The Twins Should Be Glad They Didn't Trade for Zach Neto at the Deadline

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, Seth Stohs said:

It wouldn't have. The Angels made Neto available only in an attempt to get a top, top prospect. It wasn't to trade Neto, it was to see if they could get a team to give up a top, top prospect. 

Of course, they asked for Walker Jenkins. Every team would. Geez, the Mets probably asked for Jenkins in the initial AJ Minter conversations.

More evidence the Angels front office is doing a terrible job

[Hunter4848]

3 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

You need to actually examine that statement.  Take a look at Tampa and Cleveland's track record trading for established players vs established players.   The ratio 8 or 10:1  Milwaukee is not far behind.  Trading for established players plays a VERY small role in the success of these teams.  Trading for prospects plays a major role.

That assumes you actually draft good players and develop them correctly which the Twins have a poor record of doing. 

Regardless trading unproven commodities for proven commodities is definitely a better strategy...

[Seth Stohs]

21 minutes ago, Hunter4848 said:

That assumes you actually draft good players and develop them correctly which the Twins have a poor record of doing. 

Regardless trading unproven commodities for proven commodities is definitely a better strategy...

That's true... so in reality, maybe they should have just traded Jenkins for Minter since he's unproven and Minter is proven. 

[Hunter4848]

6 hours ago, Seth Stohs said:

That's true... so in reality, maybe they should have just traded Jenkins for Minter since he's unproven and Minter is proven. 

Laugh all you want, but years of prospect hoarding has given Twins fans nothing to be excited for...

But I guess you can keep getting suckered by the Pohlads over and over again!

[saviking]

NIETO

[jmlease1]

11 hours ago, Seth Stohs said:

It wouldn't have. The Angels made Neto available only in an attempt to get a top, top prospect. It wasn't to trade Neto, it was to see if they could get a team to give up a top, top prospect. 

Of course, they asked for Walker Jenkins. Every team would. Geez, the Mets probably asked for Jenkins in the initial AJ Minter conversations.

I doubt the Mets asked for Jenkins in any conversation for Minter, unless they were obviously joking, because they didn't want the Twins hanging up on them and saying "these people are disconnected with reality" to everyone else around the league too. There's aiming high and then there's being insulting. Literally no team does that trade, even Dombrowski, who never saw a prospect he wouldn't deal, would have laughed at that and called them stupid.

The different between Neto and Minter as a trade chip is night and day. Come on.

I wouldn't have sent out Jenkins in a package for Neto either. With Culpepper and Houston both looking so good, I'm unclear why the Twins were supposedly so in on Neto, but either way, Jenkins was never going to be the centerpiece for that kind of deal: it would have had to have been Culpepper or Houston as the prime piece and that's probably not enough from the Angel's perspective. Now, the Angels have been terrible in almost every aspect , so who knows?

[tony&rodney]

FWIW, Dan Hayes stated that the Twins asked around about a number of players and asked the Angels what they would want for Zach Neto. The response ended the conversation. Hayes did not say the Angels asked for Jenkins. The names suggested were a turn off and the discussion ended is what I understand.

I always think it is interesting to follow the careers of these names mentioned over the years.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

21 hours ago, bean5302 said:

@Dave Lemke care you expand on your disagreement?

I'm not Dave -  but I would definitely take a young Greg Gagne over Neto any day of the week fwar aside.  I think Guzman and Neto are a push.  

As to Houston and Culpepper - both of their hit tools are better - much less strikeout risk in both.  Houston will definitely provide better defense and Culpeper I will state would be pretty similar although that one is up for debate.  As of now the projection is Neto provides more power but I am not sure 1. he can continue it  2. that Houston or Culpepper can't meet it.  Neto's contract will now start to increase as he is in the arbitration years.   So when the upside is much better on both a Houston and a Culpepper and you are effectively get a good but not great player in his current form and that may already be trending down I don't see the appeal for what would have been a massive haul.  They had started with Jenkins and the haul would have been multiple players,  not just a Culpepper for Houston straight up.   

[bean5302]

Here is Zach Neto for the experts who've never watched him play, but know he's a bad fielder.

Depending on your metric, either Neto is an exceptional shortstop, a below average shortstop or a bad shortstop. 

Brooks Lee adjusted for Neto's innings based on seasons 1-3
DRS = -3, -18, -22
OAA = -7, -2, -16
FRV = -7, -2, -13

I haven't watched Neto which is why I defer to the the metrics. Metrics I've actually took time to learn about unlike most people who absolutely steadfastly support a particular metric they don't understand. OAA/FRV didn't exist in Gagne's era. Neither did DRS, but DRS is a lot closer to the TZ factor used to evaluate Gagne.

 

[Major League Ready]

13 hours ago, Hunter4848 said:

That assumes you actually draft good players and develop them correctly which the Twins have a poor record of doing. 

Regardless trading unproven commodities for proven commodities is definitely a better strategy...

There are two dominate teams from small markets this year.  (Milwaukee and Tampa)  How many of their top producing or even average players were acquired as proven MLB players?  Since I assume you will ignore te any facts that don't support your narrative, I will give you the answer.  Zero.  How many were acquired before they were proven and by proven, I mean had even one season of average production?  The answer is six for Milwaukee and six for Tampa.

[Hunter4848]

1 hour ago, Major League Ready said:

There are two dominate teams from small markets this year.  (Milwaukee and Tampa)  How many of their top producing or even average players were acquired as proven MLB players?  Since I assume you will ignore te any facts that don't support your narrative, I will give you the answer.  Zero.  How many were acquired before they were proven and by proven, I mean had even one season of average production?  The answer is six for Milwaukee and six for Tampa.

Are either of those teams the Twins?! Exactly...

[Major League Ready]

24 minutes ago, Hunter4848 said:

Are either of those teams the Twins?! Exactly...

No.  They are not the Twins.  They are the model of success for any modest revenue team.  Do you want them to follow a less successful strategy because they have not executed the type of plan these teams follow or do you want them to become better at the model with the greatest chance of success?

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

5 hours ago, bean5302 said:

Here is Zach Neto for the experts who've never watched him play, but know he's a bad fielder.

Depending on your metric, either Neto is an exceptional shortstop, a below average shortstop or a bad shortstop. 

Brooks Lee adjusted for Neto's innings based on seasons 1-3
DRS = -3, -18, -22
OAA = -7, -2, -16
FRV = -7, -2, -13

I haven't watched Neto which is why I defer to the the metrics. Metrics I've actually took time to learn about unlike most people who absolutely steadfastly support a particular metric they don't understand. OAA/FRV didn't exist in Gagne's era. Neither did DRS, but DRS is a lot closer to the TZ factor used to evaluate Gagne.

 

His fielding even coming out of college was considered average at best.  Even if there is discrepancy in how being reviewed no one claims he is a high end defensive shortstop.   I have a co worker who says the best of Zach Neto is likely behind him even though he is 25.  He thinks his defense is average to below average.   He says he strikes out to much. I get the sense similar to Sano.  Also if his defensive is no longer adequate his offensive bat isn't going to be as valuable at 2nd or 3rd base.    His value is almost entirely created from his 20 home runs.  Its effectively Clemens.   

The issue is you created a time period and there is a reasonable conclusion someone could value one of the other shortstops in the last 40 years more than Neto.  Personally I think WAR has overvalued Neto in my opinion.  But thats my opinion which is why I would take Gagne over Neto and Guzman is close but I likely take Neto but its not a massive difference.  

[Major League Ready]

21 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

His fielding even coming out of college was considered average at best.  Even if there is discrepancy in how being reviewed no one claims he is a high end defensive shortstop.   I have a co worker who says the best of Zach Neto is likely behind him even though he is 25.  He thinks his defense is average to below average.   He says he strikes out to much. I get the sense similar to Sano.  Also if his defensive is no longer adequate his offensive bat isn't going to be as valuable at 2nd or 3rd base.    His value is almost entirely created from his 20 home runs.  Its effectively Clemens.   

The issue is you created a time period and there is a reasonable conclusion someone could value one of the other shortstops in the last 40 years more than Neto.  Personally I think WAR has overvalued Neto in my opinion.  But thats my opinion which is why I would take Gagne over Neto and Guzman is close but I likely take Neto but its not a massive difference.  

Clemens is at least league average defensively at multiple positions.  IDK why he gets disrespected.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

7 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

Clemens is at least league average defensively at multiple positions.  IDK why he gets disrespected.

I like him but no one is trading a Jenkins or a Culpepper for him. It effectively proves my point on Neto. I’m putting Neto and Clemens at a similar offensive value. I’ve been Clemens biggest believer in last 18 months. 

[Major League Ready]

56 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

I like him but no one is trading a Jenkins or a Culpepper for him. It effectively proves my point on Neto. I’m putting Neto and Clemens at a similar offensive value. I’ve been Clemens biggest believer in last 18 months. 

Agreed.  My take on Clemmons is that we are in good shape if he plays a Willi Castro type of role, meaning the first guy off the bench.  A guy who can step right in and deliver above average offense and average defense is a valuable piece of a winning team.   Plus, he plays hard and he is pretty darn good in the clutch. 

[TNtwins85]

On 8/9/2026 at 5:12 PM, Hunter4848 said:

I understand everything about your statement. And I am calling you wrong...

Are you too obtuse to understand that?

I’m just flabbergasted at why you would trade a consensus top 10-15 prospect in MLB with 6 years of control and GG caliber defense in a corner and above average CF ability with a .838 OPS as a 21 year old in AAA for 4 years of a defensively challenged SS who averages almost a strikeout a game. Usually when you trade elite prospects you want elite talent back. Neto is not that guy. Besides the dingers he offers very little. Hence, unless you are a Neto caliber player away from competing for a World Series( which the Twins are not) you keep Jenkins. Especially when the ask began with Jenkins which meant you probably need more top 10 organizational prospects to get him. Which means the Angels didn’t really want to trade him and the Twins would’ve been dumb to sell the farm for a guy of Neto’s average talent. 
Not obtuse. Just wondering why you’re clutching to this stupid scenario so bad lol

[Riverbrian]

I don't understand why this discussion involves tearing down Neto or tearing down Jenkins. 

I'd have to believe that both Neto and Jenkins are expensive to acquire.

I'd would have loved to have added Neto to the team... However... there is no way I'd trade Jenkins for him. 

I think highly of both players. 

 

[tony&rodney]

9 hours ago, bean5302 said:

I haven't watched Neto which is why I defer to the the metrics.

I can understand why you or anyone does not have the time to watch minor league games or other MLB clubs. What is very difficult to understand is how a person can have such strong opinions or thoughts on those players they have never seen play. I once had someone tell me that they had watched a video on the internet about a country I had lived in for a number of years and that person was convinced they knew more about the country than they could ever learn living in the country or any knowledge that I had from my experiences.  I just listened and wondered how someone can come to those conclusions. Likewise, I'm confused about how one can know what some baseball player is capable of without actually seeing them play. In the amount of time spent looking at Twins Daily a person can watch a few games. Tune into the Angels games for the next week or better yet the next three weeks and you should have a better idea of how Zach Neto plays. Watch Walker Jenkins in action for the next two weeks, about 40+ plate appearances, and you might have a better idea of how he plays the game. The metrics are nonsense compared to actually watching.

[TNtwins85]

16 hours ago, Hunter4848 said:

Laugh all you want, but years of prospect hoarding has given Twins fans nothing to be excited for...

But I guess you can keep getting suckered by the Pohlads over and over again!

You’re missing everyone’s point guy. Everyone is making valid points about  the names involved, where this team is at and why you come to the point that in reality it never made any sense to trade for Neto. The Pohlads are not suckering anyone in terms of prospects. You don’t trade the highest rated prospect since Byron Buxton for Zach Neto. 

[ashbury]

3 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

Agreed.  My take on Clemmons

Because his kid's birth certificate seems to have it spelled the same way.  😁

 

/ #petpeeve

[twinstalker]

On 8/9/2026 at 9:19 AM, old nurse said:

The Twins were unlikely to include Jenkins, Quick, either of their top SS or catcher prospects in proposed trades. The rest of the controllable players and prospects would be up for grabs.  4 of them were not going to equal Neto

What catcher prospects?  You mean the ones they can't trade until the WS is over?

If the Twins let Houston or Culpepper get in the way of dealing for Neto, they're not very smart.  He's got three years after this of team control.

[tony&rodney]

18 minutes ago, twinstalker said:

What catcher prospects?  You mean the ones they can't trade until the WS is over?

If the Twins let Houston or Culpepper get in the way of dealing for Neto, they're not very smart.  He's got three years after this of team control.

Tait and Diaw are pretty good prospects. Diaw is looking pretty athletic behind the plate and has a good bat. Tait has real power but he is three years away.

Houston or Culpepper for Neto? I only have one question regarding that topic. Have you seen each of those three make at least a couple of dozen plays in the field and come to the plate in ten or more  games? If not, check them each out for several weeks and get back here. I'm watching the Angels right now.

[bean5302]

16 hours ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

His fielding even coming out of college was considered average at best.  Even if there is discrepancy in how being reviewed no one claims he is a high end defensive shortstop.   I have a co worker who says the best of Zach Neto is likely behind him even though he is 25.  He thinks his defense is average to below average.   He says he strikes out to much. I get the sense similar to Sano.  Also if his defensive is no longer adequate his offensive bat isn't going to be as valuable at 2nd or 3rd base.    His value is almost entirely created from his 20 home runs.  Its effectively Clemens.   

The issue is you created a time period and there is a reasonable conclusion someone could value one of the other shortstops in the last 40 years more than Neto.  Personally I think WAR has overvalued Neto in my opinion.  But thats my opinion which is why I would take Gagne over Neto and Guzman is close but I likely take Neto but its not a massive difference.  

Please stop digging. What you're posting is absolutely ludicrous at this point. How can you even write this stuff seriously?

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

8 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

Please stop digging. What you're posting is absolutely ludicrous at this point. How can you even write this stuff seriously?

He had a 50 grade in fielding the definition of average. There are statistics showing wide variance in his ability on defense. Considering I talk to an actual fan of the Angels who thinks he is overrated I don’t see where I’m exactly wrong. Don’t you agree his stats are pretty similar to Clemens? He also has a high SO rate that is increasing.  Those are facts. Nothing is ludicrous. If you are dismissing Gagne a 28 WAR player I could say the same about you. 

[bean5302]

Just now, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

He had a 50 grade in fielding the definition of average. There are statistics showing wide variance in his ability on defense. Considering I talk to an actual fan of the Angels who thinks he is overrated I don’t see where I’m exactly wrong. Don’t you agree his stats are pretty similar to Clemens? Those are facts. Nothing is ludicrous. If you are dismissing Gagne a 28 WAR player I could say the same about you. 

Your co-worker thinks.. scouting reports... Well wow, guess guys like Mookie Betts and Jose Ramirez are actually bad at baseball because their scouting reports. Next time I'm at a game where they're playing, I'll just hold the scouting reports up of guys and yell "scoreboard!"

So in a desperate Hail Mary! now I'm dismissing my favorite player on the Twins from the era? No, Neto's numbers (career wRC+ 107) are not similar to Kody Clemens (career wRC+ 89).

Like, dude. Welcome to the ignore list. Thanks for wasting my time.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

28 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

Your co-worker thinks.. scouting reports... Well wow, guess guys like Mookie Betts and Jose Ramirez are actually bad at baseball because their scouting reports. Next time I'm at a game where they're playing, I'll just hold the scouting reports up of guys and yell "scoreboard!"

So in a desperate Hail Mary! now I'm dismissing my favorite player on the Twins from the era? No, Neto's numbers (career wRC+ 107) are not similar to Kody Clemens (career wRC+ 89).

Like, dude. Welcome to the ignore list. Thanks for wasting my time.

Neto stats this year are a mere image of Clemens. With stats the most recent stats are meaningful than from several years ago. It that case we never give Clemens a chance because he could never improve. Thats your issue Clemens is improving and Neto is declining. Maybe it’s a 1 off. If that merits your ignore list you have some thin skin. 
 

My favorite players 

Puckett, Santana, Arraez, Herbek, Knoblauch and Dozier

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

30 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

Your co-worker thinks.. scouting reports... Well wow, guess guys like Mookie Betts and Jose Ramirez are actually bad at baseball because their scouting reports. Next time I'm at a game where they're playing, I'll just hold the scouting reports up of guys and yell "scoreboard!"

So in a desperate Hail Mary! now I'm dismissing my favorite player on the Twins from the era? No, Neto's numbers (career wRC+ 107) are not similar to Kody Clemens (career wRC+ 89).

Like, dude. Welcome to the ignore list. Thanks for wasting my time.

2026 

Neto OPS + 105

Clemens OPS + 108   

 

[tony&rodney]

4 hours ago, bean5302 said:

Next time I'm at a game where they're playing, I'll just hold the scouting reports up of guys and yell "scoreboard!"

I like the idea that you are going to games. That's a good thing. You have stated that you have never watched Zach Neto play. On other occasions you have admitted to never having seen a player, especially minor league prospects. I don't understand why you take these strong stands based on metrics and then turn around and ridicule another person who is doing the same thing, using stats. My only request is that people watch players before they take such a strong position on their play. I'm not talking down on anyone's opinions or thoughts but merely asking that folks watch the player a couple of dozen times before coming to a conclusion.