Doug Mientkiewicz.

[Mr. Brooks]

Does anyone else find hypocrisy between how they plan to handle this as opposed to how they handled Sano?

 

I'm not sure how you look a prospect in the eyes and tell them you are going to hold them accountable for their actions, meanwhile letting the manager do whatever he wants.

 

The manager fighting another manager on the field in the middle of a game seems like something out of a bad baseball comedy. The fact it happened in real life should be embarrassing to the organization. This is 1000x more serious and egregious of an incident than pimping a HR, IMO.

 

I can't believe that Ryan actually said the following without realizing the irony in his own statement:

 

 

“Doug is very emotional, I can tell you that,” Ryan said. “He’s very protective. His philosophy is to do things right, even at the expense of a player having to sit for awhile. Players need to learn how to play the game correctly. Doug can teach.”

 

 

[Monkeypaws]

I think managers are held to a different standard - many great managers like Martin and Weaver had plenty of fire. I don't mind this too much, especially in the low minors.

[Mr. Brooks]

I think managers are held to a different standard - many great managers like Martin and Weaver had plenty of fire. I don't mind this too much, especially in the low minors.

 

Nothing wrong with having fire. You have to be a professional though. Getting into a fight on the field with the opposing manager is childish at best. IMO, it's even worse in the low minors, where you are supposed to be teaching young prospects how to behave like a pro.

 

You really think Miguel Sano takes them seriously now about handling his emotions in a respectful manner, after seeing this kind of behavior from a manager go unpunished?

 

"Hey kid, do as we say, not as we do". Good luck with that one Twins.

[big dog]

Mint was protecting his players. How is that anything like showing up another team?

[Mr. Brooks]

Mint was protecting his players. How is that anything like showing up another team?

 

I guess I wasn't aware that fighting the opposing manager on the field is the preferred method of protecting your players.

What was he protecting them from? Did one of them have a gun? A knife?

 

Anyways, it seems that I'm clearly in the minority here, so I guess I stand corrected.

[Don't Feed the Greed Guy]

Mientkiewicz's behavior will likely result in a suspension by the Florida State League. This is the body that will play judge, jury and prosecution in this case, not Terry Ryan. Pimping after a home run is not going to result in a suspension by the Eastern League. One suspension is an external matter, subject to league policies. The other is an internal matter, handled from within the Twins organization. That doesn't mean that Ryan didn't take Mientkiewicz behind the woodshed for a good verbal lashing. Mientkiewicz deserves it. We just won't read about it.

[old nurse]

So was Dougie Baseball just supposed to be sitting in the dugout? The video posted did not show the instigating of the brawl or how he ended up on the bottom. The response to someone physically going after you should be what? Your conclusions are based on what?

[Mr. Brooks]

So was Dougie Baseball just supposed to be sitting in the dugout? The video posted did not show the instigating of the brawl or how he ended up on the bottom. The response to someone physically going after you should be what? Your conclusions are based on what?

 

If the reports are true, it was Dougie who charged the opposing manager.

You are correct that I was not there, and the beginning of the brawl is not captured on video, so if the reports at this time are inaccurate, and Dougie was just defending himself, then obviously that is a completely different situation.

 

The incident may have been payback for a play Friday in which Gamache bowled over Miracle catcher Jairo Rodriguez at the plate, Zimmerman said, and when Kremblas objected from the top step of the dugout, Mientkiewicz ran toward him, and they began fighting near home plate.

 

Mientkiewicz fights with opposing manager | Star Tribune

 

Like I said though, I'm clearly in the minority, so I guess it's not as big of a deal as I thought it was.

I guess to me the thought of opposing managers fighting on the field mid game has too much of a WWE feel to it, and it's not something you see big league managers doing. I don't like it, but that is just me I guess.

[drjim]

I think it can be a cause for concern, especially if it is a pattern of behavior. But taking that and thinking it will have any impact of the likes of Sano is a massive leap. The way you phrase it makes it seem you have little respect for Sano and are desperate to paint the organization in a bad light - I highly doubt that is your intention.

[Mr. Brooks]

I think it can be a cause for concern, especially if it is a pattern of behavior. But taking that and thinking it will have any impact of the likes of Sano is a massive leap. The way you phrase it makes it seem you have little respect for Sano and are desperate to paint the organization in a bad light - I highly doubt that is your intention.

 

No, thats not it at all. It just seems they are talking out of one side of their mouth to Sano: "Be a professional, don't let your emotions get out of control", and the other to Dougie: "Hey, you couldn't keep your cool so you charged the opposing manager, and started a fight with him on the field, that is totally professional behavior, well done!"

 

I guess I don't understand how you can expect a young guy like Sano to take you seriously in that case.

[Siehbiscuit]

Personally, I see this as a father protecting his kids. The game before he felt that Friday's tactics towards Rodriguez, his catcher were out of line. He voiced his opinion and no one knows what was said, but it sounds like it pushed Mientkiewicz over the line. I'm sure Mientkiewicz wishes he hadn't boiled over, but at the same time as a father, protecting my family is top priority. The young men he teaches, takes crazy long bus rides with and spends countless hours are more than just players to him. It would be awfully difficult to not be emotionally attached and that's where the wanting to protect them comes in. Did he get in a fight? Yes. Was it unprofessional? Probably. Do his players no that Dougie Baseball has got their backs 100% of the time? Absolutely!

 

He'll serve a league mandated suspension. But for the team and organization it was well worth it.

[Mike Sixel]

So, violence when someone is yelling is a good idea? Really, that's what people are arguing here? BS. Violence is not the answer to someone yelling at you or your family or your team.

 

yes, it looks like hypocrosy to me. Same thing when the Vikings let Cook stay on the team (becasue he's good, let be honest), and cut bad players for lesser offenses.

 

No, it was not well worth it. It was immature. It was unproffessional. It was not how people should behave in the world, not to make the world a better place.

[DaveW]

I actually like this, a lot. This team has played the "Mr. Nice guy" role for too long, nothing wrong at all about having fire, and this has absolutely nothing to do with the Sano showing up the other team incident. The equivalent would have been if Sano would have rushed the mound to protect a team-mate or whatever.

 

Dougie prob didn't handle it the best way, but you better believe his players will rally behind him for this. Also, nobody knows what was said, and obviously there is no real excuse for violence, but lets be honest, there are a few phrases that would get 99% of men to go after someone if they were said, who knows what was said? People didn't get all uspet that Melo went after Garnett after what he said....so let's hold a bit of judgement until we find out all the details.

 

To compare this and the Sano issue is overall pretty ridiculous. By all accounts Mint has been a good manager, what do you all want, for him to be fired over this or something?

[Mike Sixel]

No, we wanted Sano not to be punished for doing what Ortiz, and dozens of other MLB players do. If the team is going to be all holier than thou, then it should be all holier than thou with everyone, not just three latin players this year (which seem to be the only ones anyone has really talked about, oddly).

[Halsey Hall]

Does anyone else find hypocrisy between how they plan to handle this as opposed to how they handled Sano?

 

No, I don't. I don't mind at all.

[big dog]

I guess I wasn't aware that fighting the opposing manager on the field is the preferred method of protecting your players.

What was he protecting them from? Did one of them have a gun? A knife?

 

 

He had a player barrelled over the night before, his pitcher nicks the guy who did it. That happens in the majors all the time. Running after the other manager was an idiot move, no question, but he's a first-time manager and he made a mistake in an effort to fight for his guys. Totally different than Sano.

 

I'm not saying Dougie was right- far from it, and I won't complain about the suspension- but I'm sure he did it because he thought he was protecting his guys. I won't complain about that.

[Mr. Brooks]

I actually like this, a lot. This team has played the "Mr. Nice guy" role for too long, nothing wrong at all about having fire, and this has absolutely nothing to do with the Sano showing up the other team incident. The equivalent would have been if Sano would have rushed the mound to protect a team-mate or whatever.

 

Dougie prob didn't handle it the best way, but you better believe his players will rally behind him for this. Also, nobody knows what was said, and obviously there is no real excuse for violence, but lets be honest, there are a few phrases that would get 99% of men to go after someone if they were said, who knows what was said? People didn't get all uspet that Melo went after Garnett after what he said....so let's hold a bit of judgement until we find out all the details.

 

To compare this and the Sano issue is overall pretty ridiculous. By all accounts Mint has been a good manager, what do you all want, for him to be fired over this or something?

 

That's fine. Do what you have to do, but then be accountable for it.

I'm guessing that if you started a physical altercation with someone at your workplace, you would have to face some consequences from your boss, regardless of whether the guy deserved it or not.

 

Hell, your boss might even tell you that he understands and respects WHY you did what you did, but that you are still going to have to take a few days off.

 

I liken it to confronting a man at a bar who makes an inappropriate comment at your wife/girlfriend.

Was it justified? It might have been, depending on what was said.

Did you do the right thing? Probably. Sometimes you weigh the need to defend your family versus the consequences, and decide that the consequences are worth it.

Are you still going to jail if you instigate a fight? You probably are. The cop might even say something like, "I would have done the same thing buddy, but you know I still have to take you in."

 

And hell no, of course I don't want Dougie fired. I love having him in the organization and have said so in here multiple times. This doesn't change that. I think he needs a few games off to show there is no double standard though.

[Pius Jefferson]

How Dougie B handled this was incorrect and juvenille. The why he felt it necessary is similar to Sano one upping the team that had thrown at him earlier in the game.

[nicksaviking]

I tend to agree with the OP. Both moves were bush league. What if it wasn't the manager but a young prospect that attacked a member of the other team on the dugout steps to "protect" his teammates? Both moves were basically vigilantism; an effort to teach the other team a lesson.

 

Just because they are both bush moves, doesn't mean the front office is being hypocritical though. We don't know if the Twins plan any repercussions. Yet. That being said, Ryan wasn't shy about publicly dressing down Sano. That doesn't look to be in the cards with Mientkiewicz though ripping the manager to the media is an easy way to get his players to disregard anything he teaches them.

[DaveW]

That's fine. Do what you have to do, but then be accountable for it.

I'm guessing that if you started a physical altercation with someone at your workplace, you would have to face some consequences from your boss, regardless of whether the guy deserved it or not.

 

Hell, your boss might even tell you that he understands and respects WHY you did what you did, but that you are still going to have to take a few days off.

 

I liken it to confronting a man at a bar who makes an inappropriate comment at your wife/girlfriend.

Was it justified? It might have been, depending on what was said.

Did you do the right thing? Probably. Sometimes you weigh the need to defend your family versus the consequences, and decide that the consequences are worth it.

Are you still going to jail if you instigate a fight? You probably are. The cop might even say something like, "I would have done the same thing buddy, but you know I still have to take you in."

 

And hell no, of course I don't want Dougie fired. I love having him in the organization and have said so in here multiple times. This doesn't change that. I think he needs a few games off to show there is no double standard though.

He is going to get a few days off since he will be suspended. Thus the punishment fits the crime, no more will need to be done. Also the Twins probably aren't trying to make this a huge story (just like they were with Sano, however everyone decided to take with it and turn it into a huge story)

 

Again the Sano thing got blown out of proportion because the media (and websites) decided to make it into a huge deal since there were literally zero other sports going on. I would bet if Sano got benched during Sept while the Vikings were going on, you wouldn't see more than a blurb in the paper about it, or more than 5 minutes dedicated to it on the radio.

 

Also brawls in baseball are AWESOME! Showing up the other team is not awesome.

 

Pedro Throwing fat zimmer down=Awesome

Nolan Ryan punching Ventura= Awesome

Slow home run trots= Not awesome

[DaveW]

I tend to agree with the OP. Both moves were bush league. What if it wasn't the manager but a young prospect that attacked a member of the other team on the dugout steps to "protect" his teammates? Both moves were basically vigilantism; an effort to teach the other team a lesson.

 

Just because they are both bush moves, doesn't mean the front office is being hypocritical though. We don't know if the Twins plan any repercussions. Yet. That being said, Ryan wasn't shy about publicly dressing down Sano. That doesn't look to be in the cards with Mientkiewicz though ripping the manager to the media is an easy way to get his players to disregard anything he teaches them.

He didn't publically dress down Sano, and he was pretty critical FYI of Mientkiewicz when it happened, basically saying "it was wrong, he knows it was wrong etc" the whole Sano "issue" came up when Sano basically didn't admit what he was doing was wrong, which irked the manager. Being apologetic goes a long ways.

[Mr. Brooks]

I tend to agree with the OP. Both moves were bush league. What if it wasn't the manager but a young prospect that attacked a member of the other team on the dugout steps to "protect" his teammates? Both moves were basically vigilantism; an effort to teach the other team a lesson.

 

Just because they are both bush moves, doesn't mean the front office is being hypocritical though. We don't know if the Twins plan any repercussions. Yet. That being said, Ryan wasn't shy about publicly dressing down Sano. That doesn't look to be in the cards with Mientkiewicz though ripping the manager to the media is an easy way to get his players to disregard anything he teaches them.

 

First off, we DO know that the Twins are not planning any repercussions. Terry Ryan stated that there would not be any further punishment from the team.

 

But, I guess I can buy the bolded.

Perhaps the team would have suspended him if the league was not going to, but they feel that the league suspension is enough, so they are satisfied with that.

Personally, I still think it's a bit hypocritical. I still would have liked to see them sit him down for even one game, just to send a message that they expect their employees to behave like professionals.

[Willihammer]

Minor League direct Brad Steil did have this to say:

 

“Doug knows that’s not the example we want him to set for our players. He is a very competitive guy, and he let his emotions get the better of him. He was very apologetic for what happened, both to me and to the team. He realizes that’s not how we want him to represent the Minnesota Twins.”

 

I'm a little sketchy on the details but I probably would have lost my lid if I were in Dougie's position. Day 1, his catcher gets bowled over at the plate (some more details here would be nice - was he blocking the plate?)

 

Day two a Miracle pitcher "brushes back" an opposition player in clear retaliation.

 

Ideally, the pitcher hits the Bradenton batter square in the ribs and that settles the issue, but the pitch missed and when the Bradenton manager stepped out of the dugout to yell something at Dougie, then Dougie decided to take the retaliation into his own hands I guess.

 

I think I am fine with all of this, especially if the initial Maurader takeout of the Miracle catcher was unnecessary or vicious.

[Mr. Brooks]

Minor League direct Brad Steil did have this to say:

 

 

 

I'm a little sketchy on the details but I probably would have lost my lid if I were in Dougie's position. Day 1, his catcher gets bowled over at the plate (some more details here would be nice - was he blocking the plate?)

 

Day two a Miracle pitcher "brushes back" an opposition player in clear retaliation.

 

Ideally, the pitcher hits the Bradenton batter square in the ribs and that settles the issue, but the pitch missed and when the Bradenton manager stepped out of the dugout to yell something at Dougie, then Dougie decided to take the retaliation into his own hands I guess.

 

I think I am fine with all of this, especially if the initial Maurader takeout of the Miracle catcher was unnecessary or vicious.

 

It's nice to see Brad Steil call him out on it.

Personally I think it warrants sitting him down for a game, but short of that I think this is a good statement by Steil. This is really all I wanted to see, the Twins making it known that he behaved in an unprofessional manner and that behavior is not acceptable.

[ThePuck]

It's nice to see Brad Steil call him out on it.

Personally I think it warrants sitting him down for a game, but short of that I think this is a good statement by Steil. This is really all I wanted to see, the Twins making it known that he behaved in an unprofessional manner and that behavior is not acceptable.

 

Hmmm. I don't think they had much of a choice even if they had no issue with it...which they very likely did.

[jimbo92107]

No, thats not it at all. It just seems they are talking out of one side of their mouth to Sano: "Be a professional, don't let your emotions get out of control", and the other to Dougie: "Hey, you couldn't keep your cool so you charged the opposing manager, and started a fight with him on the field, that is totally professional behavior, well done!"

 

I guess I don't understand how you can expect a young guy like Sano to take you seriously in that case.

 

Really? You see no difference between pimping a home run versus defending your players from being targeted for damage?

 

Nobody's arguing that Doug Mientkiewicz handled the situation with diplomatic aplomb, but when you think your boys are being pushed around, you've got to do something, or they'll get pushed around by everybody. You've got to watch out for players and teams that try to play dominance games with you, like the Yankees do to the Twins. Otherwise, they'll take your lunch money. Like the Yankees do to the Twins.

[Mr. Brooks]

Really? You see no difference between pimping a home run versus defending your players from being targeted for damage?

 

Nobody's arguing that Doug Mientkiewicz handled the situation with diplomatic aplomb, but when you think your boys are being pushed around, you've got to do something, or they'll get pushed around by everybody. You've got to watch out for players and teams that try to play dominance games with you, like the Yankees do to the Twins. Otherwise, they'll take your lunch money. Like the Yankees do to the Twins.

 

And the ONLY way to stick up for your players is with physical violence huh?

It's funny then that you don't see any other manager, at any level doing this. I guess Dougie is just the only manager at any level of baseball that sticks up for his players.

[DaveW]

And the ONLY way to stick up for your players is with physical violence huh?

It's funny then that you don't see any other manager, at any level doing this. I guess Dougie is just the only manager at any level of baseball that sticks up for his players.

 

I'm pretty sure Joe Girardi was about 3 inches away from punching that ump in the face last night if you watch the replay.

 

Also, MLB managers are disproportionately old or fat, or often times both. Old fat dudes don't make for good fighters as they will most likely break a hip.

[big dog]

And the ONLY way to stick up for your players is with physical violence huh?

It's funny then that you don't see any other manager, at any level doing this. I guess Dougie is just the only manager at any level of baseball that sticks up for his players.

 

That's not accurate at all. It's rare, but he's far from the only manager to do this. LaRussa and someone got into it a couple years ago. Anyone remember Don Zimmer rushing the mound to try and get a piece of Pedro Martinez? This doesn't happen often, but it certainly happens.

 

Look, there are two issues here. Was he out of control and inappropriate? Of course. Was he trying to act in the best interest of his players? I think so. Don't say he was out of control, and therefore it's the same as Sano. Sano's act was less idiotic by far, but the motivation was not team-oriented.

[Mr. Brooks]

That's not accurate at all. It's rare, but he's far from the only manager to do this. LaRussa and someone got into it a couple years ago. Anyone remember Don Zimmer rushing the mound to try and get a piece of Pedro Martinez? This doesn't happen often, but it certainly happens.

 

Look, there are two issues here. Was he out of control and inappropriate? Of course. Was he trying to act in the best interest of his players? I think so. Don't say he was out of control, and therefore it's the same as Sano. Sano's act was less idiotic by far, but the motivation was not team-oriented.

 

Fair enough.

I can accept that it doesnt merit a team punishment, I guess.

I've cooled on it since someone in the organization called him out on it (Steil).

Terry Ryan's comments practically defended him, they werent sharp enough, IMO. But I'm glad Steil's were.