The Five Most Underrated Players in Twins History

[Twodogs]

Not many pitchers mentioned on here, but one that comes to mind for me is Kyle Lohse; he probably had a better career away from Minnesota than with Minnesota. But he just seemed to keep pitching forever and was always decent. Had some good seasons for St Louis and Milwaukee.

[Twodogs]

I think that Brian Harper was under rated

Harper was a good hitter, but I think his shortcomings came on defense. A lot of guys in the TK era suffered due to their mediocre defense. David Ortiz comes to mind. Was gotten rid of for Dougie baseball. It was a different era back then.

[Nine of twelve]

 

Bob Allison comes to mind for me. 31.1 fWAR as a Twin (removing all the Senators seasons, though I'm fine including them) with a terrific run in the prime of his career. Feels like he's become the forgotten man from those great Twins clubs in the 60's. Heck of a player, a big thumper in the middle of the lineup.

Bob Allison was my mom's favorite Twin in the '60's, but I think it was for reasons other than his baseball talent.

[Nine of twelve]

My comment on Mauer: I don't know if he would have made my list or not but I think it's appropriate to consider him underrated because there are so many people who, for lack of a better way to say it, hated on him for many years. He was a very good catcher, maybe not the best at preventing WP's or PB's but an he had an outstanding arm. He also seemed to have a reputation within the baseball community of being very good at working with pitchers. That skill, getting the most out of your pitcher, is almost impossible to measure statistically but is probably the most important part of a catcher's job.

And in 2009 he was the best baseball player in the world.

[jkcarew]

 

I am sure someone can go into specific details, but that is not how I remember it. I don't remember the Twins letting him go. I remember him going to Japan because of the strike. And that killed me.

You're right in that Mack became a free agent at the exact wrong time....and I should have mentioned that. It's entirely possible that Mack simply decided he couldn't wait for the strike to end (couldn't take the chance it would carry through the following year)...and signed with a Japanese team.

[Halsey Hall]

David Ortiz, so under appreciated he left..

[#1ShaneMackFan]

 

You're right in that Mack became a free agent at the exact wrong time....and I should have mentioned that. It's entirely possible that Mack simply decided he couldn't wait for the strike to end (couldn't take the chance it would carry through the following year)...and signed with a Japanese team.

That's how I remember it. 

[Dantes929]

 

You're right in that Mack became a free agent at the exact wrong time....and I should have mentioned that. It's entirely possible that Mack simply decided he couldn't wait for the strike to end (couldn't take the chance it would carry through the following year)...and signed with a Japanese team.

Below is a link to the cluster that ended with Mack leaving.   He was not a platoon player.   I believe he got hurt during 1993 and also missed the first 30 games in 1994.   He was having a monster year before the strike was called.    Mack was 2nd in WAR in 1991 only to Tapani.    He was 2nd only to Puckett in 1992 and he was 2nd only to Knoblach in 1994 and only because he played 28 fewer games.   He was on pace for a 7.8 WAR over 162 games.  Keep in mind those teams had Knoblach, Puckett, Hrbek, etc.  Yes, he did mash left handed hitting but he was good against righties also.

 https://www.twinkietown.com/2017/5/11/15626864/how-the-twins-lost-shane-mack

[Twodogs]

Below is a link to the cluster that ended with Mack leaving. He was not a platoon player. I believe he got hurt during 1993 and also missed the fir

 

st 30 games in 1994. He was having a monster year before the strike was called. Mack was 2nd in WAR in 1991 only to Tapani. He was 2nd only to Puckett in 1992 and he was 2nd only to Knoblach in 1994 and only because he played 28 fewer games. He was on pace for a 7.8 WAR over 162 games. Keep in mind those teams had Knoblach, Puckett, Hrbek, etc. Yes, he did mash left handed hitting but he was good against righties also.

https://www.twinkietown.com/2017/5/11/15626864/how-the-twins-lost-shane-mack

Just looked Mack's Japan stats and they looked almost the same as him MLB stats, when he came back with Boston and KC it seemed as though his production was still pretty good but never seemed to get a fair shot at playing time?

[Dantes929]

 

Just looked Mack's Japan stats and they looked almost the same as him MLB stats, when he came back with Boston and KC it seemed as though his production was still pretty good but never seemed to get a fair shot at playing time?

I'm just guessing injuries were part of it.   

[Twodogs]

I think Kaat was probably appreciated in his time. I just don't know if he is remembered in the same vein. For second highest fWAR he just is never talked about much on these boards. Carew, Killebrew, Allison, Oliva and yes, even Tovar are brought up way more often.

I think the big difference between all of those guys and Kaat is that everyone of those other guys are everyday players. Not many pitchers have been brought up at all, especially ones from back in the 60's and 70's

[Twodogs]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/571110-minnesota-twins-all-time-top-20-starting-pitchers.amp.html

 

 

This article is almost 10 years old, but dang, the Twins havent had many real good pitchers in their existence. They have probably had a few 1 - 2 year guys like Morris, Smiley, Koosman, etc... But to see some of those names in the top 20??? Granted Berrios will knock a few of them out, but still.

[Dantes929]

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/571110-minnesota-twins-all-time-top-20-starting-pitchers.amp.html


This article is almost 10 years old, but dang, the Twins havent had many real good pitchers in their existence. They have probably had a few 1 - 2 year guys like Morris, Smiley, Koosman, etc... But to see some of those names in the top 20??? Granted Berrios will knock a few of them out, but still.

Interesting that Liriano wasn't on the list.   Hard to determine from that list how much longevity is valued.  Think about it though.   Aside from the Yankees, the Red Sox the Dodgers and Cardinals how many other teams would have Santana ranked 5th and Viola 8th.   How many other teams could you name 10 great pitchers?   5?

[Twodogs]

Interesting that Liriano wasn't on the list. Hard to determine from that list how much longevity is valued. Think about it though. Aside from the Yankees, the Red Sox the Dodgers and Cardinals how many other teams would have Santana ranked 5th and Viola 8th. How many other teams could you name 10 great pitchers? 5?

Yeah Liriano should have been ahead a couple of those guys? It said I think they needed 4 years with the Twins, I'm assuming Liriano had that much.

[R B TATE]

Mauer was certainly one of the best Twin's players ever, but hardly the underrated type. For an underrated player, I'd have to go with another catcher, Earl Battey.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Something I noticed about Mauer awhile back to illustrate just how much his career was altered by the concussion:

 

After the concussion, he played 660 games for a .746 OPS and accumulated 10.7 rWAR.

 

In 2013-14 after "bilateral leg weakness", he played 260 games for an .870 OPS and accumulated 10.0 rWAR.

 

It's hard to call Mauer underrated and maybe he isn't outside Minnesota... but he is the best Twin to don a uniform since possibly Carew, maybe Puckett depending how you frame your opinion. He is a top ten catcher in history through his prime years and then he took a shot to the head and it all went to hell. But for those 7-8 years, he was as good as it gets behind the plate.

[theBOMisthebomb]

Interesting that Liriano wasn't on the list.   Hard to determine from that list how much longevity is valued.  Think about it though.   Aside from the Yankees, the Red Sox the Dodgers and Cardinals how many other teams would have Santana ranked 5th and Viola 8th.   How many other teams could you name 10 great pitchers?   5?

Well, #s 20-11 are rather uninspiring. The top 10 isn't terrible. My favorite is the end quote to the article, "With his induction into the Hall of Fame, Blyleven is the only pitcher in the ranking to be inducted—yet.

Who knows, someday Scott Baker could end up joining him."

[ashbury]

Who knows, someday Scott Baker could end up joining him."

Thought this was snark, then went back and checked the source of the comment and it dated back to 2011.

 

[Twodogs]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/803283-new-york-mets-top-20-starting-pitchers-in-team-history-no-20-11#slide10

 

The numbers 20 - 11 of the New York Mets have a few interesting names.

[Twodogs]

Michael Cuddyer is another guy who played very well at multiple positions for a number of years.