Twins Hire Jayce Tingler as new Bench Coach

[Sousy]

This is interesting.  Certainly a big name - I'm not sure what to think at this point.

[dex8425]

Wow that's big news. 

[Otto von Ballpark]

From his Wikipedia page:

In August 2020, Tingler publicly criticized one of his players, Fernando Tatís Jr., who was accused of breaking an "unwritten rule of baseball" by hitting a grand slam on a 3–0 pitch while the Padres were leading the Texas Rangers 10–3 in the top of the eighth inning. Tingler argued that Tatís shouldn't have swung at the pitch.

 

[Otto von Ballpark]

Also according to Wikipedia, Tingler speaks Spanish.

Tingler was in the Rangers organization as a coach while Thad Levine was there.

[Brock Beauchamp]

1 hour ago, Otto von Ballpark said:

From his Wikipedia page:

In August 2020, Tingler publicly criticized one of his players, Fernando Tatís Jr., who was accused of breaking an "unwritten rule of baseball" by hitting a grand slam on a 3–0 pitch while the Padres were leading the Texas Rangers 10–3 in the top of the eighth inning. Tingler argued that Tatís shouldn't have swung at the pitch.

Going from hazy recollection but I believe he later backed down from that (frankly idiotic) position.

[Cap'n Piranha]

23 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Going from hazy recollection but I believe he later backed down from that (frankly idiotic) position.

Thank goodness.  I was about to have to oppose this hiring on those grounds alone.

[Otto von Ballpark]

25 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Going from hazy recollection but I believe he later backed down from that (frankly idiotic) position.

You are correct. A San Diego columnist recapped a quote from Tingler immediately after the game, and then another updated take from Tingler the following day:

Late Monday: “Just so you know, a lot of our guys have green light 3-0,” Tingler said. “But in this game in particular, we had a little bit of a comfortable lead. We’re not trying to run up the score or anything like that.”

Early Tuesday: “They’re trying to kick our ass, and we’re trying to kick their ass and win. That’s the bottom line. We can’t sit here and worry about people’s feelings.”

[Otto von Ballpark]

Of course, if Tingler really does favor the 3-0 green light now, does that put him at odds with our top reliever Willians Astudillo?

 

[ashbury]

1 hour ago, Otto von Ballpark said:

You are correct. A San Diego columnist recapped a quote from Tingler immediately after the game, and then another updated take from Tingler the following day:

Late Monday: “Just so you know, a lot of our guys have green light 3-0,” Tingler said. “But in this game in particular, we had a little bit of a comfortable lead. We’re not trying to run up the score or anything like that.”

Early Tuesday: “They’re trying to kick our ass, and we’re trying to kick their ass and win. That’s the bottom line. We can’t sit here and worry about people’s feelings.”

Taking a position and then backing down isn't a good look. He's young, and hopefully has the capacity to learn from the incident.  It's not so much the position itself that's the issue.  Leadership is tricky.

[Mike Sixel]

59 minutes ago, ashbury said:

Taking a position and then backing down isn't a good look. He's young, and hopefully has the capacity to learn from the incident.  It's not so much the position itself that's the issue.  Leadership is tricky.

Changing your mind is learning. We seem to be taking the opposite data from this.

For anyone that thinks they have any idea how good a bench coach he is, I'd like your info! What do you know?

[ashbury]

2 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

What do you know?

Everything!  C'mon. 

We're all getting our info from the same few sources.  There's room for differing takes.

[Brock Beauchamp]

3 hours ago, ashbury said:

Taking a position and then backing down isn't a good look. He's young, and hopefully has the capacity to learn from the incident.  It's not so much the position itself that's the issue.  Leadership is tricky.

I find the original position the biggest problem, as it spoke to being out of touch with the modern game and its players. Backing down from that stance is a good sign, IMO, or at least better than sticking to it to the detriment of his relationship to his own players.

[ashbury]

1 hour ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

I find the original position the biggest problem, as it spoke to being out of touch with the modern game and its players. Backing down from that stance is a good sign, IMO, or at least better than sticking to it to the detriment of his relationship to his own players.

He's younger than you, Brock, I think.  "Out of touch" and "modern game" is coded language reserved to be applied to geezers like me.    Jayce simply subscribes to a certain set of in-game standards, and I'd prefer to leave it at that rather than relitigate the old "Unwritten Rules" debate of past years - there are players and field personnel of any era who see things through different lenses. I'll agree the position he had staked out was untenable, at least given his roster (and that might be true for a majority of teams, I don't know), and apparently he quickly came to realize that.  But the way he completely reversed course, with his second day's statement being as though spoken by a different human being than the first, came across as so phony as to surely earn him no points from the people he originally disagreed with, and must have seemed weak to those who may have still supported him.

None of this says he's a bad hire.  He's young and presumably will learn from the incident.  Now, if I were to converse with him over beers and learn he would do nothing different in that episode, given the chance, then my opinion would shift.

[Brock Beauchamp]

3 minutes ago, ashbury said:

He's younger than you, Brock, I think.  "Out of touch" and "modern game" is coded language reserved to be applied geezers like me.    Jayce simply subscribes to a certain set of in-game standards, and I'd prefer to leave it at that rather than relitigate the old "Unwritten Rules" debate of past years - there are players and field personnel of any era who see things through different lenses.

Sure, but he was the manager of MLB players making literally hundreds of millions of dollars. Unlike most jobs where management generally points downward, professional sports puts the money and (most of) the power in the hands of the players, not management.

And given how so players seemed to generally react to him taking a shot at his own player, it wasn't a good look and I hope his reversal was based in the fact he knew he was just wrong*.

*it should be noted that at the time of the incident, Jayce was a very young MLB manager who hadn't spent much time running a MLB club

[Otto von Ballpark]

I got the impression that Tingler was in tough spot in San Diego -- an inexperienced manager put at the helm of a team looking to make a splash, stuck between a strong-willed front office and some big-name players. I wonder if he was trying to assert his authority with his initial take on the 3-0 "unwritten rules."

[LVTwinsfan]

7 hours ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

Thank goodness.  I was about to have to oppose this hiring on those grounds alone.

Answering an extreme position with an equally extreme position

[Danchat]

Interesting hire... I see Tingler was the runner up for Manager of the Year in the 2020 short season, yet his 2021 squad underperformed so badly that he got fired in just his second year on the job. I can't say I like the hire, but it is a bench coach and likely not of much significance.

[tony&rodney]

3 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Sure, but he was the manager of MLB players making literally hundreds of millions of dollars. Unlike most jobs where management generally points downward, professional sports puts the money and (most of) the power in the hands of the players, not management.

This is exactly correct. Those who produce (the workers) gain the rewards, not management. Marx would be proud.

JK. The owners hold the reins (money purse) in baseball but Brock is correct that management ranks below the players. Falvey does not earn a salary near what Buxton or Sano make and the dugout managers and coaches are well below the players in salary. How many TD readers have worked at jobs where those who produce make more than management?

Tingler had connections through his time in Texas. I hope he is welcomed by the players. I found Buster Posey's retirement press conference interesting as he explained the trust and connection between the players and coaches, especially the very young first year coaches the Giants hired this year.

[Brock Beauchamp]

9 hours ago, Danchat said:

Interesting hire... I see Tingler was the runner up for Manager of the Year in the 2020 short season, yet his 2021 squad underperformed so badly that he got fired in just his second year on the job. I can't say I like the hire, but it is a bench coach and likely not of much significance.

The Padres were ravaged by injury in 2021, I’m willing to just write off the season and move on.

Tingler’s firing felt a lot like the higher ups needed a scapegoat and he was the easiest choice. Like all coaching hires, I think their past performance is really hard to gauge but I’m not going to put a lot of stock into his sudden firing, either. 

[TopGunn#22]

To me, this sends another, more subtle message.  Tingler could be a "Manager in Waiting" if Rocco doesn't turn the ship around in the near future.

[Cap'n Piranha]

20 hours ago, ashbury said:

Taking a position and then backing down isn't a good look. He's young, and hopefully has the capacity to learn from the incident.  It's not so much the position itself that's the issue.  Leadership is tricky.

Definitely agree with this.  It's why I'm thankful that here in the US women aren't allowed to vote, and we count black people as 2/3 of a person when determining representation.  Backing down from those positions would have shown a real lack of leadership from our country.

[Cap'n Piranha]

15 hours ago, LVTwinsfan said:

Answering an extreme position with an equally extreme position

ex·ag·ger·ate

/iɡˈzajəˌrāt/

Learn to pronounce

 

verb

verb: exaggerate; 3rd person present: exaggerates; past tense: exaggerated; past participle: exaggerated; gerund or present participle: exaggerating

1. represent (something) as being larger, better, or worse than it really is.

   "he was apt to exaggerate any aches and pains"

[ashbury]

39 minutes ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

Definitely agree with this.  It's why I'm thankful that here in the US women aren't allowed to vote, and we count black people as 2/3 of a person when determining representation.  Backing down from those positions would have shown a real lack of leadership from our country.

If the framers of the US constitution had voted the necessary amendments 24 hours after ratification, I might see some validity to the analogy.

[Cap'n Piranha]

1 hour ago, ashbury said:

If the framers of the US constitution had voted the necessary amendments 24 hours after ratification, I might see some validity to the analogy.

Fair point.