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2016 Election Thread

TheLeviathan

By TheLeviathan
in The Sports Bar

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Willihammer Cedar Rapids Kernels

Willihammer

Provisional Member
Posted
Posted

This notion that jobs replaced by technology and organizational efficiency somehow lead to the same number of jobs else where in the market is a myth. Especially, in rural America. 

 

(We can't all go work at the local robot factory that built the robot that took our job).

Don't get hung up on the word "replace." Its not a seamless transition out of one job into another, obviously. It can be painful. But the fact is, on average, people have more job opportunities than they've ever had, in part thanks to innovation and cost-cutting.

 

Anyway I was trying to make a point about trade. Trump blames bad deals and Chinese cheating for manufacturing woes. I would argue he's half-right about that. But the answer to manufacturing unemployment isn't to back out of agreements or raise tariffs. All that does is invite the same action by other countries and then everyone loses. We tried tariffs in 1930, but unemployment rose, and exports tanked because former trading partners responded with their own tariffs. Its pretty simple to see why. And of course when you start picking and choosing who you'll trade what goods and services to, you very quickly piss off certain groups and before you know it there's war.

 

Its such a hamfisted approach, the GOP needs to attack Trump on this. It needs to offer specific, market friendly solutions for small towns and manufacturing towns that appeal to their need for self-sufficiency. At the same time people need to udnerstand the days of there being a job at the ole factory out of high school and a union pension 40 years later are gone and they're never coming back.

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Badsmerf Cedar Rapids Kernels

Badsmerf

Verified Member
Posted
Posted

I've been to a lot of desperate, no future small towns in the year in eastern Colorado, western Oklahoma, western Texas ect. It's sad really. Those people have nothing to look forward to. They have no agriculture to inject money into the local economy like Minnesota and Iowa do.

 

I live in small town Iowa but it's different. Farmers here (well I'm in Prague right now but you get) get 200 bushels an acre from corn and 80 from beans. They kill it. With that much money coming in, combined with a bunch of manufacturing all over the state, Iowa is very well off. The same explanations can't be used here as a general rule, however, at a smaller level the sentiment is the same.

 

The problem is, the Democrat party has failed to appeal to them. Many small town people don't like change. I'm generalizing, but they like the good old days and the nostalgia that comes with it. It's hard to accept that everything is changing and adapting. That is where the gop capitalized and took control is the message. A lot of them are religious too and always leaned Republican. Trump just spoke to them and ignited the darkside (anger, fear, hate).

 

Side note. I use Yoda quotes about the dark side with my religious wife all the time. If you follow Yoda, it very closely resembles Christian ideals. I tell her to use the force all the time, which of course she translates as God. It works for us.

Bark's Lounge Ft Myers Mighty Mussels

Bark's Lounge

Verified Member
Posted
Posted

This election could not be over soon enough. It is tiresome and a dark comedy animated movie that should go straight to video.

 

I'm a lefty, I cop to that with pride. I have no remorse.

 

If Clinton is elected prez, I believe the best way forward is for the 2 parties to fix this mess by ignoring the ultra conservative wings of their parties. I think the Tea Party is Medieval in it's thought process, and has no place in our society. The Ultra Left needs to be put on the back burner. I was and am supportive of the Bernie movement but it is not meant for this time. Maybe someday it will. Who knows, I am not a fortune teller.

 

I think if some parameters can be met between the two parties, maybe we can get back on some semblance of a track again.

 

As far as laws are concerned, it is a must to keep it secular. Abortion is a religious debate. Keep it out of the government. Laws should never be based on religion. No one likes abortions, but sometimes they are necessary to keep a person's head above water. People of devout faith will abstain and people who need a break will utilize. There are consequences to tough choices and everyone has to deal with it at some point in there life.

 

Don't negatively screw with SSI. Keep Social Security afloat and strengthen it. Many of us are going to be dependent on it. SSI does not need to be weakened and screwed with.

 

Other than that, work together, make compromises. Conservative ideas mixed with a some Progressive ideas with the expected provisions can work and we will probably be in a better place overall.

 

I believe this election exposed at least one thing. The education of a great majority of our people is bankrupt. Trump's base has revealed that to us.

 

Really, maybe this is the thing we should be most concerned about. It needs to be corrected.

 

A spotlight on how we educate our youth.

Craig Arko Minnesota Twins

Craig Arko

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

Heh, now Mr. Trump's cronies want to repeal the 19th Amendment.

 

If you can't win, cheat. By the way, Minnesota; not good.

 

post-1303-0-30274600-1476362873_thumb.png

Brock Beauchamp GOAT

Brock Beauchamp

Site Manager
Posted
Posted

Heh, now Mr. Trump's cronies want to repeal the 19th Amendment.

 

If you can't win, cheat.

It's best if we all just learn to ignore Twitter and the fringe lunatics that reside on that platform. The site is full of people who your racist uncle believe are too far gone to reclaim. All it does it conveniently reinforce the worst stereotypes of both sides and allow us to brush aside legitimate concerns voiced by not-crazy people.
Hosken Bombo Disco All-Star

Hosken Bombo Disco

Community Moderator
Posted
Posted

Now change the title of that electoral map to "Electoral college polling after Trump wins the second debate" and you will see what the alt-right diehard Trump supporters are seeing, or want to see, not much difference. The elites and career politicians are going to rig the election, remember. I can't blame anyone who is determined to vote for Trump because he is an outsider.

 

Little anything us TDers can do, but it seems like a better idea for people to actively prepare for the worst and see the Trump problem come to nothing, than to laugh about this stuff and then realize too late it's a huge problem. Might be too late already, though. Clinton can do her part by not laughing when Trump says something dangerous during a debate and address it on the spot instead. Stand up for herself at least when he makes a ridiculous personal attack.

gunnarthor MVP

gunnarthor

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

I hate this election.  We have real humanitarian concerns with the middle east refugees, more tension with Russia, flat-lining rural economic growth, practices of wall st banks and internet privacy concerns and the nominees are so ****ty that voters won't even get to vote on real issues.  Instead we get more and more stories about how unfit (duh!) Trump is and how crazy the GOP has become.  

 

Does anyone remember when the republican party had people like Arlen Specter and Jim Jeffords?

nicksaviking MVP

nicksaviking

Community Moderator
Posted
Posted

 

I hate this election.  We have real humanitarian concerns with the middle east refugees, more tension with Russia, flat-lining rural economic growth, practices of wall st banks and internet privacy concerns and the nominees are so ****ty that voters won't even get to vote on real issues.  Instead we get more and more stories about how unfit (duh!) Trump is and how crazy the GOP has become.  

 

Does anyone remember when the republican party had people like Arlen Specter and Jim Jeffords?

 

Didn't they both defect to the blue side before they died? Or perhaps defecting is what killed them?

Craig Arko Minnesota Twins

Craig Arko

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

Michele Obama. There's your wow moment in a good way.

I hope I get the chance to vote that lady into power some day. She would make an amazing leader.

Squirrel GOAT

Squirrel

Community Moderator
Posted
Posted

 

I hope I get the chance to vote that lady into power some day. She would make an amazing leader.

Yep.

Craig Arko Minnesota Twins

Craig Arko

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

I adore Obama but it'd to vote for another familial dynasty in this country.

I have no problem with that. They're still different people, as are Hillary and Bill. Quality is quality, and that's my driver.

Mike Sixel GOAT

Mike Sixel

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

 

Michelle Obama is marvelous and a great speaker.

But that doesn't make her a good choice as a leader either. Those aren't necessarily the same thing.

 

Marilyn Carlson Nelson showed that.....just look at that company now, if you squint, you can still see it....

nicksaviking MVP

nicksaviking

Community Moderator
Posted
Posted

 

I adore Obama but it'd to vote for another familial dynasty in this country.

 

Well at the very least, she'd be a hell of a lot of fun to tortuously dangle in front of the RNC if they don't get their act together.

 

She's also more well liked as a First Lady than Hillary was. Which I think is part of Hillary's problem now. People remember they didn't like her back in the day, but they forget it was quite possible it was due to a more misogynistic culture. Hilary was the first First Lady in decades that wasn't either a matronly grandmother-type figure, or a girl-next-door/housewife-type.

 

I remember personally giving her crap for Bill's indiscretions, likely because she just seemed like such a cold fish. Good lord that's awful, I wish my world view then was half of what it is today.

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