Twins 10, Guardians 6: Twins Bats Heat Up and Snap Four-Game Losing Streak

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 minute ago, chpettit19 said:

Yeah, I'm not saying he's having a bad year, but the question being discussed was essentially where his career goes from here. Your argument was that he's shown he can make adjustments. I'm just saying he hasn't actually made those adjustments. I won't claim he'll be out of baseball in a couple years (top 10 picks aren't tossed aside easily), but I also don't think he's really shown anything sustainable. RISP are incredibly volatile. 

From me watching games to me it appears he is more discerning.  I guess its not showing up.  Even still then it doesn't logically fit that he is swing more but has a higher walk rate.  I can't rationalize that.  Having a higher BB is an adjustment.  There is obviously something going on that is improving.    

[DJL44]

46 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

Again we have 12 outfielders that need AB's between here and St. Paul.  Who becomes the priority, the one that is almost 27 and has yet to make the most of his opportunities in the major leagues or do you give AB's to the younger players with more potential upside.

Roden was the highest performing outfielder in AAA. If the others want an opportunity they could try hitting better than Roden did in St Paul.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

19 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Yeah, I'm not saying he's having a bad year, but the question being discussed was essentially where his career goes from here. Your argument was that he's shown he can make adjustments. I'm just saying he hasn't actually made those adjustments. I won't claim he'll be out of baseball in a couple years (top 10 picks aren't tossed aside easily), but I also don't think he's really shown anything sustainable. RISP are incredibly volatile. 

So we are both right.  He is swinging a bit more - but pretty much similar.  He is hitting more line drives from the left side.  The biggest thing is from the right side he is letting more balls go by - balls and strikes  for what he doesn't think he can do damage on.  This has increased his walk rate from 3.6 to 7.2.   The biggest difference, is as a left handed hitter he is becoming a legit mlb hitter.  .270/.322/.484.  That will play anywhere.    

[HarmonK03]

3 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

Roden was the highest performing outfielder in AAA. If the others want an opportunity they could try hitting better than Roden did in St Paul.

If that is your standard then Fedko and Wallner have better averages and OPS numbers.  HR's and RBI's are about equal on a per game basis same as K's.  So then why aren't they up here.  And I am not advocating for them, but you have to perform when you get up here and Roden hasn't or has Wallner been able to do it consistently.

[chpettit19]

42 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

That is a fair comp with Larnach but the one difference is there was no one coming up behind Larnach to push him.  They could have easily taken ERod or Roden out of spring training as they both outplayed Outman. 

The point is how do you give him the runway currently, trade Larnach to play him, that to me is even more shortsighted.  Are you going to take AB's from Keaschall who has been hitting over .300 in the last month.  Trade  Bell and move Larnach to DH, not a fan of Bell but if they truly they are contenders then that is not a good move.  Don't forget he was given a month to establish himself and he didn't.  Again this trade didn't make sense with all the other similar players that are younger.  It feels like we are forcing him into the lineup because we traded for him.

Now if you trade both Larnach and Bell, I could see giving him some runway, but personally it would only be for the month of August.

I reject the idea that they "truly are contenders" so that plays no role in my thoughts at all. I wouldn't have had Larnach on my roster to start this year. Or Bell. I would've had Emma and Roden both on the opening day roster. 

I don't see them forcing him anywhere. That feels like an emotional reaction to the trade and not the reality. If they wanted to force an opportunity for him because they traded for him, he'd have been on the opening day roster. But he wasn't. And he's played recently because the starting CFer was on the IL. He's started 6 games for the Twins this year. If that's "forcing him into the lineup" I'd hate to see what he'd get normally.

But the idea that "he had a month to establish himself" is really what I'm contending against. It's a month. Making a decision on him in a month is bad roster management. I'd argue they put themselves in a bad situation by trying to "compete" this year when they had no real shot at it.

[DJL44]

4 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

If that is your standard then Fedko and Wallner have better averages and OPS numbers.  HR's and RBI's are about equal on a per game basis same as K's.  So then why aren't they up here.  And I am not advocating for them, but you have to perform when you get up here and Roden hasn't or has Wallner been able to do it consistently.

Fedko got the first shot and struck out in half his at-bats. He will get another opportunity.
 

Wallner is a DH. Defense matters.

[LA Vikes Fan]

12 hours ago, Danchat said:

Notably, Travis Adams has gone 8 scoreless innings in a row... I'm glad they haven't given up on the kid. He's the type of guy to gives chances to, not a DFA pickup.

Also, I feel like Roden deserves some credit for putting the ball in play even if the opposing team flubbed it up, even though it counts against his batting average that's better than striking out.

I have to admit I may have been wrong on Adams. I'm one of the guys writing here that he should back to AAA for frankly any new shiny object that we pick up. I don't get it, but he's been very effective the last month or so. That's great to see because we need it. 

[HarmonK03]

Just now, DJL44 said:

Fedko got the first shot and struck out in half his at-bats. He will get another opportunity.
 

Wallner is a DH. Defense matters.

Fedko was not given an opportunity, he sat for 12 days without an AB.  But again I am not advocating for either of them,  You were using minor league stats as your criteria, and I was responding to that.  And as you already pointed out, there are other factors, and at some point Roden's lack of productivity at the majors needs to be taken into account.

[Danchat]

3 hours ago, big dog said:

Putting on my Travis Adams Skeptic hat...

8 IP, 0 runs    ERA = 0.00  that's good

5 H, 6 BB, 5 K   WHIP = 1.375, K/BB = 0.83, K/9 = 0.625  that's less good

I'm still not convinced, but he had a good outing last night (against a team without much offense).

It's 3 BBs in that 8 inning stretch, not 6.

[LA Vikes Fan]

53 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

I am looking at the big picture, and starting his development in the big leagues is better than waiting until later next year or 2028.  Assuming the whole year is cancelled is not where I am at.  There may be games cancelled but there is too much money at stake that there will be a season even if it is shortened.  And then everyone will say why bring him up for a shortened season.  Sitting for two months I think is negated by him being up here and starting his development to know what he needs to work on.

Got to go with you on this one. Keeping a guy like Jenkins down for fear of losing a year of control because the entire next season is lost due to a work stoppage seems like prioritizing the risk of loss over the possibility of gain to an extreme. I also think the chances of losing all of the 2027 season is pretty remote. I think it's much more likely that the parties reach a deal on a timeframe that shortens spring training and/or we may lose a few games. The economics of losing an entire season so that the owners can try to impose a hard salary cap just doesn't make much economic sense to me, even from the owners perspective.

I'm hoping to see Jenkins on the big club shortly after the trade deadline. I did see a comment from someone else that if we wait until August 14 he keeps his rookie status for 2027. That means that if he is rookie of the year in 2027 we get the extra draft choice. Again, that seems like stretching for an unlikely result but I could see waiting until mid August. I'm hoping he is up and playing by then, either because we trade Larnach or Roden, demote Roden or Martin, or the most likely result, someone gets injured

 

[USAFChief]

3 hours ago, bean5302 said:

Lee will be out of baseball in a couple years. 

I got the over.

What's the wager?