Why Do the Twins Keep Playing with a Short Roster?

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

Jackson has more value to the Twins right now than anyone they can get in a trade for him.   He is currently penciled in as the backup catcher for next year and that is a great spot to be.   Unless the Twins get a godfather offer, a massive overpay for Jeffers - He is currently worth ($6-$8 million for 2 months) you are better to play him - see if can outperform and do the math on if you can get a compensation pick.  Now It gets weird how it will work with the new bargaining agreement.   I hope they can negotiate it fairly quickly.   I do think it gets done before the season.     Plus Jackson is the perfect 13 man because he isn't a prospect you are still trying to develop.  He is necessary insurance if Jeffers or Caratini gets injured.    

[arby58]

14 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Petey Halpin has been optioned multiple times this year. He's played nearly every day when he's been on the MLB roster.

Garrett Stubbs, the 3rd catcher in Philly, hasn't been on the MLB roster all season and plays LF, 3B, and 1B for them beyond catching.

I never claimed the Twins were alone. But they are outside the norm. And context matters. James Outman wasn't a Petey Halpin defender who played every game for his glove, he was a guy who wasn't the best option for anything. The Phillies situation is certainly closer with Stubbs.

For context, in 2026, Stubbs has played 1B for 5 innings, 3B for 2 innings, and LF for 1 game (8 innings). He’s caught 69 innings. He’s primarily a 3rd catcher. With a .429 OPS, he would not be on the 26 man roster otherwise.

[HarmonK03]

46 minutes ago, LA Vikes Fan said:

I have to say I don't agree with this with respect to either Fedko or McCusker. Yes, Fedko only got 16 ABs. There's a reason for that. He looked completely overmatched at the plate and struck out in 8 of those 16 ABs, plus 2 walks.

In regards to Fedko, I think the stats are a little misleading.  He started four games in nearly a month he was up here.  He went 12 days without an AB, which may be a better reason to have a veteran in this role, but that is tough for anyone to be in that spot.  Of his strikeouts, 4 of the 8 were in his last two games after he had been sitting.  You could tell he was pressing and his at bats did look better when he first came up.  I don't know if it would have translated to success  but I don't think you can make any conclusions about whether he could play up here or not.  People on here keep talking about late bloomers when they talk about Kreidler or Gray or any of the other AAAA types they like to churn thru,  why wouldn't that potentially apply to Fedko. 

And they did have a chance to use him when Buxton was unable to play.  A defense of Kreidler at SS and Fedko in CF would have been better than Kreidler in CF and Gray at SS.  At least it would have been a little run to see if there might something there.

The thing I liked about TK is he found a way to use everyone to keep them sharp without hurting the team.  The day they brought in Fedko for Buxton after the first inning is the reason TK kept his players sharp for just that sort of a situation.  But yet Fedko hadn't had an AB in 12 days, very few would have had success in that situation.

[mnfireman]

I have no problem demoting Gray and keeping Jackson as the 13th man.

I don't know if he can play out there anymore, he is listed at 6-1, 238, but Jackson was drafted as an OF by Seattle and was moved to C by Atlanta. IF Jackson can still play RF/LF, C, DH & PH I think he warrants the last bench spot.

[HarmonK03]

8 minutes ago, mnfireman said:

I have no problem demoting Gray and keeping Jackson as the 13th man.

I don't know if he can play out there anymore, he is listed at 6-1, 238, but Jackson was drafted as an OF by Seattle and was moved to C by Atlanta. IF Jackson can still play RF/LF, C, DH & PH I think he warrants the last bench spot.

Gray isn't going anywhere, the Twins see something in him that no other team or even Gray himself sees.

[chpettit19]

35 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

Come up with a better proxy if you want. The point is a good team doesn't really use the last man on the bench despite your confident proclamations to the contrary. 

This website is funny because you'll see complaints about an over reliance on platoon matchups followed up by an insistence that the team needs to utilize the last bench spot more frequently. 

You come up with a better proxy. The hitter with the 13th most PAs for a team assumes that player has been on the team the entire year. Which is an awful assumption. My argument is not that the Twins should have 13 guys they want to play all the time. It's that they are outside the norm in that they have frequently rostered players with no role whatsoever.

This website is funny because you'll see people who think platoon bats are the only way to use the 13th position player spot. I have no problem with the Guardians using Petey Halpin as a nearly daily defensive replacement. That's a real, defined role. Kyler Fedko wasn't a platoon bat. James Outman wasn't a platoon bat. They weren't trusted to hit against anyone. But they also weren't defensive replacements or elite base stealers. They were guys with no role at all. Players the coaching staff had no situation where they looked at those guys as the best options or wanted to put them in. That is very different than teams having limited roles for a player like Halpin.

The Phillies are a good example as @arby58 has pointed out with Stubbs as their 3rd catcher having no real role. But it is absolutely outside the norm to have a guy on your roster that you never want to put on the field.

[chpettit19]

23 minutes ago, arby58 said:

For context, in 2026, Stubbs has played 1B for 5 innings, 3B for 2 innings, and LF for 1 game (8 innings). He’s caught 69 innings. He’s primarily a 3rd catcher. With a .429 OPS, he would not be on the 26 man roster otherwise.

Yes, that is a good comp for the Twins in that he's a player with no real role. But in terms of 3rd catchers, he is at least trusted to stand in those spots. The Twins would never put Jeffers, Caratini, or Jackson at 3B or LF.

[NYCTK]

1 minute ago, chpettit19 said:

My argument is not that the Twins should have 13 guys they want to play all the time. It's that they are outside the norm in that they have frequently rostered players with no role whatsoever.

And I'm saying your argument is based on nothing but vibes. If you can provide evidence of this claim, great. 

[chpettit19]

3 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

And I'm saying your argument is based on nothing but vibes. If you can provide evidence of this claim, great. 

As opposed to your argument? You listed a guy who hasn't even been on the Mets for a month while providing inaccurate stas as proof. You haven't provided any evidence either. I'm all ears for you going through all 30 teams and proving that the norm is to have a guy with no roster role whatsoever. I'm actually looking forward to it.

[darin617]

Fedko put too much pressure on himself to get his first hit and it affected him.

If Kreidler had more speed he would be an ideal 13th player. That way you would have a base running option for late innings that could play infield or outfield.

 

[IndianaTwin]

Plate appearances isn't the right measure in trying to figure whether the Twins used this role any differently than other teams. 

Take Outman, for example. He only had 70 plate appearances, but actually played in 49 of the 64 games the team had while he was on the roster.  

He was being used a lot -- slightly over three-fourths of all games. He just wasn't batting*. He averaged only 1.4 plate appearances per game. There's nobody on the team even close to having that few plate appearances per game appearance. Even Jackson and Arcia have more than 2.5 plate appearances per game played.

Except Fedko. And what does Fedko have in common with Outman? He played in 14 of the 19 games when he was on the roster, again almost exactly three-fourths of the games. 

So to answer the question, "Why are the Twins playing with a short roster?," they aren't. Their 13th player has been a defensive specialist that plays in three-fourths of the games, often coming in for Larnach, but sometimes for others.

It's an oversimplication, but you could almost say they are platooning. But rather than a lefty/righty platoon, it's an offense/defense platoon.  

 

*In more ways than one, but that's not the point of this response. 

[darin617]

The third catcher isn't ideal but they can get by with it. They should be shopping Jeffers or Caratini now.  There are teams that need a catcher and it would be foolish not to capitalize on it.

Nothing wrong with trading a hot commodity and still being a buyer at the deadline.

[IndianaTwin]

6 minutes ago, darin617 said:

The third catcher isn't ideal but they can get by with it. They should be shopping Jeffers or Caratini now.  There are teams that need a catcher and it would be foolish not to capitalize on it.

Nothing wrong with trading a hot commodity and still being a buyer at the deadline.

Based on Tom Pohlad's recent comments about investment and fan support (not reported on TD, to my recollection), I suspect they don't trade Jeffers. Being in a pennant (including convincing fans that they are), you don't trade a No. 1 catcher and arguably your second-best hitter.

But here's a wondering -- might they actually get as much for Jackson as they would for Caratini? Two years younger, two years of control compared to one, and a lot cheaper.

[ashbury]

2 hours ago, NYCTK said:

Just looking at the player with the 13th most PAs with a smattering of teams: 

Twins - 135
Phillies - 55
D'Backs - 100
White Sox - 97

The Twins are sharing plate appearances more than the 3 other random teams I just chose. And while Outman was 14th, not 13th, in PAs, the point remains. 

No, the point doesn't remain.  It's a bad methodology by this point in any season.  Indeed you almost spotted the flaw but didn't follow through to the conclusion.  #13 for the Twins is Matt Wallner with 135 PA.  Was Wallner ever the 13th guy on the roster this season?  Of course not.  They gave him a long run as a starter, then pulled the plug and sent him to St Paul.

Almost every team's roster evolves as the season progresses, either due to injury or due to poor performance (or in rare cases a AAA player forcing the issue with great play).  That's what you're likely measuring here.  Churn.

A meaningful study of 13th men would involve a whale of a lot of work, involving careful tracking of each roster change and how the team made use of each player while that version of the roster remained intact, taking into account nagging  day-to-day injuries like Buxton is susceptible to and the handedness of the day's opposing pitcher and probably other secondary matters.

I don;'t know how other teams handle their 13th man, and I'm not going to invest the effort, but I'm pretty certain the data snapshot you provided doesn't show the way.

[NYCTK]

9 minutes ago, ashbury said:

No, the point doesn't remain.  It's a bad methodology by this point in any season.  Indeed you almost spotted the flaw but didn't follow through to the conclusion.  #13 for the Twins is Matt Wallner with 135 PA.  Was Wallner ever the 13th guy on the roster this season?  Of course not.  They gave him a long run as a starter, then pulled the plug and sent him to St Paul.

Almost every team's roster evolves as the season progresses, either due to injury or due to poor performance (or in rare cases a AAA player forcing the issue with great play).  That's what you're likely measuring here.  Churn.

A meaningful study of 13th men would involve a whale of a lot of work, involving careful tracking of each roster change and how the team made use of each player while that version of the roster remained intact, taking into account nagging  day-to-day injuries like Buxton is susceptible to and the handedness of the day's opposing pitcher and probably other secondary matters.

I don;'t know how other teams handle their 13th man, and I'm not going to invest the effort, but I'm pretty certain the data snapshot you provided doesn't show the way.

Outside of a rigorous academic undertaking, the 13th most PAs is a fine standin. You think the Twins are the only team whose de facto last man doesn't have fewer than the 13th most on their roster? That other teams don't deal with injury or underperforming players with options? 

I think demonstrating the Twins plate appearance distribution is entirely relevant and, yes, the point remains. 

[tarheeltwinsfan]

I vote for Audra Martin to occupy the 26th  roster spot. 

[Eris]

A number of the players mentioned (Fedko, Outman, Keirsey) were rostered to have a viable backup in CF. In recent times they have tried Clemens, Kreidler, and now Keaschall. Not sure how Clemens and Keaschall rate in CF. Kreidler seems close to an average CF. 

[LA Vikes Fan]

1 hour ago, chpettit19 said:

Yes, that is a good comp for the Twins in that he's a player with no real role. But in terms of 3rd catchers, he is at least trusted to stand in those spots. The Twins would never put Jeffers, Caratini, or Jackson at 3B or LF.

Jackson actually played some RF in the minors so I could see them putting him in a corner OF spot if someone gets hurt during a game, second game of a doubleheader (do they still have those), or to effectuate an extra inning pinch hitting thing. Besides, both Caratini and Jeffers have played a fair amount of 1B or DH, so having Jackson around actually increases our flexibility to put both of those guys in the lineup and still have a backup catcher. Add in catching once a week in a 7 game week, and I think he adds plenty of value for the 13th guy.   

[LA Vikes Fan]

The issue with our current roster construction isn't really because were carrying three catchers; it's because we have a utility infielder that can't play a competent SS. Jackson actually helps our flexibility as the 13th guy because he can play a corner 0F spot, and both Jeffers and Caratini can play 1B and hit well enough to be viable at the DH spot. You can actually put Jeffers and Caratini both in the lineup as long as you have Jackson sitting on the bench to be the backup catcher in case of injury so you don't have to lose the DH spot if your catcher gets hurt and has to come out. Add to that the fact that Jackson has played RF in the minors and assumedly can be at least a somewhat viable corner outfielder or IB in a pinch, and you actually have a guy who has some value as the 13th player, particularly a guy who is hitting .296/.321/.407 (.728) with very sporadic playing time. Guys that can hit without regular playing time are not easy to find.

The problem is we have the wrong utility infielder in Tristan Gray because he can't play SS or 3B very well. I think the answer is coming soon though. I think Gray should get demoted as soon as Buxton comes back and we run with Lee as the backup SS until a decision is made on catching. Now if you want to also keep both Roden and Martin on the Twins and get Culpepper up to the Bigs, one of the three catchers needs to be traded. I would trade Jeffers unless we thought we could re-sign him now or at the end of year so we don't lose him for nothing, but I can see the argument to keep him for the rest of this year, give him the Q0, and get draft pick compensation. You either have to trade him or give him the QO. If you make the latter decision, I think Jackson's performance this year has been good enough that he actually has some trade value for like an A ball lottery ticket or as a throw in on another trade so we won't have to just DFA him but if we do, we do. Culpepper can then come up to the Bigs. We can ease Culpepper into the SS position with  Kriedler playing SS a couple of days a week and use Kriedler as the utility infielder the rest of the time. He's actually perfect for that role, a guy with a great glove and inconsistent bat who can also be the backup CF or at least one of the backup CFs. Get Culpepper up and you have 5 IFs for 4 spots, a quality backup SS regardless of whether Culpepper or Kreidler is starting, plus 2 catchers who can both play 1B if Lewis gets injured or needs a day. We would also have 5 OFs, 3 RHs and 2 LHs, and it doesn't really matter if any of them are great in CF because you have Kreidler who can play an above average CF while Culpepper plays SS. If Culpepper is still hurt or isn't ready, Twins might want to think about Ben Ross for that same role given his age (25) and his stellar performance in AAA so far. He might be worth a look in any event.

So I think there's a pretty simple solution that allows us to keep Jackson in the short term, create playing time for Culpepper or Ross by the end of the month (or sooner if we make the trade sooner), and create space for one of the formally AAA outfielders that we think could actually be a real contributor by next season like Roden. The key is to demote Gray when Buxton is ready to come back. I actually think that leaves us with a better roster.

 

 

 

[EGFTShaw]

Short?

Well, Bec Brandon Winokur is in the minors...😁

[chpettit19]

36 minutes ago, LA Vikes Fan said:

Jackson actually played some RF in the minors so I could see them putting him in a corner OF spot if someone gets hurt during a game, second game of a doubleheader (do they still have those), or to effectuate an extra inning pinch hitting thing. Besides, both Caratini and Jeffers have played a fair amount of 1B or DH, so having Jackson around actually increases our flexibility to put both of those guys in the lineup and still have a backup catcher. Add in catching once a week in a 7 game week, and I think he adds plenty of value for the 13th guy.   

I don't disagree with this general idea, but are you sitting Bell or Lewis for Caratini or Jeffers? I didn't mention DH and 1B because they would put guys there, but those are spots that most certainly don't need to be taken up with Caratini or Jeffers. Unless Jeffers is going to continue to hit like a DH (I have my doubts based on his entire career), neither him nor Caratini would be the first or second (Larnach) options at DH.

I don't think "emergency injury replacement" in RF is adding any real value to Jackson. It's nice to have, but they'd have to be in a pretty specific situation for that to happen. He's essentially a once-a-week catcher when they're on long stretches without a day off in your scenario. It's not the worst roster situation they've found themselves in, but it's certainly not ideal. 

Them having 3 switch hitters and far fewer platoon bats than they used to is the real reason having an essentially completely wasted roster spot isn't awful for them. They have a group of guys who are clearly playing better than the bench guys and should be starting most every day. I still don't think 3rd catcher is really the best use of that roster spot. Give me a true defensive/SB demon who can be used every day over a 3rd catcher on a roster with plenty of DH/1B options.