Changes to CF at Target Field

[Thrylos]

 

Even the plaza is packed with people with nowhere to go. No mini field to play on. No quiet place to sit and play with other kids. Nothing child themed but the mascot.

But we have a dozen bars. C'mon.

 

So you want an amusement park?   Ball parks are for baseball.  The game is very child friendly.  If you don't want to bring a kid to the ballpark to watch the game, there are better things you can do with your kid.  And if your kid is not enough to concentrate to the game, there are more nice things to do that bring a kid who will disturb everyone around you all to the game.

 

Bars make $.  Free amusement parks do not.  Of course the Twins are in it for the $, otherwise the Metrodome was a fine venue to watch baseball and a great home field advantage when the fans went there to watch baseball.

 

Now that people go there for the "experience", instead of the ballgame, things have changed and people start demanding teams to have even more irrelevant to baseball stuff, in addition to mascots, costume races etc.

 

Really glad that the Twins are not making the ballpark Club Snoopy or Chucky Cheese's... Gee.

[TheLeviathan]

 

So you want an amusement park?   Ball parks are for baseball.  The game is very child friendly.  If you don't want to bring a kid to the ballpark to watch the game, there are better things you can do with your kid.  And if your kid is not enough to concentrate to the game, there are more nice things to do that bring a kid who will disturb everyone around you all to the game.

 

Bars make $.  Free amusement parks do not.  Of course the Twins are in it for the $, otherwise the Metrodome was a fine venue to watch baseball and a great home field advantage when the fans went there to watch baseball.

 

Now that people go there for the "experience", instead of the ballgame, things have changed and people start demanding teams to have even more irrelevant to baseball stuff, in addition to mascots, costume races etc.

 

Really glad that the Twins are not making the ballpark Club Snoopy or Chucky Cheese's... Gee.

 

Boy it's hard not to respond to this post in the way I want to.  Insulting someone's kids you never met seems like a real good way to make your point.

 

No, not Chucky Cheese - just a space that kids can go to appreciate baseball might be nice.  You know, a place that MANY other parks have opted to include in their space because they see the value in it. Another bar?  Beyond redundant. (You're paying money to go to a place that you can go for free and the beer selection is both cheaper and more plentiful.  How stupid is that?)

 

When the ballpark isn't filled and people that would bring 3-6 people with them (who buy a ton of concessions and other junk) aren't coming:  that's a market you shouldn't be ignoring.  Many other clubs have realized that, by the way.

[Thrylos]

 

Boy it's hard not to respond to this post in the way I want to.  Insulting someone's kids you never met seems like a real good way to make your point.

 

I did not insult anyone's kids, unless they take themselves to the ballgame...

 

To me, parents who are bringing their kids to a baseball game, while the kids are not interested in watching the game or do not care about the game, plus demanding the ballpark to be a babysitter, while ignoring the needs of the people around them who want to watch the game in peace, are at fault.

 

If your kid cannot watch the game, get a babysitter or take them to a place that will amuse them instead of a ballgame.  You will be doing everyone a favor.    You do not expect kid-friendly stuff within a movie theater while watching a movie, why should you expect that in a ballpark?

 

That's the point here.  It is a ballgame, not playdate.

 

[Squirrel]

Moderator note: We all go to ballgames and bring, or not bring, our kids and appreciate varying experiences. While sometimes those experiences and expectations contradict one another, please let's not devolve this discussion into a 'Leave your kids at home because they annoy me' argument. This is a ballpark discussion and what the Twins could do to enhance the experience for some. Feel free to agree and disagree how that is achieved, but let's leave the finger pointing at others' kids as a reason your experience is not what you hoped for.

[TheLeviathan]

Baseball has always had a very deep family component for me. My apologies (I guess) for wishing to share that with my son.

 

Feel free to enjoy yet another over priced place to buy nothing but Miller that you could've gone to for free with less parking hassle. I guess.

[howeda7]

I don't have a strong opinion on this addition in particular. But I'm very glad that the Twins are spending $ every year to keep Target Field first class, and I'm surprised at all the complaints in this thread. They are taking an area that was largely unused and upgrading it. Why get upset about that?

 

And FWIW my nieces and nephews have enjoed many games at TF. It's as kid friendly as you make it, as are most things, IMO.

[nicksaviking]

My 5-year old has been to every opening day at Target Field. It's a struggle now, with the intended payoff being a simple thank you when he's older.

[Craig Arko]

It would seem the larger change is happening in right field.

[notoriousgod71]

I wish people went to games to watch them and not make an event out of it.

 

 

[twinsnorth49]

Baseball is a veritable Magic Kingdom for children, compared to hockey. There are two things to do at a hockey game, watch the game (and unless you have an aisle seat don't think about getting up before the period ends), and watching the zamboni during intermission. Literally nothing else happens

 

I don't think it's much for the Twins to incorporate some fun kids activities. If our little independent park here in Winnipeg, where the Goldeyes play can add pitching and batting cages, along with a little play park, I'm sure an organization the size of the Twins could manage it.

[glunn]

The "Catch" lounge seems to me like a skybox area at a bargain price.  At 120 people, this seems like very small potatoes in the context of a stadium that seats more than 39,000 people -- far less than 1% of overall capacity.  I suspect that this is just a toe in the water and the plan is to expand this if it is successful.

 

I agree that it would be great for some families to have areas where kids can blow off steam.  I also respect those who don't want kids distracting from their enjoyment of the game.  It seems to me that everyone could be better off if there were attractions for kids adjacent to seating that is designated for families.  This would make games more appealing to families and would siphon kids away from adults who don't want them distracting from the game.  Also, for very little money the Twins could add a female bear and have a contest where kids vote on a name for the bear.  

 

A unique approach might be to replicate the Catch lounge for families and family groups--  a juice bar instead of alcohol, some small batting cages using tees, extra visits from TC bear (and new female bear), face painting, etc.  This would keep the kids far away from those who would be annoyed by the kids, and the parents could watch the game without worry that the kids can leave the safe area (which would be secured).  Yes, this would be somewhat like Chuck E Cheese, but if it were walled off like Catch, then it would not disturb the hardcore fans.  Question for those who have kids -- does this sound appealing?  

 

Maybe the Twins would not consider this, because the revenue per kid would need to be much lower than the revenue per adult at the Catch.  However, it seems to me that until the Twins can get back to anything near full attendance, this would be profitable, even if less profitable than Catch.  A seat that brings in $30 of net revenue is not as profitable as a seat that brings in $80, BUT an empty seat brings in $0.  Also, over the long run this would create more customers and higher TV ratings.  Also, if this does not work, the same infrastructure could be converted to a bar.  

 

 

[TheLeviathan]

 

A unique approach might be to replicate the Catch lounge for families and family groups--  a juice bar instead of alcohol, some small batting cages using tees, extra visits from TC bear (and new female bear), face painting, etc.  This would keep the kids far away from those who would be annoyed by the kids, and the parents could watch the game without worry that the kids can leave the safe area (which would be secured).  Yes, this would be somewhat like Chuck E Cheese, but if it were walled off like Catch, then it would not disturb the hardcore fans.  Question for those who have kids -- does this sound appealing?  

 

Absolutely, it wouldn't take much and would serve as a place you could go walk to, spend some time, and then come back.  It doesn't have to function as an all-day distraction, just an option to explore for a chunk of the 3-4 hours you're there.

 

And it helps those that want to concentrate on the game.  Though, personally in my experience, my game viewing enjoyment is far more often ruined by obnoxious drunks than it ever has been by a kid.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I honestly don't see the point of paying the amount to bring kids to the game and then have them play games in the concourse the entire time. Citi Field has a perfectly good section where they have wiffle ball, et al but if you are a parent, you can't watch the game from that corner. Why spend that kind of money on tickets when you can go to the neighborhood festival?

Great, you responded to a request absolutely no one made.  We don't want a place for our kids to play the whole game, we want a modest brief activity to break up an often 4-hour commitment to see a MLB game live.  And if you can't see the game from the kid's area, nobody is forcing you to use it, but personally I wouldn't mind missing an inning or two if it helps me keep the kid happy for the duration of the game.  (For a lot of parents I've seen, their strategy of bringing kids often includes "arrive late" and "leave early" neither of which I generally like.)

 

Also, you bring up the cost of tickets -- for the price we pay (8th highest average ticket price in MLB, according to Team Marketing Report), we wouldn't accept Metrodome-like restrooms, concessions, etc.  Why are we just supposed to be content with Metrodome-era "walking the concourse" as the primary way to give kids a break while at the game?

 

Heck, for the earlier mention of the Metrodome -- in its later years, the Metrodome plaza often had a number of booths/games for adults and kids.  Wasn't much help during the game, but it was some kind of effort in that regard, the likes of which I don't think I've ever really seen at the new stadium, even on the plaza (part of me suspecting that the Twins did this to capture revenue that they didn't control inside the old stadium?).  Target Field is pretty much just positioning itself as the biggest bar in the warehouse district, with priority #1 on getting fans into the stadium and its watering holes quickly, which I am sure is quite profitable but it shouldn't be surprising when that strategy turns off a segment of fans. In fact, given the de-emphasis on the plaza since moving from the Dome, and the focus of ballpark renovations the past few years, it almost seems like they are deliberately trying not to encourage bringing kids to the game -- parents bringing kids don't drink as much (even if sometimes it feels like we need to drink more ).

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I wish people went to games to watch them and not make an event out of it.

As MLB has stretched the average game time to 3 hours, and the Twins charge an average ticket price of $32, I don't think it's the fans "making an event out of it."  An event makes more money than a simple game, but unfortunately that event is also often less kid-friendly than just a game.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

And FWIW my nieces and nephews have enjoed many games at TF. It's as kid friendly as you make it, as are most things, IMO.

Yeah, let's blame the parents for pointing out that having equally poor kid's activities at Target Field as they had at the Dome is kind of an abuse of the public subsidy and increased fan costs.  I work damn hard to make it as kid-friendly as I can, bringing (and helping play with) many toys, books, snacks, and activities.  There's just often a natural limit on how long you can keep a small kid content sitting in a chair and walking around a concourse, and it's well less than the 3 hour average game time.

 

My kid has enjoyed a few games here too, usually when other kids of similar age are involved (I notice you used the plural forms, so perhaps that is the case also with your nieces and nephews).  We're just going to far fewer games than we could if the Twins even just roped off a small area designated for kids of similar age to congregate.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I did not insult anyone's kids, unless they take themselves to the ballgame...

 

To me, parents who are bringing their kids to a baseball game, while the kids are not interested in watching the game or do not care about the game, plus demanding the ballpark to be a babysitter, while ignoring the needs of the people around them who want to watch the game in peace, are at fault.

 

If your kid cannot watch the game, get a babysitter or take them to a place that will amuse them instead of a ballgame.  You will be doing everyone a favor.    You do not expect kid-friendly stuff within a movie theater while watching a movie, why should you expect that in a ballpark?

 

That's the point here.  It is a ballgame, not playdate.

I don't know of anyone demanding that the ballpark be a babysitter.  That would effectively be a drop-off daycare.  Folks here are requesting a brief, parent shared/supervised activity other than "walking the concourse" that could help keep their kids interested in staying at the ballpark for 3+ hours.

 

And at my local movie theater, tickets are $6-10, general admission, and the whole show is under 2 hours.

 

Last I checked, the cheapest discounted child ticket to Kid's Appreciation Day at Target Field was $12 (limit 2) and that required a $17 adult ticket, reserved seating in the left field upper deck.  (Want to go on a different day than Sunday, or sit in a different section?  Kids tickets are full price, averaging $32.)  All of those prices don't include fees, which I believe are around $3.50 per ticket and another $3.50 per order if you want them in advance (and remember, they are all reserved seats, so buying in advance is advantageous).  Time of game was 3 hours, 11 minutes.  The kid's giveaway that day was also not guaranteed ("first 10,000"), requiring fans to arrive early to ensure they got a TC Bear stocking cap.

 

I don't really care about the costs, other to illustrate that major league baseball fans have a right to request a special "kid's area" hidden from the main seating bowl at the ballpark, as opposed to such a request at a movie theater.

[Otto von Ballpark]

Now that I've completely taken over the thread, I might as well add: I generally don't drag kids to the game when they don't want to go.  But I've had my friends and extended family arrange gatherings at the game where I really had no choice but to bring along the kids.  I've since started discouraging my friends and family from gathering in this manner at Target Field.

[TheLeviathan]

It's also only natural for kids 2-8 years old to want to get up and see the ballpark and do something active.  God forbid they enjoy going and picking up a bat and playing baseball or something.  I think we all understand that the team doesn't have to cater to us every minute, we're parents for god's sake - we're all well accustomed to how the world works.

 

But even a rink-a-dink mall finds a 20 foot area for a freaking park/climbing area.  All Target Field seems to find is another place to dispense overpriced crappy beer.  Every other ballpark I've been to that has been renovated or built in the last 15 years has made an area that kids would like to spend time in.  Target Field has nothing.  

 

Unless you count sticking two kids in a bear costume on a 90 degree day.  come to think of it...maybe the Twins just hate children?  

[USAFChief]

As someone who comes for baseball, and has no young kids anymore, even I can see the benefits to everyone of an area set aside for young kids and their parents.

 

And I hope to someday bring all of my grandkids to Target Field and brainwash them into lifelong Twins and baseball fans. A play area seems to me a worthy accommodation to me ( and tens of thousands like me ) as well as an excellent investment for the Twins.

[DaveW]

As someone who comes for baseball, and has no young kids anymore, even I can see the benefits to everyone of an area set aside for young kids and their parents.

 

And I hope to someday bring all of my grandkids to Target Field and brainwash them into lifelong Twins and baseball fans. A play area seems to me a worthy accommodation to me ( and tens of thousands like me ) as well as an excellent investment for the Twins.

Not to mention MLB is already feeling the effects of not attracting a young audience(look at how many viagra commercials there are in a broadcast, now compare it to any other sport), they need to do everything they can to attract a younger audience, focusing on families just a tiny bit seems like an obvious no brainer, sure you might make a little bit less in beer sales in the present day, but you will make it up ten fold down the road.

[Squirrel]

A play area seems to me a worthy accommodation to me ( and tens of thousands like me ) as well as an excellent investment for the Twins.

Concur!

 

But I don't mind a bar, either. If it draws those obnoxious drunk folks out of the stands and into their own area, I'm okay with that, too.

[USAFChief]

Concur!

But I don't mind a bar, either. If it draws those obnoxious drunk folks out of the stands and into their own area, I'm okay with that, too.

Yeah, it doesn't seem to me to have to be one or the other.

 

And quite honestly, when I've been to other parks that have these "stand bars" they were a great place to spend a few innings.

[Parker Hageman]

Parker Hageman, on 26 Oct 2015 - 2:12 PM, said:

I honestly don't see the point of paying the amount to bring kids to the game and then have them play games in the concourse the entire time. Citi Field has a perfectly good section where they have wiffle ball, et al but if you are a parent, you can't watch the game from that corner. Why spend that kind of money on tickets when you can go to the neighborhood festival?

Great, you responded to a request absolutely no one made.

 

 

It most certainly was. The subject of the kid's area was broached by several commenters. 

 

Per drbob524: I don't like how Kauffman has an entire area for kids (the Little K, mini golf, fountain park) where you cant see the game at all.

 

Per TheLeviathan: No mini field to play on.

 

Per DaveW: The Royals have done a wonderful job in the regards of having some cool "family/kids" areas as well as having some awesome open bar areas for the adults as well. 

 

I was having a conversation with the community in regards to this topic. 

 

I hear you loud and clear on wanting some form of child distracting/entertainment area or amenities. In my opinion and experience, it's more of a want than a need. I'm sure they will eventually make some better space for families after all...

 

http://watchdog.org/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2015/10/Think-of-the-Children.jpg

 

 

[Otto von Ballpark]

Parker, where did anyone ask to have their kids play games "the entire time"? That is the point you were responding to that no one made. It's a strawman argument, that is no one's stated purpose for a kid's area, and it does nothing to help the discussion to assume that is anyone's motivation for the request.

 

Sorry, I should have just quoted your first sentence rather than first paragraph to make that clearer.

[TheLeviathan]

Also, boiling this down to wants vs needs seems a tad silly. For one, yes it's clearly a want. Two....another bar sure as hell isn't a need either.

[Parker Hageman]

Also, boiling this down to wants vs needs seems a tad silly. For one, yes it's clearly a want. Two....another bar sure as hell isn't a need either.

 

 

Exactly. This entire thread is silly.

 

After all, the entire discussion revolves around having a play space or a bar inside a billionaire's publicly funded stadium which we opt to invest our money and time following while children both locally and around the world are more concerned about having a roof over their head and food in their mouths. People are dying everyday. Famine. War. Genocide. Etc.

 

Yes, when we boil it down, it is definitely a tad silly.

 

 

[TheLeviathan]

Well, right, but for some of us that want a reason to bring our families to the game this is disappointing news.  I think it's fair to vent some frustration at that.

[launchingthrees]

From the twins perspective: They want young fans, they need young fans. Kids taking good memories into adulthood is good for the game's long-term health. Baseball will die the day it becomes unpalatable for young people(game length has been taken seriously for this very reason). If you polled season ticket holders I'd bet the vast majority were brought to significantly more games as children than the average person. 

 

Also who wants a baseball game to be boring for kids? Are we all scrooges now?

 

From a lot of adult fans: If your kids can't handle the game, don't bring them. The narcissism of some parents is befuddling. It isn't anyone elses responsibility to entertain your kids. You decided to have them. Why am I expected to sacrifice something for your offspring? When they are crying/yelling/whining/climbing all over the seats it detracts from the experience. 

 

Many in this thread have admitted that their kids aren't well behaved at the games, but for some reason they continue to bring them. Not only do they bring them, they demand extra amenities because... the world revolves around their kids!

 

Balancing those 2 ideas is a big challenge and I imagine there were some intense debates regarding how kids fit in with the fan experience at Target Field. I would have loved to be a fly on the wall in that room.

[TheLeviathan]

 

Many in this thread have admitted that their kids aren't well behaved at the games, but for some reason they continue to bring them. Not only do they bring them, they demand extra amenities because... the world revolves around their kids!

 

Literally no one has said this.  Target Field has nothing oriented for kids physically within the stadium and is adding a 45th bar.  The suggestion is that space might be better used for something the park doesn't have rather than another redundant thing it already does.

[Otto von Ballpark]

My kid is well behaved at games, just bored.

 

I actually haven't had many issues with obnoxious kids at the stadium, but to those that have: wouldn't you rather there was a playground tucked away in a hidden corner of the stadium for such kids?