The Table Setter, Feb. 5, 2024: A Near Finished Product

I'm curious why you assume the offseason is done?

So far this feels like an empty off season to me. I don't think they have improved over last year much if any. I'm kind of disappointed they filled some spots with older players, possibly even on a downward trend. I wanted to see another quality starter added, and they got Desclafini instead. I was hoping they would take a long look at a few kids from the minors, but instead filled the roster with journeymen type players that just don't move the needle that much for me. I have been a Twins fan since they 1st moved here, no matter where my company sent me around the country, and they will continue to be "my team" as long as I live, so I will be pulling for all these guys. I truly hope I look back on this in October and say " boy was I a dope".

Jay Jackson looks like Matt Wisler version 2.  I guess this is the Twins mea culpa on giving up on Wisler back in the day.  His fastball is the weak link but slider appears to get the job done.  I guess I don't understand why the Jays didn't try to keep him?  Some kind of bad blood there?  At any rate for that price given his recent results it looks like a good pickup.

With Jackson and Santana likely taking Thompson and Duarte off the 40 man it looks like the low hanging 40 man fruit will be gone.  I still think they sign a right handed bat for the outfield and maybe another starter in the Odorizzi range.  If you are Balazovich or Gordon you have to wonder if you are coming off the 40 or traded.

At 6M is Farmer safe from being traded?  They might want that money for a right handed outfield bat using Castro and eventually Lee to fill infield spots.  Just wondering what the Twins might do.  Maybe with the TV contract a done deal they have the money to keep him and add.  Hard to say but this roster could be real interesting all the way through spring training.

47 minutes ago, Nashvilletwin said:

 

Other than losing Gray, this lineup is substantially superior to what we began with in 2023.  And way more fun to watch. And if Ober, Varland, and Paddack progress as we think they can, the starting staff will be improved overall even with DeSclafani.

Most importantly, we have not traded away our controllable, cheap young talent - whether in the bigs already or on the way. We should be favored to win the division in ‘24 with an even brighter future ahead for several years. 

I agree that they should still be favored to win the division, but do you really see anywhere they upgraded from last fall?

2 hours ago, Dman said:

At 6M is Farmer safe from being traded?  They might want that money for a right handed outfield bat using Castro and eventually Lee to fill infield spots.  Just wondering what the Twins might do.  Maybe with the TV contract a done deal they have the money to keep him and add.  Hard to say but this roster could be real interesting all the way through spring training.

Farmer appears to be a good guy and he's a capable utility infielder, but for over $6M, he is a luxury. The most important thing for a utility infielder is to be a capable shortstop. At his age (34 in August) Farmer doesn't have nearly average range for a shortstop. The Twins have three other options if Correa would go down short term or long term. Lee would replace CC4 in the event of a disabling injury, while both Willi Castro and Royce Lewis could fill in if Carlos is out for a few games. 

This is no rap on Farmer, but I don't know of a single team that would consider acquiring him to be a regular infielder at this point. 

Bullpen upgraded.  Offense upgraded due to (FSM make it so) full year of production from healthy Correa, Lewis, Julien, Wallner, Kirilloff coupled with no Gallo and Jeffers being what he showed last year.  Also have Miranda, Martin, and Lee waiting in  MiLB.

Starting pitching will regress  and hugely dependent on how good Paddack is and progress by Ryan, Ober, Varland maybe even SWR.

True they didnt make a big offseason FA splash.  Strategy seems to be that the in house talent is ready to shine.  Thats what Ive been asking for.  Hope Im right.

31 minutes ago, LastOnePicked said:

Hmm. Substantially superior? If Julian, Wallner and Lewis can adjust and stay healthy, maybe. But the rotation is substantially inferior, and that usually sets the table for success.

Bullpen looks okay. Lineup looks slightly above average. Speed looks below average. Defense appears average. Rotation is clearly below average. That doesn't lead me to the same optimism.

To me, the rotation looks pretty good if, and it is a huge if, the top three guys establish themselves this year. It seems the consensus is that López is and will be a #1 pitcher. I really like him too, but another good/great year would move him up to that level among people who aren't cheering for the Twins. The same for Ryan and Ober as above average starters--last year's performance was that, but they need another year to back it up IMHO. If those three can put up the innings and other numbers, then the rotation is pretty good. 

I also like Paddack to be really good this year, fully healthy and motivated. The #5-#8 spots are not well defined and there's not a ton of upside. My fervent hope is that this group's performance is not what determines success or failure. 

6 hours ago, Karbo said:

So far this feels like an empty off season to me. I don't think they have improved over last year much if any. I'm kind of disappointed they filled some spots with older players, possibly even on a downward trend. I wanted to see another quality starter added, and they got Desclafini instead. I was hoping they would take a long look at a few kids from the minors, but instead filled the roster with journeymen type players that just don't move the needle that much for me. I have been a Twins fan since they 1st moved here, no matter where my company sent me around the country, and they will continue to be "my team" as long as I live, so I will be pulling for all these guys. I truly hope I look back on this in October and say " boy was I a dope".

DeSclafani.

They have an emerging nucleus, and if they get full seasons at similar levels from last year from Lewis, Julien, Kirilloff, and Wallner, plus a more stretched out starting pitcher performance from Ober, with maybe Lee sprinkled in for an early summer call up, the team seems equal to last year - less starting pitching, more depth in the bullpen and more offense. If you get a healthy Correa and semi-healthy Buxton, they could well be a 90+ wins team. Sure, there are 'ifs' but the talent is there.

1 hour ago, stringer bell said:

Farmer appears to be a good guy and he's a capable utility infielder, but for over $6M, he is a luxury. The most important thing for a utility infielder is to be a capable shortstop. At his age (34 in August) Farmer doesn't have nearly average range for a shortstop. The Twins have three other options if Correa would go down short term or long term. Lee would replace CC4 in the event of a disabling injury, while both Willi Castro and Royce Lewis could fill in if Carlos is out for a few games. 

This is no rap on Farmer, but I don't know of a single team that would consider acquiring him to be a regular infielder at this point. 

Farmer is a necessity, not a luxury. In the Twins case, shortstop is the least important thing he does.

He backstops every youngster in the lineup. That's worth 6m.

Also as an aside, I'm starting to get the feeling the Orioles are getting Snell or Montgomery. No sources, just a feeling. That's a super team in both leagues, they still need major contributions from most of the question marks and add a starting pitcher. The deadline makes sense to me bt they can't ever be done tinkering.

If all the kids are alright Farmer has value at the deadline for someone backfilling an injury. Not so much now.

1 hour ago, sweetmusicviola16 said:

How about if we do what the Royals and Tigers are doing with their up and coming and established talent? The Royals just handed out an 11/288 deal to Bobby Witt JR. We should be extending Lewis, Julien and Duran. Instead we are signing 36 y/o relievers with virtually no track record. 

"Be happy Twins fan. You have a team and it is competitive."

Bobby Witt is what Royce Lewis is, but without the injury history, and he's a true shortstop. I would say it is a no-brainer to extend Witt, he's gonna be great as long as he's healthy. I'm not so sure that the Tigers extending a guy who wasn't so highly regarded but raked in the minors is a great move. We shall see.

In general, I don't think taking cues from Detroit or KC is the way to go. The Royals have been building and rebuilding since they went to the World Series in '15(?) and the Tigers were dreadful for the last seven years. Both teams have had a lot of Top 5-10 picks in the last decade. 

Durán has two years of service time, Lewis one-plus, Julien less than one. Maybe after this year, and with more revenue certainty, the Twins will look at locking up some of these guys. 

15 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

Bobby Witt is what Royce Lewis is, but without the injury history, and he's a true shortstop. I would say it is a no-brainer to extend Witt, he's gonna be great as long as he's healthy. I'm not so sure that the Tigers extending a guy who wasn't so highly regarded but raked in the minors is a great move. We shall see.

In general, I don't think taking cues from Detroit or KC is the way to go. The Royals have been building and rebuilding since they went to the World Series in '15(?) and the Tigers were dreadful for the last seven years. Both teams have had a lot of Top 5-10 picks in the last decade. 

Durán has two years of service time, Lewis one-plus, Julien less than one. Maybe after this year, and with more revenue certainty, the Twins will look at locking up some of these guys. 

Said it when they did it...Det extending a guy with no MLB record is crazy.

2 hours ago, arby58 said:

Desclafani.

They have an emerging nucleus, and if they get full seasons at similar levels from last year from Lewis, Julien, Kirilloff, and Wallner, plus a more stretched out starting pitcher performance from Ober, with maybe Lee sprinkled in for an early summer call up, the team seems equal to last year - less starting pitching, more depth in the bullpen and more offense. If you get a healthy Correa and semi-healthy Buxton, they could well be a 90+ wins team. Sure, there are 'ifs' but the talent is there.

So you think Desclafini is an improvement over last years staff?

40 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

DiScelfana

2 minutes ago, Karbo said:

So you think Desclafini is an improvement over last years staff?

2 hours ago, sweetmusicviola16 said:

We should be extending Lewis, Julien and Duran. Instead we are signing 36 y/o relievers with virtually no track record. 

That is what is known as a false dilemma or false dichotomy.