. My dad was there a week ago and had a great time. He's been there a couple of times, Ft Myers once and Orlando back in the day.

Where in Nebraska do you hail from? (Omaha here)

Not that you asked, but I was born in Lincoln, my parents are from Omaha and Fairbury.

DocBauer · March 21, 2019

Not that you asked, but I was born in Lincoln, my parents are from Omaha and Fairbury.

Nope I didn't ask but thanks for playing Mike!

Very cool! Been in South Dakota and Nebraska my whole life. No wonder I'm a Twins/Vikings/Husker fan huh? Any chance you bleed Husker Red as well? Or are you a Ducks or Beaver fan up there?

Riverbrian · March 21, 2019

Nice to know we can disagree...but not by much. (Including Ash in this as well).

Especially with the pending 26 man roster, I can see room for a Cruz or similar bat to be just that, a bat. No arguement there.

And I think we can all agree that a Grossman as our DH is just an immediate stopping point! Lol (No insult meant to Robbie).

The sticking point to our two opinions is; "most players don't have max tools across the board". Agree with you 100%! My contention is simply that over the next couple of seasons, with what is on hand, and what is coming up, some of them very quickly, the depth at OF/1B/3B could be such that instead of having a "bat only" DH, you could be rotating Sano, Khirilloff, Rooker and others between the field and DH. Simply means your roster is deep enough and talented enough that you wouldn't have to carry a bat only player because your roster was deep enough and talented enough you spread around the playing time.

Is that a pipedream? Meh...maybe. But the potential is there, IMO, to have this "problem" of too many good bats on hand.

A fun debate! Let's hope I'm right and the Twins have too many guys to work in to the lineup!

I think you and Brooks are both right and I think Ash summed it all up pretty well.

If you have a chance to grab a bat like Nelson Cruz... you grab it. But, it can come with a cost if you don't set up your team to support it.

Cruz is a great signing unless you give back your gains elsewhere by using up valuable roster space on a guy who can't play in the field. .

If by utilizing the DH position and Brooks is right... it is a position. If by utilizing the DH position in the traditional fashion... you can be forced by lack of alternatives (due to roster space limitations) to play a player every day hitting very poorly... anything you gain from the DH position is then neutralized.

That's why I agree with you... I would rather see a 25 (or 26) man roster where the DH spot in the lineup can be used for overflow. If Tyler Austin and CJ Cron are both going nuts with OPS over 1,000... It would be sad that one has to ride the pine because there is only one first base bag and Cruz has got the DH spot.

But... Nelson Cruz is a special bat so it's a good addition.. Give him the DH position and take the rest of your lineup... make it deep and flexible enough to cover the defensive void left by a full time DH. Then you got Cruz and a supporting staff that will may not marginalize his contributions.

Riverbrian · March 21, 2019

Roster spots are tight in the NFL too, think of the extra flexibility a team could have on game day if, instead of rostering a punter, they just used that position to rotate in other position players?

I'm calling Zimmer... This is a great idea... Find a position player who can punt. Gain a roster spot for another position... Brilliant!!!

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