Is There Still Room For a Right-Handed Outfielder After the Carlos Santana Signing?

[Major League Ready]

9 hours ago, Paul D said:

The answer has to be yes.  Gordon provided versatility in 2022 and Castro in 2023, but you don't need both of them in 2024.  There are 4 bench position players on most teams.  You should have a 2nd catcher, an infielder who can play multiple positions, an outfielder who can play multiple positions (especially CF), and a guy who can come off the bench and hit.  If Gordon and Castro are on the team you don't have the hitter sitting on the bench. 

I'd love to have Duvall to fill that spot.

I really liked the idea of Duvall until I looked at his splits.  His career splits are almost dead even and he has been almost exactly average from both sides of the plate.   Last year he only had a .91 wRC+ against LHP but did very well against RHP with a .124 wRC+.   I think someone with strong LHP splits is a better fit although Duvall could backup Buxton.  My preference would be to roll with Martin given Duvall's splits and fringy defense in center.

[Jeff K]

17 hours ago, Otwins said:

The question I have is if the court approves the television broadcast rights agreement next Friday will the team have additional money to spend. Seems like they should. I would go for Taylor. Centerfield insurance and hits lefties. 

This really is the biggest question.  Depending on how much they get, perhaps the Twins could reopen their wallets and make a splash on a starting pitcher.  I get that this is unlikely.  What is more likely is a move at the trade deadline.

[chpettit19]

12 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

You are probably right about only wanting one-year contracts which explains these moves.  They will probably have close to $30M in increases next year between Lopez, Paddack, and arbitration increases.  However, they have 28.625M coming off next year between Kepler / Farmer / Thielbar and DeSclafani.  It seems like they could make it work if they thought he was a difference maker.

You know I'm all for the payroll going up. I just don't expect it. My guess is only small moves from here on out, but my hope is a difference maker. They've surprised me before so we'll see.

[chpettit19]

10 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

They are already in a spot where they probably need to do something with Gordon so they have some of the flexibility they love so much.  Part of signing another bat is the 26 man spot that puts a real crimp on how that can rotate the kids through.

If you are going to kill a spot that can be rotated with options, it has to be a Soler or better to make the jam worth it. 

My guess is their plan is to give Gordon run early to see what he can do. I don't think they care as much about option flexibility as they do depth. Since he's cheap I'd guess they're more open to moving on from him early. Wouldn't surprise me to see him moved during the spring, maybe even as opening day approaches depending on how everyone has played and what other team's needs are.

Totally on board with the idea that the 26th guy, 13th hitter really, should be someone with options or a difference maker. Mostly because I don't see any other hitters they're likely to move on from with a DFA. Unless Castro is someone they're willing to bounce back and forth if he struggles early. Santana and Farmer aren't getting cut would be my guess. I hope they haven't shut the door on adding a legit heart of the order bat, but my guess is we're looking at more or less the start of st roster.

[Major League Ready]

Right now the bench is Vazquez / Castro / Farmer and Santana with one spot remaining to be determined.  This assumes Kirilloff is good to go.  I could see Gordon being that last guy if he is not traded soon.  He has some positional flexibility and if nothing else they could build his value for a future trade.  Give him a couple months and move on if necessary.  Soler would look better for the last spot.

[JD-TWINS]

22 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

He was down a bit last year but still career .825 OPS against lefties.  The defense is good enough for 30 spot starts in left against lefties.  He's going to catch what he gets to, be in the right place and throw to the correct base.  They will have to keep him around as everyone's backup but he's to good a bat to just sit and wait.  

I still think Miranda can play good enough defense in left if he's hitting.  Play deep, get it back in.  We would all stomach Soler out there but he would hit much higher than the cut off line.  It's the one position where defense is meh. 

Why would anyone think, based on history, that Miranda can play LF? Never heard that until today.

Farmer is slated to play 30 - 40 spot starts v. lefties at 2B - right? Julien can’t play 162 & he’s not very proficient hitting LH pitching at this point. Thought that was a done deal with everyone.

Soler is below average OF - wants 3 years - probably close to $17M/year - not a realistic fit.

Ultimately, maybe by August 1, I’d like to see Lewis in LF (solves the yearning here for a big RH bat in our outfield) ……….Max traded as part of a deal for an arm………Wallner in RF …………Lee at 3B.

Lee - CC - Julien - Kirilloff (Farmer/Santana)

Lewis - Buxton/Castro - Wallner (Gordon? Martin? Larnach? - sign Duvall?)

Seems Duvall has the salary ask that may make sense ($9M - 1 year) his health is sketchy but could be supplemented on roster by Martin.

[JD-TWINS]

1 hour ago, Major League Ready said:

Right now the bench is Vazquez / Castro / Farmer and Santana with one spot remaining to be determined.  This assumes Kirilloff is good to go.  I could see Gordon being that last guy if he is not traded soon.  He has some positional flexibility and if nothing else they could build his value for a future trade.  Give him a couple months and move on if necessary.  Soler would look better for the last spot.

Was (am) with you on Gordon…,,,Soler, not so much. He eliminates any chance of a pitching addition at $17M & 3 years, and he’s subpar defensively. Buxton has to DH the majority of his starts, even though everyone seems to be fantasizing that he’s the everyday CF for 130 games……..about a 2% chance of that happening. With his history, Buxton has about a 15% chance to appear in 100 games - including DH.

[Greggory Masterson]

7 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

Why would anyone think, based on history, that Miranda can play LF? Never heard that until today.

In fairness, during his breakout 2021 in the minors, they did run him out in left field and abandoned it very quickly

[Jocko87]

56 minutes ago, Greggory Masterson said:

In fairness, during his breakout 2021 in the minors, they did run him out in left field and abandoned it very quickly

I've been trying to speak it back into existence ever since! 😂

To be clear, I mean play left field in the hang out by the fence and throw the ball to Correa if it comes to you kind of defense.  Kinda like Soler.

Where else is he going to play? 

[Major League Ready]

1 hour ago, JD-TWINS said:

Was (am) with you on Gordon…,,,Soler, not so much. He eliminates any chance of a pitching addition at $17M & 3 years, and he’s subpar defensively. Buxton has to DH the majority of his starts, even though everyone seems to be fantasizing that he’s the everyday CF for 130 games……..about a 2% chance of that happening. With his history, Buxton has about a 15% chance to appear in 100 games - including DH.

I too would take a pitching addition above Soler but the difference makers are Montgomery and Snell and that seems highly unlikely.  I also don't think Soler is getting $17M AAV but it could happen.

[saviking]

On 2/3/2024 at 11:36 AM, DocBauer said:

Payroll should be sitting around $120-123M right now as it was listed around $155-118M after the Polanco deal and the $ coming back.

There is roster room, and I'd like to think financial room, for a Taylor 1yr deal/reunion, or grab a more powerful bat like Duvall or Pham. It would push the Twins to $130M-ish. That should be affordable from just about every opinion/speculation I've heard/read.

Do they look harder at CF in Taylor? Or more power and offense from someone like Duvall or Pham?

Soler might be too expensive, even if he has to settle for 2yrs and $26 instead of the 3yrs and $45M he reportedly wanted or was expected to sign for.

Almost exactly 2 weeks until ST starts and these guys...and others...are still sitting and waiting. So patience might just let the Twins add that last/extra bat while still keeping the payroll in that $130M ish range.

I would probably go with Taylor, as I have little confidence Buxton will log major innings in centerfield. Taylor's defense is superb, whether in center or the corners, and he is a right-handed hitter with some pop.  My wish then would be for Buxton to prove me wrong and Taylor not to log many innings over the course of the year. The big plus is that he would make an excellent pinch runner in the late innings.. and he's a known commodity in the dugout. I believe the other players like him alot.

[Jocko87]

17 minutes ago, Jocko87 said:

I've been trying to speak it back into existence ever since! 😂

To be clear, I mean play left field in the hang out by the fence and throw the ball to Correa if it comes to you kind of defense.  Kinda like Soler.

Where else is he going to play? 

This also includes the days Correa is DH'ing. He'll figure it out.

The RH outfield bat is coming from inside the house.

[JD-TWINS]

27 minutes ago, Jocko87 said:

I've been trying to speak it back into existence ever since! 😂

To be clear, I mean play left field in the hang out by the fence and throw the ball to Correa if it comes to you kind of defense.  Kinda like Soler.

Where else is he going to play? 

He isn’t going to play - unless there’s injury - he may play somewhere else? Santana & Kirilloff are cemented at 1B in ‘24. Miranda is in AAA until he shows all he can produce with the bat.

Soler may hit 35 HR’s playing bad defense - Miranda is a total crapshoot at this point. His “solid” 2022 was 15 HR in 444 AB’s - good doubles production at 25. .751 OPS. 114OPS+.

In ‘23 Soler hit 36 HR in 505 AB’s. .853 OPS. 128 OPS+. I get you aren’t saying Miranda is Soler but they hid Soler at DH quite a bit as well……..gotta really produce if you’re going to give up hits/bases playing LF.

[Major League Ready]

43 minutes ago, Jocko87 said:

This also includes the days Correa is DH'ing. He'll figure it out.

The RH outfield bat is coming from inside the house.

Anyone besides Martin included in the candidates?  Prato player some LF.  He might be a sleeper.

[Jocko87]

13 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

He isn’t going to play - unless there’s injury - he may play somewhere else? Santana & Kirilloff are cemented at 1B in ‘24. Miranda is in AAA until he shows all he can produce with the bat.

Soler may hit 35 HR’s playing bad defense - Miranda is a total crapshoot at this point. His “solid” 2022 was 15 HR in 444 AB’s - good doubles production at 25. .751 OPS. 114OPS+.

In ‘23 Soler hit 36 HR in 505 AB’s. .853 OPS. 128 OPS+. I get you aren’t saying Miranda is Soler but they hid Soler at DH quite a bit as well……..gotta really produce if you’re going to give up hits/bases playing LF.

He has to hit like 2021 Miranda for anything to matter.  He's even a tough trade chip if he's not hitting.

Soler is the type of outfield bat we would want, but he doesn't have options and significantly clogs roster movement.  Quite suddenly, all the guys with options are guys that aren't going anywhere.  Castro is the only bench player with options and he's unlikely to move unless he slumps like crazy.  I'm a huge proponent of the idea that these clogs work themselves out in time but setting the roster up with no flexibility really hurts the clog working itself out.

The hard truth is that the RH outfield thump has to come from Buxton.  All other options are different type hitters, unless Miranda comes to life.  Farmer is the other outfield option I'm trying to manifest.  He would be decent enough in left to be an option after Lee comes up. 

So if I'm convinced the RH left fielder is currently in the organization, who is the most likely?  Castro and Martin, probably.  Bubba will get more run than we like.  Micheal Helman is a dark horse.  Of these options, both Miranda and Farmer would hit lefties better and are on the 40 man. 

5 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

Anyone besides Martin included in the candidates?  Prato player some LF.  He might be a sleeper.

Prato was one I didn't think of.  There are options and clogging the 26 man is a tough place to be with so many kids running around.

[JD-TWINS]

5 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

I too would take a pitching addition above Soler but the difference makers are Montgomery and Snell and that seems highly unlikely.  I also don't think Soler is getting $17M AAV but it could happen.

He opted out of a $13M contract so my assumption is $3-$4M increase in HIS mind anyway…….he’d be a nice bat pick-up but I think he’d be squeezing time in with Buxton at DH - Twins don’t seem to like poor OF play - 36 HR per (505 AB’s) year may change their mind?

Duvall hit 21 HR in 330 AB’s/92 games…….that works for me with the flexibility to play any of the 3 OF positions……..$9M seems to be a reasonable offer.

[stringer bell]

Add Michael A Taylor for somewhere between $6M and $8M and call it a day. Using Taylor in center when Buxton is unavailable and in left vs. lefties would enhance the offense enough to justify the price tag. I think that the Twins are only going to acquire another starting pitcher by trading prospects from their farm system, which IMHO limits the choices to non-contenders. 

Pitchers are too darned volatile to rigidly class as #1, #2 etc. Who had Nathan Eovoldi as the ace that put Texas over the top? Sonny Gray was great in 2023, but will he be near as good in 2024? We've had surprise Cy Young winners almost as often as not. The true aces are few and far between and most likely all going into the Hall of Fame. Kershaw, Scherzer and Verlander in the last generation. Cole and Wheeler probably today. It wouldn't surprise me if a year from now Luzardo was considered an ace, but it wouldn't surprise me if he moved back down lists where he became available and affordable. I have a hard time thinking the Twins should throw money at Montgomery and/or Snell. 

[LA Vikes Fan]

Assuming we can't or don't get a SP, I'm with Stringer - pay MAT $6-8m, trade Gordon for an A ball lottery ticket or two, and be done. MAT provides excellent CF defense and can play every day if (when) Buxton winds up hurt or only able to DH. IF Buxton can give us 100 games in CF, that still leaves 62 for Taylor. It's probably more of an 80 game need or even more. Taylor can also play LF against LH pitching, play late inning defense, and pinch run. Duvall is old, a lousy CF, and strikes out 30% plus of the time. Soler is too expensive and can't play defense at all. Pham is older, not much of a CF, and not someone to mess with in your fantasy league. Martin isn't yet ready and there will be an injury opened spot by mid-season if he's ready then. Same for Keirsey. Taylor can give us what we need on a 1 year deal, do it if we can.