Rays trade Myers

[notoriousgod71]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/padres-acquire-wil-myers-in-complex-three-team-deal-233547912.html

 

Even though Friedman is no longer around, I bet TB does not get crucified for trading the untouchable Myers like KC did.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

^ that was also my first thought

[maxisagod]

I have no Idea why the Nats had to be part of this trade. Seems like the Rays could have gotten what the Nats ask for as part of the deal instead. I'd rather have Joe Ross and Trea Turner then the guys Tampa got from The Nationals. 

[gunnarthor]

Dayton Moore sure got a better haul.

[nater79a]

I have no Idea why the Nats had to be part of this trade. Seems like the Rays could have gotten what the Nats ask for as part of the deal instead. I'd rather have Joe Ross and Trea Turner then the guys Tampa got from The Nationals. 

 

My thoughts too. I think the Nats' came out very well in this deal. Two former 1st round picks in Ross and Turner.

[USAFChief]

It does make you wonder...what's the deal with Myers?

 

Too much swing and miss seems like the obvious answer, but that's just it, it's too obvious. Tampa surely knew that when they traded for him, as does San Diego now.

[biggentleben]

I like Souza, and the word coming out was that Tampa had been shopping Myers hard since midseason, so even before the new regime, Myers was falling out of favor apparently.  Souza likely gives them 2013 Myers production and better defense with a similar injury risk as Myers.  

 

I do really like the Nationals return in this, though, and there's little else in baseball I despise more than the Nationals winning a trade...

[TheLeviathan]

It does make you wonder...what's the deal with Myers?

 

Too much swing and miss seems like the obvious answer, but that's just it, it's too obvious. Tampa surely knew that when they traded for him, as does San Diego now.

 

Yeah, that can't miss blue-chip label has become quite tarnished.  I wonder if there is an attitude issue or something behind the scenes that you don't get from scouting a guy but only from being around him up close and personal.

[markos]

Yeah, that can't miss blue-chip label has become quite tarnished.  I wonder if there is an attitude issue or something behind the scenes that you don't get from scouting a guy but only from being around him up close and personal.

He just might not be the player everyone thought he was in the minors. There was a very good article by Dave Cameron about Myers this week: http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/just-a-bit-outside/story/wil-myers-flaws-trade-rays-royals-padres-121714

 

To sum up, he basically argues that Myers doesn't make enough contact or hit for enough power to be productive enough to man a corner position. If he can improve one skill or the other, he will be okay. But this same combination of skills (low contact, medium power) is basically what doomed former top prospects like Justin Smoak and Dominic Brown. Interesting quote at the end:

 

 

There's certainly still upside with Myers, but there's probably more risk there than was previously acknowledged. Perhaps the Rays might eventually regret selling low on Myers coming off a wasted season, but at this point, I might be more inclined to believe that the Royals saw this coming and sold high on Myers two winters ago in a trade that I crushed them for making at the time.

 

Also, I really like this deal for the Nationals. They already have one of the best teams in baseball, but they have done a great job of reloading their farm system. 

[Mike Sixel]

A. Keith Law ripped TB, not sure why everyone is so hung up on stuff like this.....(he ripped them for not just getting the players the Nats did....., not for trading Meyers in the first place, though he still believes Meyers can be good or great)

 

B. Nationals win, easily. Easily.

 

C. Shows what I've been saying.....even high ranked prospects don't always work out, sometimes you should be willing to deal them for proven MLB players......

 

D. Maybe KC isn't so dumb, as some of us said at the time.

 

E. Dave Cameron has never been as high on Meyers as the industry. But, I did enjoy that article yesterday

[jokin]

 

 

 

D. Maybe KC isn't so dumb, as some of us said at the time.

 

E. Dave Cameron has never been as high on Meyers as the industry. But, I did enjoy that article yesterday

 

I remember writing at the time that Dayton Moore had had a series of head-scratching moves over the years and it made we wonder how he had kept his job, and that this Myers trade was a somewhat desperate attempt to save his job.  It was within the context of the Twins trading a top prospect for an Ace, without a certain path to a contract extension.  Moreover, I surmised that Wade Davis might be the sleeper out of the trade (little did I know, Moore saw a lot more out of him than I could have imagined).

 

And then he resumed his head-scratching ways this off-season, apparently just to see if we're still paying attention???  A great Jeff Sullivan article in Fangraphs today, The Royals Spending Poorly Wisely, ends up making the case that he's doing the things a mid-market team has to do to sustain making a succession of World Series runs:

 

 

 

They committed $17 million to Kendrys Morales. They committed $11 million to Alex Rios. And, most recently, they committed $20 million to Edinson Volquez. This is what the World Series has meant, in a way. It’s rather underwhelming.

You have to fight the urge to snark. It’s so, so impossibly easy to snark. That’s forty-eight million dollars. That’s a starting pitcher, a starting outfielder, and a starting DH. Last season, Morales, Rios, and Volquez were worth a combined -0.8 WAR. So, $48 million, toward guys who, combined, were slightly worse than replacement-level. The blogposts write themselves. In that sense Moore’s acting like a caricature of an irresponsible GM.

You don’t even need the fancy stats to make the case. Morales was a DH who slugged .338. Rios was a corner outfielder who hit four home runs in a hitter-friendly environment. Volquez was among the 20 worst starting pitchers in K-BB%, and while K-BB% is something of an unfamiliar statistic, all it is is walk rate subtracted from strikeout rate, and those are basic numbers. Morales was bad. Rios was bad. Volquez was not real good, ERA aside.                                                                                                                                                                So what gives? In two cases, Moore’s paying for a bounceback. You could argue he’s spending on projections...It seems to me like inefficient spending. But there are some mitigating points here, so that Moore doesn’t get overwhelmed by an avalanche of internet mockery....To Moore’s credit, he understands that free agency isn’t a good place to modify a roster if you’re looking to make a splash. Free agency is where you find the most inefficient contracts... they’re still not going to be a big-spending operation. Moore made some tweaks, and I don’t much care for any of them, but now holes are plugged, and no one’s blocking anyone. The team core’s intact. The system’s intact.

[Mike Sixel]

Just read the Sullivan article....in context of having some good AA and AAA SP, and in wanting to limit the years of the contracts....the contracts look less bad. Not ideal, but less bad.

[nicksaviking]

 

To sum up, he basically argues that Myers doesn't make enough contact or hit for enough power to be productive enough to man a corner position. If he can improve one skill or the other, he will be okay. But this same combination of skills (low contact, medium power) is basically what doomed former top prospects like Justin Smoak and Dominic Brown. Interesting quote at the end:

 

 

Well he just moved to Petco Park, so that increase in power isn't looking to optimistic.

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

I think if these are viewed as two separate trades -

 

1) Myers and Hanigan to SD for Rene Rivera and a boatload of SD's prospects. 

2) Souza to Tampa for one of SD's prospects and one of Tampa's prospects.  

 

Tampa gets a replacement for Myers in Souza and a bunch of prospects and only gave up one notable prospect of their own. The fact that the prospect Trea Turner is moving from SD to Washington means a kind of savings for Tampa.

 

I think the Nationals got involved so the Rays could acquire a replacement for Myers that San Diego couldn't or wouldn't put in the deal.

[TheLeviathan]

I think Myers' problem is that he hits like a CF but can't play the position.  For all the huffing and puffing about trading such an elite talent for Shields back in the day, that move looks incredibly shrewd at this point.

 

Hell, this one might for Tampa too in a few years.

[diehardtwinsfan]

I think the criticism on Moore is that he went all in on the green square for the roulette wheel. Given that they made it to the WS this season, I think the gambled paid off (whether it was a wise gamble is the debate most of us had with it).

 

That said, I echo Levi on this one. Got to think there's something going on behind the scenes that doesn't show up in a scouting report. KC saw enough to make a crazy gamble, and TB flat out sold low. Perhaps the guys they got turn into stars, but they took on quite a bit more risk then the potential reward.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I think the criticism on Moore is that he went all in on the green square for the roulette wheel. Given that they made it to the WS this season, I think the gambled paid off (whether it was a wise gamble is the debate most of us had with it).

Pretty much this. It paid off but had it not, Moore would look extremely foolish right now. My biggest concern with Shields was never 2014, it was the attempt to gain 20+ wins in a single season and wasting 1/2 of Shields' service time.

 

But no need to rehash that debate for the fortieth time.

 

This is an interesting situation. It's possible that Myers is a problem player and this doesn't bode well for his future. Traded twice already and now stuck in PETCO, a park that can kill the power numbers of even elite players.

 

Classifying him as a corner OF who hits like a CF is patently unfair. The guy slugged .478 his rookie season and .522 in the minors. In his MiLB career, his lowest SLG was .393. Is he a powerhouse? No, but given his walk rate and gap power, he's more than a CF who can't play CF.

[TheLeviathan]

Every acquisition is a spin on the roulette wheel.  The real truth is that people have too much prospect love and Moore hate and the two combined into a ridiculous overreaction to that deal.

[Linus]

I don't think there is too much prospect love in baseball, at least not like the NFL where they won't trade a draft pick for anything.  If I was an NFL GM I would trade my picks every year - you can get proven NFL players for low round picks.

 

If you want a proven MLB talent, you still have to pony up plenty of prospects.

[TheLeviathan]

I don't think there is too much prospect love in baseball, at least not like the NFL where they won't trade a draft pick for anything.  If I was an NFL GM I would trade my picks every year - you can get proven NFL players for low round picks.

 

If you want a proven MLB talent, you still have to pony up plenty of prospects.

 

I meant as far as fans evaluating the deal.  Fans overrate prospects and love to hate certain guys and Moore is chief among them.

 

So you combine Moore and dealing a blue-chip prospect and you get the silliness that ensued.  

[benji21]

 

 

I do really like the Nationals return in this, though, and there's little else in baseball I despise more than the Nationals winning a trade...

Yikes, you really gotta watch out when trading with this team, they're pretty savvy.

[kab21]

I think it's funny how people jump on and off a particular prospect bandwagon so quickly.

 

Myers wasn't as good as he was portrayed in the Shield's discussion analysis nor is he as bad as some portray him in this trade analysis. 

 

I like this move by the Padres.  The Rays seem to have sold low but it's possible that Souza continues hitting the crap out of the ball in the majors.  It's possible that Souza and Myers end up as similar players.  A lot of swing and miss but also raw power.

 

Obviously it was a great trade for the Nats also.